ProComp/Speedmaster aluminum heads

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PRH said:
You sure about that?
Might want to double check those specs.
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You do know what the term “over the nose” refers to, right?

So....... installed at what height, and at what valve lift do you achieve 382lbs over the nose with that spring?
 
PRH said:
You do know what the term “over the nose” refers to, right?

So....... installed at what height, and at what valve lift do you achieve 382lbs over the nose with that spring?
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At the cams highest lift..?
I'm "assuming" like cam manufacturers giving a @50, there's a general lift there giving these numbers ?..
 
I noticed when my 202 valves were installed they left the same Springs in there from the 188, but something about
-.050 keepers. I'm assuming the new 202 valves needed the springs majorly shimmed..
 
PRH said:
I think you should do a little more homework on spring heights and loads.
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Captain Obvious what do you think I'm doing!?... I'm not running down and trying to bang a Sheep, I'm trying to walk down and bang them all...
I'm taking my time asking questions. Is there any reason that I couldn't use the Springs at I haven't seen the crap out of him using shims and offset retainers or keepers?..
 
I’ve told you exactly how to do it, but you want to go about it some other way.

My way starts with you finding out what the spring requirements are for your current cam.
Either call the cam grinder and ask them, or measure the installed height of the springs that are on the motor now(this assumes the current springs are set up correctly for the cam) and look at the chart on the Crower site and see what the loads are for your spring, at that installed height, and your lift.
 
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PRH said:
I’ve told you exactly how to do it, but you want to go about it some other way.

My way starts with you finding out what the spring requirements are for your current cam.
Either call the cam grinder and ask them, or measure the installed height of the springs that are on the motor now(this assumes the current springs are set up correctly for the cam) and look at the chart on the Crower site and see what the loads are for your spring, at that installed height, and your lift.
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Dwayne, what you'll figure out is that a lot of times jpar isn't looking for the right answer, just for reaffirmation on his way of doing things.

I'm not beating on you jpar, but I've read a bunch of your posts over the years and most follow the same pattern and this one is no different.
 
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That’s why I suggested option “c” ;)

There are some typos/erroneous info referring to the “spring rate” in that “Valve spring tech” article.
To illustrate this point consider two springs that have approximately the same seat pressure at 1.800-inches installed height; one at 123 pounds-per-inch and the other 124 pounds-per-inch. The spring with 123 pounds-per-inch seat pressure has a rate of 408 while the spring with 124-pounds-per-inch has a rate of 251.
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The installed height load is not rated at “pounds per inch”....... it’s just “pounds”.
If you don’t really understand spring specs, that could be confusing to someone.
The “spring rate” is determined by the change in load over a specified distance.

I see those types of misprints in magazine tech articles all the time.
 
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yellow rose said:
If he wants me to look at his heads when I come over I will. Just costs him a 24 pack of Safeway ginger ale.

And he has to wait until December. I ain't coming over before then unless it's an emergency.
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Well there you go Jpar,if you can wait that long!.
 
Shoot.... just check that the valves are sealing, if not lap 'em. Your cam isn't THAT big. If those springs that came with those heads won't take a .520 lift, then Chopsticks to lamb chops! I say run 'em!
 
PRH said:
I’ve told you exactly how to do it, but you want to go about it some other way.

My way starts with you finding out what the spring requirements are for your current cam.
Either call the cam grinder and ask them, or measure the installed height of the springs that are on the motor now(this assumes the current springs are set up correctly for the cam) and look at the chart on the Crower site and see what the loads are for your spring, at that installed height, and your lift.
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The heads are still in their boxes on the Shelf where I put them the day after I got them. One thing about me I've always figured there's a few different ways to skin a cat... (Clutch tamer).. if I had my mind completely wrapped around this I would have stopped asking questions.
Fortunately I was just pm'ed by a member who gave me the mathematical formula..
Math I understand!
When I was a kid and started doing foundations for work of course I start out laboring. As I gained a little more knowledge I noticed the foreman would always keep the plan to themselves and figure out the squares and just kind of tell you what to do to keep you dumb and stupid and working.. when I finally started running my own crew all my men knew how to read the plan and figure their own Pythagorean theorem to square a Foundation in..
Appreciate you giving me a good direction and good advice. What I'm looking for now is the other ways for skinning cats if there is any? Like something I didn't know was that when I went to 202 valves they used the same springs, but needed more shims and -50 keepers.. -50 keepers? Oh so there's other ways of doing things...
ultimately again I appreciate your help and I see no reason why I won't follow your formula when the time comes. As of right now I'm waiting for maybe a Black Friday sale or something for the bolts...
 
justinp61 said:
Dwayne, what you'll figure out is that a lot of times jpar isn't looking for the right answer, just for reaffirmation on his way of doing things.

I'm not beating on you jpar, but I've read a bunch of your posts over the years and most follow the same pattern and this one is no different.
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100% my money my car my way or the highway...
I refuse to be a sheep...
 
More than one way to do it?
Sure...... there’s at least two.
The right way......... and the wrong way.

There’s really only one right way to set up heads....... which is to match the spring loads in accordance with the requirements of the cam profile, along with all the matching components, and desired rpm range.

There are tons of ways to do it wrong though.
 
PRH said:
There’s really only one right way to set up heads....... which is to match the spring loads in accordance with the requirements of the cam profile, along with all the matching components, and desired rpm range.
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Like I said I got a p.m. with the other half of the puzzle...
 
318willrun said:
Shoot.... just check that the valves are sealing, if not lap 'em. Your cam isn't THAT big. If those springs that came with those heads won't take a .520 lift, then Chopsticks to lamb chops! I say run 'em!
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318willrun said:
Post 987 - my way of skinning the cat didn't even get noticed :eek:
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There you go panning for that disagree button...
I was saving up for the big answer I had to eat dinner...
I'd skin the cat your way if it was some junkyard 318 or 360 but it's not...
I'll be disassembling and checking the spring rates you can Bank on that...
Not saying I won't put it all back together and run it, just I will check things out. It's basically free to take them apart and take them down to a shop..
Anyways don't you have a van to buy...
 
j par said:
I'd skin the cat your way if it was some junkyard 318 or 360 but it's not...
I'll be disassembling and checking the spring rates you can Bank on that...
Not saying I won't put it all back together and run it, just I will check things out. It's basically free to take them apart and take them down to a shop..
Anyways don't you have a van to buy...
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  • It's a soon to be 7k stroker, I get it
  • check'n spring rates is a good idea. Peace of mind...
  • Look'n, been look'n for a van. Like always, they are everywhere till poor ole' 318alreadyhaswon wants one.... :(
 
318willrun said:
  • It's a soon to be 7k stroker, I get it
  • check'n spring rates is a good idea. Peace of mind...
  • Look'n, been look'n for a van. Like always, they are everywhere till poor ole' 318alreadyhaswon wants one.... :(
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and pretty soon you'll have 7k into two dusters and a van that don't have enough horsepower combined to get out of their own way....
 
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