wet sand single stage acrylic urethane

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Clear coat base coat VS. single stage polyurethane are different animals and the color coat is easier to discolor in way less time! The main thing is to keep moving and if you have to experiment do it in a spot that is less likely to be seen!
Single stage,non metallic paints: The pigments appear on the top,giving it wet look... The newer single stage urethanes,add more clear ,and a binder to balance to flow better...If you can actually shoot paint, you don't really need a BC/CC,on a solid color.. Not arguing with you Tuner,just sharing my experiences as a hobbyist painter,and paint mixer/salesman....
 
The buffer I got from Princess Auto was a "Powerfist" brand. This year alone, I've polished a half dozen family vehicles, my wife's new RAM, a cut and buff on my '69 Cuda, and it hasn't missed a beat. Over the last 7-8 years I may have polished 3 or 4 dozen cars , most were a cut and buff, with out a problem. I don't remember what I had before the Powerfist buffer but it was a cheap one and lasted quite a while.

I just checked the Princess Auto price and the buffer is now $119.00 CDN which equates to $83.00 US and they regularly have sales which will bring the price down even further.

I've never used a WEN buffer so I don't have an opinion. If you use a buffer for your daily job then I agree, buy a good quality buffer. Thankfully I've only needed a buffer for my hobby.
 
Single stage,non metallic paints: The pigments appear on the top,giving it wet look... The newer single stage urethanes,add more clear ,and a binder to balance to flow better...If you can actually shoot paint, you don't really need a BC/CC,on a solid color.. Not arguing with you Tuner,just sharing my experiences as a hobbyist painter,and paint mixer/salesman....
Somebody else mentioned clear coat and burning through it and I was just pointing out that "single stage" does not have a clear coat to burn through, you are actually on the pigment which does discolor more rapidly under a buffer.
 
I have heard of people mixing some clear with non metallic urethane. wonder how this works, or what you get exactly?
It works well if you're using a brand of paint that has compatible clear. The info is usually in the tech sheets for that brand.
 
By adding clear coat to the color coat you are reducing the hiding quality. You could run into a issues with `see through`.

By adding a clear with a different resin system or coating over the color coat you run the risk of delamination (splitting or peeling). One resin system works against the other. It`s called surface tension.
 
By adding clear coat to the color coat you are reducing the hiding quality. You could run into a issues with `see through`.

By adding a clear with a different resin system or coating over the color coat you run the risk of delamination (splitting or peeling). One resin system works against the other. It`s called surface tension.
So why does this eventually occur on all factory vehicles with clear coat that get sunlight on them?
I'd hope the manufacturers are using compatible coatings, but I see these peely cars everywhere.
It's crazy to think avoiding this means having to cover a vehicle from sunlight every time you park it.
And I don't even live in the great hot southwest, it must be a really bad problem there.
 
So why does this eventually occur on all factory vehicles with clear coat that get sunlight on them?
I'd hope the manufacturers are using compatible coatings, but I see these peely cars everywhere.
It's crazy to think avoiding this means having to cover a vehicle from sunlight every time you park it.
And I don't even live in the great hot southwest, it must be a really bad problem there.

yes. I admit my 95 ram is not new! it is white. good thing the paint only peels off the bed not the whole truck!!!! ha
I guess I will stick with the plain old acrylic urethane, period!!! ha
 
So why does this eventually occur on all factory vehicles with clear coat that get sunlight on them?
I'd hope the manufacturers are using compatible coatings, but I see these peely cars everywhere.
It's crazy to think avoiding this means having to cover a vehicle from sunlight every time you park it.
And I don't even live in the great hot southwest, it must be a really bad problem there.

By design bc/cc has different resins between the base and clear. Base having quicker drying resin/binders and now waterborne bases with urethane based clear. Go figure lol None of what's out there today holds up as well as the old paints that contained lead.
 
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In the early days of BC/CC systems (80's) there was a mixing of paint systems. That's why you saw a lot of vehicles on the road with the clear peeling off the base coat. I know because my '84 Toronado (company car) at the time peeled like a banana.

The OEM paint companies all learned a valuable lesson about "surface tension" between the coating layers. Since then they (OEMs) are very conscious of not mixing resin systems or ensuring compatible resin systems.

You can have a waterborne base with a urethane clear but their surface tensions are compatible but may not be the same resin system.

Today's paint systems are far superior to the paint systems of the 80's and older paint systems in every way. There are more stringent tests today vs. pre waterborne days. Paint systems undergo longer cycles in harsh environments and must pass or they are not approved for use . Today there are better resins, UV systems, light stabilizer systems, pigments, etc. etc. because the testing requirements get harder and harder ever year. Today's paint systems have to last at last a minimum of 5 years even in the harshest climates.

