Broken and unbreakable bolts HELP

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jhdeval

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I removed my exhaust and intake on my slant six today. I broke one of the bolts linking the heat riser to the intake and there is another bolt that was already broke on the heat riser towards the engine block. First question does anyone have suggestions on how to get those broke bolts out? I planned on replacing them anyway but I need to get it out.

Second question I can not get the exhaust manifold and the exhaust pipe separated. I have tried breaking the bolt and loosening it. I can't get it loose because I can't hold the nut and the bolt at the same time. I can't break it for the same reason. Any suggestions on separating them?
 
jhdeval said:
I removed my exhaust and intake on my slant six today. I broke one of the bolts linking the heat riser to the intake and there is another bolt that was already broke on the heat riser towards the engine block. First question does anyone have suggestions on how to get those broke bolts out? I planned on replacing them anyway but I need to get it out.

Second question I can not get the exhaust manifold and the exhaust pipe separated. I have tried breaking the bolt and loosening it. I can't get it loose because I can't hold the nut and the bolt at the same time. I can't break it for the same reason. Any suggestions on separating them?
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Second question first, can you get to the bolt with a sawzall and cut it in half?

First question next, On the broken bolt, I drill a hole all the way through the center of the broken bolt, soak in for several days in penetrating oil and use an easy out. I use this type of easy outs if possible.
Should cost you $4.80 plus tax for any size 5/8 or smaller according to the SnapOn website.



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http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item.asp?P65=&tool=all&item_ID=10528&group_ID=1262&store=&dir=catalog

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item.asp?P65=&tool=all&item_ID=10539&group_ID=1262&store=&dir=catalog
 
A broken bolt in a hole is pretty common, especially on an exhaust. Next time, soak it overnight with WD-40, then rotate the bolt slightly back and forth (like a tap) to slowly free the rust. If you force it one way, the rust jams and your bolt can snap. Speaking of taps, that is the only method that has worked for me.

#1. Drill a hole directly in the center of the broke-off bolt, then run a tap down it to cut out the remainder. If lucky, you spare the internal threads. The trick is getting the hole well centered. Start with a center punch and a small drill bit, but not so small it breaks off or you face the problem of #2. Ditto if you break off the tap. I have done it with a hand drill, but if you can mount it to use a drill press, that is best. A few times, I got the metal thin enough to peel it out of the hole with a small screwdriver, without using a tap.

#2. Drill a hole and use a screw extractor bit to remove the broken screw. If you try this, drill the biggest hole you can, per #1, without getting into the threads, then use the biggest screw extractor possible. I don't suggest this method because several times a screw extractor has broken off, then the much worse problem of a piece of hardened steel that you can't drill stuck in the way (ditto for drill bit or tap). Some shops have a "tap burner" which can vaporize the offending piece. Otherwise, you are screwed (pun intended) as I am currently with a valve cover hole in my 383 head.

#3. Take it to a machine shop. They deal with this everyday. I have been charged ~$10 to fix a bad hole in a head when doing other work.

When you re-assemble, consider using stainless steel bolts. Ace has a good selection. The problem is they may tend to loosen, which is the opposite problem.

Re the frozen exhaust bolts. I cut them off a few times on my slant six when the hex edges got buggered up. I used a hacksaw blade held in a rag. You are lucky a slant has loads of under-hood room. I could never do this on my 273.
 
I am considering a cold chisel and split the nut. I also found another one I like which is drill a hole in the side of the nut and fill with penetrating oil.

I have not been very successful with the nut/screw extractors.

One more method question. What about smacking the bolt a few times and cutting off above the nut.
 
jhdeval said:
I am considering a cold chisel and split the nut. I also found another one I like which is drill a hole in the side of the nut and fill with penetrating oil. I have never tried that. I think it would take too much time.

I have not been very successful with the nut/screw extractors. I never was either until I started using the ones like I pictured and I haven't had a failure yet since I changed styles.

One more method question. What about smacking the bolt a few times and cutting off above the nut. I would worry about the cast snaping when I was smacking the bolt. [/QUOTE]

Pictures of what you are dealing with would help us help you.
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You are going to either use an easy out or take the manifold to a machine shop to remove the broken bolts. Other option would be get another exhaust manifold without problems.

Unless I could get two wrenches or Vice Grips on that stuck bolt, I would saw the bolt in two and be done with it.
 
If you're going to drill/ez out the bolt it helps aa ton to grind orfile the broken end flat (when you can), center punch and then drill. Keeps the drill bit from "walking" and maybe ruining a casting or at least ruining your day.
 
