Wiper Help....

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Riddler

Project EH-Body
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Ok guys,

Before I start, this isn't a just replace it sort of deal. On my 76 Duster with 6.1 Hemi I needed to use a smaller wiper motor, so I went with a Dodge Neon motor hidden up under the dash. I remade the driver's side arm from the motor to pivot.

The passenger side is perfect as I haven't changed the arm or pivot points on that side. Hee's where my trouble lies...

The drivers side wiper only travels about 60% up the windshield. I believe my issue isn't with the arm, but with the motor lever or the pivot lever. I don't have the space to increase the wiper motor lever so I'm thinking of trying an extension to the driver's side pivot point but not touching the passenger side pivot.

Would this work?

Thanks,

Riddler
 


Here's my issue. I believe by extending the drivers side pivot point from the wiper motor, I'll be able to gain some more swiping area.

Riddler
 
You have a unique modification and problem. The arm is merely a link. I feel that you are thinking right since you don't have many options. I would try to make to make a temporary extension to that arm just to prove that theory, then make it permanent.
 


Here's my issue. I believe by extending the drivers side pivot point from the wiper motor, I'll be able to gain some more swiping area.

Riddler


You would need a shorter arm attaching point at that wiper, not a longer one.
 
So I'll need a shorter arm? I tried a longer arm and couldn't get it work. I feel that a shorter arm wouldn't work. After some reading about how wiper transmissions work I felt the problem lies with the pivot point on the wiper motor.

Does anyone have a photo of how the stock wipers are positions in park? I know the wiper lever is pointed to the drivers side. Right not both my pivots are also pointed to the driver's side. When I had the motor lever pointed to the passenger side the wipers went down over the cowl instead of up on the windshield.

Thanks Murray and Trailbeast for the help thus far.

Riddler
 
Here's how @retroron did his Dodge Neon wiper motor. Mine is very similar but had to be moved closer to the drivers side to make room for the AC condenser.

img_0677-jpg.jpg


I'm pretty sure I need to increase the wiper motor lever but due to space constraints I can't install a longer lever arm. I'm trying to increase the amount the driver's side pivot turns. At the same time I don't want to the passenger side to move further.

Riddler
 
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I'm surprised you're having fitment problems. I moved the firewall back 3 inches and I have the vintage air conditioning package mounted by the wipers as well. I think the picture above is in park
 
Here's how @retroron did his Dodge Neon wiper motor. Mine is very similar but had to be moved closer to the drivers side to make room for the AC condenser.

View attachment 1715222121

I'm trying to increase the amount the driver's side pivot turns. At the same time I don't want to the passenger side to move further.

Riddler

That's why you need to move the pivot point on the drivers side in closer toward the wiper pivot point, and not change the arm on the motor.
Changing the arm on the motor would change the drivers side wiper travel as well as the passenger side.
An arm pivot point farther away from the wiper pivot will give even less travel of the wiper than you have now.
 
That's why you need to move the pivot point on the drivers side in closer toward the wiper pivot point, and not change the arm on the motor.
Changing the arm on the motor would change the drivers side wiper travel as well as the passenger side.
An arm pivot point farther away from the wiper pivot will give even less travel of the wiper than you have now.
Hmm I guess that might be even easier. However how far in do I move it? Is it direct relation? So I need 4" then I have to move the pivot in 4"? Or is there a ratio?

I'm guessing it'll be a trial and error type of thing...

Riddler
 
Hmm I guess that might be even easier. However how far in do I move it? Is it direct relation? So I need 4" then I have to move the pivot in 4"? Or is there a ratio?

I'm guessing it'll be a trial and error type of thing...

Riddler

Not even.:D
Figure if the arm moves 1/2 inch then the tip of the wiper blade moves probably 6 inches.
Try moving the wiper itself from one end of it's travel to the other and measure how much the arm under the dash travels from one end of the travel to the other.
That should give you an idea of where to start.

Just a thought, is it possible your main arm from one wiper assy to the other is on the wrong pivot?
I can't imagine why the ratio between the two wipers would be different if the rod is on the correct pivot pin.
 
Not even.:D
Figure if the arm moves 1/2 inch then the tip of the wiper blade moves probably 6 inches.
Try moving the wiper itself from one end of it's travel to the other and measure how much the arm under the dash travels from one end of the travel to the other.
That should give you an idea of where to start.

Just a thought, is it possible your main arm from one wiper assy to the other is on the wrong pivot?
I can't imagine why the ratio between the two wipers would be different if the rod is on the correct pivot pin.

I know the passenger side arm wasn't modified. I did have to cut the driver's side in order to change the motor attachment. I also moved the motor closer to the driver's side in order to have room for the condenser. I believe I'll do some homework tonight and post up my results. I'm going to see how far the wiper motor lever moves and then move the pivot in it's location to that point. Then I'll measure off another point and move the wiper until I get it close to where I need it. It doesn't have to be perfect, but I need just a bit more in case I get stuck in the rain one day.

