Gun owners...You suck...LOL

gts340 said:

If everyone agreed to go back to fist fighting then we would be fine without guns.

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Problem with that is they would agree and then stick a 45 Caliber HK in your face.......................

That stupid lady needs to remember that it is NOT the guns that do the harm it is the People that are behind them!

Yes I have plenty and enough ammo for a small infantry...........they will NOT be taking mine unless I am leaving in a BODY BAG!

I don't disagree with anybody here who is stating that firearms are important for self defense. I think making the case for hunting will never win an argument in the age of supermarkets (unless you're in a part of the country where nobody would make that argument anyway). Having said that, I think both of these are straw-man arguments that should be avoided.

The point that should be made is that the second amendment is specifically in place to protect the remainder of the bill of rights. The founding fathers understood that the only government that would respect the rights of the people was one that was made of men who had reason to fear them. This has been totally lost in the US at this point (rightly or wrongly). A well regulated state militia had two functions - defending the state from foreign attack (native americans, british, french, whomever we would be in a fight with at any given time) and defense of the people against the tyranny of a central government grown oppressive.

Those who do not understand gun rights or the need for gun rights will argue that when this was written the people had smooth-bore muskets and weapons for hand fighting. They will argue that this is a far cry from the weapons of our modern armed forces. They will argue that this means the idea of armed citizens putting down a tyrannical government is outdated and not worth defending. Thus, you should not continue to consider this as a primary function of weapons in the hands of citizens.

The counter argument to this misguided and disjointed logic is that smooth-bore muskets and weapons for hand fighting _WERE_ the state of the art in weapons of the day equivalent to today's citizens being allowed to have fully automatic rifles with high capacity magazines.

The point here is that firearms are not just tools (for defense, hunting, any other use). They are primarily (and were understood at the founding to be) the great equalizer of men such that one man could not impose his will over another without his consent. To cite a snarky cliche, the three boxes used in the defense of liberty shall be the soap box, the ballot box, and the ammo box (in that order).

The current debate about the illegal use of firearms is a straw man constructed to re-direct the debate away from this more fundamental and important aspect of their function. It's intellectually lazy to say that people shouldn't murder people and so we should take away murder weapons. To support that argument as a matter of policy is to explicitly and intentionally alter the fabric of our society such as to create two classes of men. Those who can impose their will by force and those who cannot and to concentrate the "haves" in positions of power and to subjugate the "have nots". You don't have to look too far to find examples of this today.

I would fully expect that a math, physics, or shop teacher might not understand this. A history teacher who doesn't get it, however, should find some other subject to teach.

I hope this helps.

-- Gagster

mopardude318 said:

Yea, but what really pisses me off is that statement made by the High School History teacher...I wanna say something good to him...lol

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I had a teacher one time try to tell me that the civil war was not about slavery. LOL Some people should not be teachers.

Burntorange70 said:

I had a teacher one time try to tell me that the civil war was not about slavery. LOL Some people should not be teachers.

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Well,,,, That teacher was correct. It started over state rights.The "civil war" did not end slavery. Just the slaves in the confederate states. The union states allowed slavery for some time after the conflict.:book:

Whip

BigWhip said:

Well,,,, That teacher was correct. It started over state rights.The "civil war" did not end slavery. Just the slaves in the confederate states. The union states allowed slavery for some time after the conflict.:book:

Whip

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Were 3 reasons for the civil war-- states rights, election of Abraham Lincoln and different economies.. I think slavery was tied into all 3...

It's a shame that it's true the war was fought over states' rights. It's especially a shame that the issue the states chose to make a stand on was something so terminally wrong as slavery. Had they conceded the issue - given up slavery and avoided the war, things may have turned out different. In losing the war, the south basically allowed the union to demonstrate that the states' rights end wherever the federal government arbitrarily says they do rather than more correctly, the federal government's rights end precisely where the constitution says they do. Had the war actually just been over slavery or had it been avoided altogether, the true intention of the 10th amendment may have been clarified by the courts and maybe there would be a chance that we wouldn't be so screwed today.

Just remember, "When seconds count, the Police are only minutes away"...

I live out in the sticks, kinda. No local police force, just the Highway Patrol and Sheriff. I am in the extreme southern end of the County, the sheriffs office is over 65 mils away. In 2 yearsof living here I have seen 1 cop cruise thru the 'hood. Can't imagine not having a gun or 40 of them in my situation. Not to mention the packs of coyotes that wander thru and harass everybodies chickens etc.

Opps! Looks like I started some thing. Was not my intention. Back on to guns. I have a loaded shoot gun next to my bed. I use it for squirles but it is there just in case.

mopardude318 said:

Yea, but what really pisses me off is that statement made by the High School History teacher...I wanna say something good to him...lol

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Tell him that the Framers of our Constitution put Freedom of Speech 1st, and then guaranteed its continuing existence by putting the Right to Keep and Bear Arms 2nd. It is only the fear of an armed uprising that keeps the Government from all out tyranny.

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty. - Thomas Jefferson

Tell her that with her dumb as logic they should outlaw cars too because people die while using them, people use them as weapons and people accidentally kill themselves with them...duh.

Seriously, the right to keep and bear arms goes way back to the federalist papers , you know, the writings of the founders thoughts and beliefs before the final draft?

It was well known that the people's right to keep and bear arms was a way to keep their government limited and in check to keep tyranny from taking a foothold among protection of ones self and property.

I think we are at that point again, BUT unfortunately the government has grown much, much bigger and has alot more guns than we little people......BUT again, that don't mean we still can't kick ***.