One to note: Today's paint systems are still not idiot proof. There are still a few OEM paint people out there who think they can take short cuts when coating a new car. Every OEM and Aftermarket basecoat, clearcoat, primer, e-coat, and pre-treatment product has application parameters that must be met but every once in a while the parameters get ignored and you get all sorts of defects because of it. In my time I think I've seen just about every possible self inflicted paint defect imaginable, even paint that looked like alligator skin when it came out of the bake oven.

If I told you guys some of the unnecessary **** I've seen in an OEM paint shop or a final finish area you wouldn't buy a new car. I've also been involved in some paint warranty claim nightmares back in the 80's and 90's. And I'm happy to say I never paid a claim to any OEM because it was proven it was their screw up. I'm so glad all that crap is behind me now.

Class dismissed!
 
Definitely let it cure a while. Depending on how much you need to take out 1000 to 1500 and then buff with compound. If you have some runs to take out a razor blade is good and then a little 800. As soon as it get close to flush switch to the finer paper.
Just ordered two gallons of Sublime acrylic urethane,recommended 60 day drying before cut and buff....
 
it has been 30 days since topcoat ( acrylic urethane). I can tell the difference in it as it has cured. I think I will give it another 30 days before I attempt any wet sand and buff.
like said, i'm not into show cars, my goal on my little"collection" of mostly early A's, is get rid of rusty sheetmetal, patch, epoxy prime, high fill sanding primer, seal, top coat with old fashioned acrylic urethane. if I wasn't 68 and somewhat wore out, I might work till perfect, BUT I will drive them, they will get door dings, scratches, gravel pecks, dirty, I love on the STICKS ha

I know, if I sell one, the buyer expects to buy perfect body/paint, and buy it for pretty much NOTHIN! ha
 
I'm confused. The acrylic urethane I purchased advised not to be sanded and buffed or to be top coated with clear. I assumed the single stage was to be sprayed and left as is.
 
I'm confused. The acrylic urethane I purchased advised not to be sanded and buffed or to be top coated with clear. I assumed the single stage was to be sprayed and left as is.
I have never wet sanded/buffeted it, but not real satisfied with my job. like you said, I figure not something generally sanded' buffed. I got some dust in it, I did not lay it down as I wanted.
my color is a NON metallic.... if I sand/buff and don't like the results I will simply later on... , seal it and spray again. nothing I can't do this fall when I finish my " enclosed" part of my car shed!
 
Understood. When I finish my floor pans, I'm debating on building a temporary paint booth, or I should have the car transported to my daughters house. Won't be as convenient, but the previous owner had a garage in the back yard that he painted cars in.certainly not a perfect paint booth, but does have a large exhaust fan and a concrete floor with water available. Sounds good except nothing has been done there in quite a while. Very dirty and poor lighting. I was considering a pvc pipe frame covered in plastic with fans to draw the air. I have a garage which is part of the house and don't want to spray and have the fumes in the house. I have painted the dashboard and some interior parts outside, but wouldn't care to chance painting the body outside.
Any thoughts on which way I should go here. Not ready yet, but hope to paint in the next couple of months.
 
I am using a. Single stage that isn't a metallic paint, but an ivory color. The stripe will be gold that does have some metallic.
 
like said, I make NO claim to be pro at this, but have painted a number of car s over the years. some guys that have posted on this thread a re pros.
I will say this. a CLEAN enclosed area is really a must. remember the rafters , ceiling,... in that old garage can have lots of dust there! it will fall on your paint! lighting, a must, I try to get by with out additional light...mistake!! but I never have enough $$ to have everything like I want, and refuse to spend the next 10 yrs trying to have it all, ( probably kick the bucket before that!)... exhaust? yes. you need to pull the fumes out away from you. fresh suit is really needed. that stuff is nasty! real spray booths have engineered exhaust and lighting!
Tadams, if you lay that urethane on RIGHT, proper nozzle size and pressure, constant air flow, right reducer, it can be laid on with a great wet look. it will be shiney no further work to it. but all has to be right. don't have a HF pressure reg at gun that goes to **** bought time ya start for one thing! ha and yes ya need to keep out the dust, dirt, and BUGS! ha
and that Ivory will be a good color and non metallic. solves a lot of problems that can arise and show up later....! think of it like this, at least ya got the balls to do it.
 