Thank you @TrailBeast for all your help. Truly an asset to this community.

Riddler
 
Oh man this is the kind of stuff that I love to figure out! If I could get a better picture of it (in my head) I would love a crack at it.
 
Just spitballing here- but if the passenger side is OK, then that part of the setup is good. No mod to the motor arm as that would effect both sides. A mod to driver side arm would seem likely. Shortening that arm would increase rotational travel as the connecting rod still travels the same amount. I would guess the arm or the connecting pin would not need to be moved very much. You are already getting 60 percent, so maybe 1/4" or less might give you the extra 40.
 
Just spitballing here- but if the passenger side is OK, then that part of the setup is good. No mod to the motor arm as that would effect both sides. A mod to driver side arm would seem likely. Shortening that arm would increase rotational travel as the connecting rod still travels the same amount. I would guess the arm or the connecting pin would not need to be moved very much. You are already getting 60 percent, so maybe 1/4" or less might give you the extra 40.
Also for geometry sake it might be necessary to put a slight elbow in the long connecting arm?
 
Now that I look at your first photo again, it looks like both wipers need to travel more.
 
Also for geometry sake it might be necessary to put a slight elbow in the long connecting arm?
I tried the slight bend in the arm. I have a few options to look at all. I'm thinking changing the arm length might not do it. I'm going to have to do some homework and see if I can figure out moving the pivot point or shortening the arm. I don't think it's the arm, I think it's the pivot point. But I'll check arm length first...

Riddler
 
There can be a little bit of a delicate balance there where you don't want to get too close to the fulcrum point (Pivot Point) and cause too much stress. That may be a case where you have to extend your throw arm. But it will be a bit of trial and error back and forth.
 
If the passenger side wiper has the correct sweep angle then its the length of your drivers side arm
 
You might be surprised how you move that a quarter of an inch closer to the fulcrum point and the wiper moves 6in.
 
If the passenger side wiper has the correct sweep angle then its the length of your drivers side arm
Wouldn't changing the driver's side arm also increase the passenger side wiper sweep as well? This is why I thought changing the pivot point on the driver's side pivot closer would be a better option.

I'll have to take some measurements and let you guys play with the numbers and such. You'll have to give me some time to get the measurements.

On paper however I've played with changing the pivot point and it does give me more swipe on the driver's side without changing the passenger.

Riddler
 
Just trying to envision it in my mind, but the wiper motor should give you a set amount of throw as it goes around. Say 4" for the sake of argument. What I would do is put the wiper at the bottom of it's stroke, then move it to it's top location and see what location on the arm gives you the proper amount of sweep on 4" of movement. It might help to make a little paper protractor so you can simulate where the arm will be at the top and bottom of it's stroke. See below for a sketch of what I am trying to describe:

Wiper Pivot Throw.jpg


Don't know how the passenger side is driven... Does it have a tie rod that drives it off the driver side? I would think if there is, that they would have to tied at the same distance to get the same amount of movement.
 
Wouldn't changing the driver's side arm also increase the passenger side wiper sweep as well? This is why I thought changing the pivot point on the driver's side pivot closer would be a better option.

I'll have to take some measurements and let you guys play with the numbers and such. You'll have to give me some time to get the measurements.

On paper however I've played with changing the pivot point and it does give me more swipe on the driver's side without changing the passenger.

Riddler
I'm thinking without really taking measurements but locking the wiper blade at one end and noting where the bar crosses and sweeping it over to attach other end of it sweet and noting where the bar crosses. I was even thinking of an experimental whole or two very small of course with a pop rivet? Just for some trial-and-error?
 
Just trying to envision it in my mind, but the wiper motor should give you a set amount of throw as it goes around. Say 4" for the sake of argument. What I would do is put the wiper at the bottom of it's stroke, then move it to it's top location and see what location on the arm gives you the proper amount of sweep on 4" of movement. It might help to make a little paper protractor so you can simulate where the arm will be at the top and bottom of it's stroke. See below for a sketch of what I am trying to describe:

View attachment 1715222188

Don't know how the passenger side is driven... Does it have a tie rod that drives it off the driver side? I would think if there is, that they would have to tied at the same distance to get the same amount of movement.

The wiper motor turns in complete circles. I'll have to measure the distance on the motor lever but I believe it's close to 2". So it starts pointing towards the driver's side and goes counter clockwise. This it'll have roughly 4" of throw. Now I'm thinking that if the driver's side needs another 6" and that means moving the pivot point closer to the fixed pivot by roughly 1/2". I'll have to check and see what that gives me on the end of the wiper blade.

I believe that because the passenger side runs off the driver's side pivot point it'll remain unchanged unless I change the driver's side arm. So moving the driver's side movement pivot will be ok since it'll just turn the fixed pivot more however it'll leave the passenger side pivot and arm assembly unchanged.

Riddler
 
I'll get some exact measurements tonight. Length of the driver's side arm, how far pivot points are, etc.

Riddler
 
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