Also, tell your dumb *** teacher that there are still alot of guys, and GIRLS that hunt because the wild stuff they kill and eat is much, much healthier than the engineered meat you get at the grocery store.

If she has a problem with hunting, tell her to take it up with the fish and game commission that permits hunting quotas to keep the herds manageable so they are not in her back yard eating her shrubs and running into everyone's cars in the highway and dying of disease and starvation from overpopulation.
What is more humane: killing them and eating healthier or watching them starve and die of disease?

Tell teacher to stick with their tofu and veggies while the real Men and Women of the world keep her yard, and car free from pests and keep the herds healthy.

Also mention that hunters spend a hell of (ALOT) of money which BOOSTS THE ECONOMY EVERY YEAR, ALL YEAR LONG FROM BUYING HUNTING EQUIPMENT, AND tell teach that hunters are the best conservationists on the planet.

I swear if the whole country was full of people like that sissy *** teacher and that dumb chick, how long do you think America would last?

I really hope nobody confronts them at night with a knife while getting out of the car at the local starbucks or nail salon or gay bar, or wherever those assclowns hang out because a good, nearby citizen with a gun would be a great thing to have right about then.

ASK TEACH IF THEY KNOW HOW MANY (BILLIONS) OF DOLLARS ARE SPENT EACH YEAR IN THE US IN HUNTING EQUIPMENT AND DERIVATIVES OF.

THAT IS GOOD FOR THE ECONOMY RIGHT?

inkjunkie said:

I live out in the sticks, kinda. No local police force, just the Highway Patrol and Sheriff. I am in the extreme southern end of the County, the sheriffs office is over 65 mils away. In 2 yearsof living here I have seen 1 cop cruise thru the 'hood. Can't imagine not having a gun or 40 of them in my situation. Not to mention the packs of coyotes that wander thru and harass everybodies chickens etc.

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When seconds count, police are only minutes away.
I love that quote because it is raw, third grade logic that any imbecile can understand which leads me to believe that anyone who disagrees with that statement is truly an imbecile and dumber than a third grader and deserves to be mugged by a criminal.

Liberal gun sign.

We have large caliber weapons in the redneck mansion. Must protect the ones we love and the things we earned. [Some times a big dog needs a little help]

Burntorange70 said:

Opps! Looks like I started some thing. Was not my intention. Back on to guns. I have a loaded shoot gun next to my bed. I use it for squirles but it is there just in case.

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Shot gun, good idea, the last time I was attacked by a squirrel in bed all I had was my last ex-girlfriend to beat it off with... ;)

greenhornet said:

Shot gun, good idea, the last time I was attacked by a squirrel in bed all I had was my last ex-girlfriend to beat it off with... ;)

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I get a little help from my GI Joe assault squad:snakeman:

Sorry for intruding to your conversation...
There has been same kind of gun conversation in Finland lately.
Maybe its becourse of some school shootings, and this one thing when few got shot in drive-in just becourse of driving a Buick.. But ppl really doesnt seem to understand, that if every hand gun is made illegal, the crimes are more hard to get solved..
Every gun should be registered in here, but crimes are done usually only with unregistered illegal guns. Nowadays its difficult to have premission to buy a gun, resulting more illegal unregistered guns...
I can tell You as a jack of all trades in metal industry, its not that hard to fix deactivated war memorial (mostly coming from war between Russia and Finland, 1939-1944), or buy new one from Estonia. ;) There is dangerous guns on criminals allso in Finland, and most "normal" ppl have none, and if they have, they cant even protect them selfs...

I hope that some day I could legally protect my family, with out getting my self in jail.
Its so fun to life in the "best country" which is so full of non sense laws, that even the lion on the coat of arms of finland hates it, and stabs him self on the head...

What is the point of free education if You get killed? How much Your doughter will need education that she will be happy while she is raped?

Don't follow us on making important decisions about self protecting.

One night at last week, some guy was sneaking close to our backyard.. He was there for 2 hours, doing nothing! I saw he was obviously hiding and trying to see inside the house... Well, this time I scared him away, but will he be scared on the next time? I could call police, but how long it takes them to come if something happens? If nothing happens, cops just gently tells him to go away... But hey, I have no fear, there is nearly free health care. So if my girlfriend and kids got raped or killed, I can spend the rest of my life in a free padded white room, and eat free meals, and eat free drugs... Wait a sec... There is an other solution. I could shoot that freak end spend few years in jail.

Sorry about this, but sometimes all this s*** makes me angry, and I had to let that anger out before going to sleep. So thank You, and good night.

we need guns. it our way of protecting ourselfs, if we didn't have guns I'll bet we would have more murders due to lack of protection!.

I have S&W police special 38, Beretta .40, no-name 357, S&W Model 39-2 9mm, Remington 870, Remington .270 Win, 3 .22 rifles (old), Ruger 10-22, ummmm. Just kidding Big Brother! I wouldn't DARE have guns in the house!!!

I hunt, target shoot, partake in the gun hobby, and have concealed weapon permit. You take that away from me what am going to do? Buy a sling shot?

Guns...they are a wonderful invention. Spent most of the day cleaning from the last time we went shooting...looking forward to the next time. What was the bumper sticker I used to see every day at work.....guns killpeople like a spoon made Rosie ODonnel fat or something to that effect.....

Burntorange70 said:

I get a little help from my GI Joe assault squad:snakeman:

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Okay, that pic just got copied! Damn near made me spit my cigar across the room.

The next thing you know they`ll be making zip guns out of our telescopic antennas.:wink:

When zip guns made from telescopic antennae are outlawed, only outlaws will have zip guns made from telescopic antennae!