I know how to spray, am debating on going to my daughters and cleaning up the place and painting there. But you think about, having the car and parts taken there. Then your tools, compressor and it will not be as convenient as going downstairs to work on my car without driving 10 miles. If I build a temporary booth here and take it apart when finished it would be available to put up again if I decided to do another. But so would her garage. To many decisions for a lazy Sunday afternoon
 
I know how to spray, am debating on going to my daughters and cleaning up the place and painting there. But you think about, having the car and parts taken there. Then your tools, compressor and it will not be as convenient as going downstairs to work on my car without driving 10 miles. If I build a temporary booth here and take it apart when finished it would be available to put up again if I decided to do another. But so would her garage. To many decisions for a lazy Sunday afternoon
my compressor uses 220 , and big and heavy,,,, I would hate to move it! I have seen people on here that got a roll of sheet plastic and some 2 bys and built one, pretty easy. just be prepared to have some good lighting. and exhaust to pull out the fumes.
 
That seems to be easier than taking everything to her house even though the spray booth is there
 
like said, I make NO claim to be pro at this, but have painted a number of car s over the years. some guys that have posted on this thread a re pros.
I will say this. a CLEAN enclosed area is really a must. remember the rafters , ceiling,... in that old garage can have lots of dust there! it will fall on your paint! lighting, a must, I try to get by with out additional light...mistake!! but I never have enough $$ to have everything like I want, and refuse to spend the next 10 yrs trying to have it all, ( probably kick the bucket before that!)... exhaust? yes. you need to pull the fumes out away from you. fresh suit is really needed. that stuff is nasty! real spray booths have engineered exhaust and lighting!
Tadams, if you lay that urethane on RIGHT, proper nozzle size and pressure, constant air flow, right reducer, it can be laid on with a great wet look. it will be shiney no further work to it. but all has to be right. don't have a HF pressure reg at gun that goes to **** bought time ya start for one thing! ha and yes ya need to keep out the dust, dirt, and BUGS! ha
and that Ivory will be a good color and non metallic. solves a lot of problems that can arise and show up later....! think of it like this, at least ya got the balls to do it.


A clean and well ventilated area would be best for health reasons but I know what you're trying to say Barbee. The cleaner the environment the cleaner the job. Frame the area with 2 X 2 's and cover with 4 or 6 mil plastic. Allow lots of room for easy movement around the vehicle. The plastic will create a slight elctrostatic effect and attract airborne particles that would normally end up in your work. Use large furnace filters for incoming and out going air. Trap the overspray by using the furnace filters, you don't want to have an issue with a neighbor or "an official" .

Yes. lots of light and be careful what light sources you choose. An open 100 or 200 Watt light bulb generates a lot of heat and could cause an explosion. Try to shield the light sources in some manner. I've made 4 wooden boxes and put double 4 foot florescent tubes in them and laid them on the floor on each side of the car. My overhead lights were florescent as well and they were mounted on the ceiling.

Self protection is a must with today's 2K materials. Paint suit, rubber or latex gloves, proper paint mask or air supplied mask/hood. I've had isocyanate poisoning twice and it wasn't a lot of fun. I use an air supplied mask because I have to.

The compressor must be able to keep up with demand. If it doesn't keep up your paint job may suffer.

Application parameters: constant stroke speed, constant gun overlap, constant air pressure, constant gun distance, constant viscosity, constant air and surface temperature, and constant gun settings are all a must for good results.

Please use a good spray gun too. There are so many guns available out there and the majority are just crap. I'm lucky to own the best spray guns available but I also have some "affordable guns" that do a pretty decent job of laying down paint. Ask around and see who's using what type. I'm not here to promote products.

Paint prep is key to any paint job. blow it/tack it/wash it 4 times at a minimum. M<ake sure evry nook and cranny has been cleaned or blown out. Water the floor down and you may have to water it down between coats if it's hot out.


Practice , practice, and practice some more. The more "gun time" you get the better you will become. "Reading the paint" is an art that comes with practice and the result is eventually a show winning paint job.

"Determination" plays an important role too. If you show determination to do a goo job you will succeed because you paid attention to every detail.. And if you strive to make each subsequent paint job better than the last one you will succeed.

I wish all you guys the best of luck with your projects. Please be careful when you are working on your cars, your family depends on you.

Any questions, PM me and I'll do my best to answer them.

sscuda
 
Good information. My 65 barracuda has epoxy primer and a coat of 2k primer. Will have to be sanded and primer again before I proceed. Life gets in the way as you all know

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Working on floor pans as you can see before I can proceed. Another new experience to be learned
 
Working on floor pans as you can see before I can proceed. Another new experience to be learned

Nice looking Cuda!!!!

I assume you bought quality replacement panels. Take your time with the install. You Tube may have some videos on installing floor pans in an early A-Body. If you get stuck just ask for help. There are plenty of guys on this site who have the knowledge and are willing to jump in and help, myself included.

Good Luck with your project.
 
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