Oklacarcollecto said:
You are going to either use an easy out or take the manifold to a machine shop to remove the broken bolts. Other option would be get another exhaust manifold without problems.

Unless I could get two wrenches or Vice Grips on that stuck bolt, I would saw the bolt in two and be done with it.
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I want to saw it in two but that is the bolt that then goes to the exhaust pipe. I haven't figured out how to get in between. Unless I can just cut through the gasket. Do you think that would work?
 
Ok a little more information. I called a few machine shops I am getting quotes of 55-75 an hour. I can't do that right now so it is going to be up to me. On the broken bolt on the outside edge of the heat riser. I think I can use a pair of vise grips. I have been soaking it in PB Blaster every chance I can get. I have tapped it with a hammer to help also.

As for the rear bolt I don't know what to do. The bolt is not actually broke in the hole it rotted in the hole so it is below the surface of the manifold and it has a point stick up in the center. Makes it damn near impossible to drill dead center. I might try a dremel and grinding stone to level it out some.

I would love to replace the manifold as it has seen better days but it does not leak and I can't afford to replace it at this time.
 
jhdeval said:
I want to saw it in two but that is the bolt that then goes to the exhaust pipe. I haven't figured out how to get in between. Unless I can just cut through the gasket. Do you think that would work?
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The gasket would be the soft spot so I would try it. You posted about smacking the bolt and cutting it so that led me to thing you had some space already.
 
For the broken bolts. Unless you know someone with a mill don't let anyone drill it. It is easy to go off center. Then your screwed. The best way to remove broken bolts in cast iron is to build up the bolt with a tig weld,(not mig its brittle) Once you have metal protruding tig weld a nut on cool it with air instantly and turn it out. The nut and bolt? Take a sharp chisel and use the corner of the chisel to split one side of the nut. The nuts are soft and split easy. An air chisel would be the best. but a big hammer works. Don't try to easy-out those broken bolts , They broke for a reason . They are froze in the hole, so the only way is to drill and retap using a drill press our a mill to make sure you are on center. or do the weld proceedure. If you don't have these tools take it to someone who does.
 
Oldmanmopar Thank you your concerns are exactly the same as mine. I know that cast iron tends to be soft. I think one of them I may be able to get out with a vise grip and I going to try once I get the manifold out. The other one I think I am going to bring to a machine shop. I really don't want to screw up because I can't afford a replacement.
 
Should you end up needing a used one I bet finding one here on FABO wouldn't be very hard or expensive. Plenty of the /6s have been replaced with V8s. If noboby has one here then you can get one from Bert's Auto Salvage LLC Hermiston, OR 1-800-854-1455 for $35.
 
Oklacarcollecto Thank you that would certainly be helpfully in this pursuit. I have an aching suspicion that may be my route.
 
Your welcome but try here on FABO first. If members still are triping over the /6 after a V8 conversion they would be happy to send it down the road. Also could be some laying around from a super 6 changer over.
 
Next time you mess with exhaust bolts, run the engine till hot then spray them with penetrating oil two or three times letting the engine cool the last time before trying to loosen any of them. When you reassemble use plenty of anti seize.
 
I've had my best luck removing seized fasteners by heating them until cherry red and then quench em with a cold cloth. This usually breaks em free.
 
If you get your bolts out, OR if you get a replacement, when you go back with all the bolts and studs....even those in the head, coat them good with Permatex high temp RED silicone. That will seal them good and they will never seize up again.
 
Oldmanmopar said:
For the broken bolts. Unless you know someone with a mill don't let anyone drill it. It is easy to go off center. Then your screwed. The best way to remove broken bolts in cast iron is to build up the bolt with a tig weld,(not mig its brittle) Once you have metal protruding tig weld a nut on cool it with air instantly and turn it out. The nut and bolt? Take a sharp chisel and use the corner of the chisel to split one side of the nut. The nuts are soft and split easy. An air chisel would be the best. but a big hammer works. Don't try to easy-out those broken bolts , They broke for a reason . They are froze in the hole, so the only way is to drill and retap using a drill press our a mill to make sure you are on center. or do the weld proceedure. If you don't have these tools take it to someone who does.
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THIS. You can tell when someone has experience doin sumffin.
 
Ok good news the bolts tie the exhaust pipe the manifold haveet their demise (manical laugh).

I cut one of and bought broke me back loosening the other with brute force.

I am going to a machine shop with it to get the broke bolts out.

Next question replacement bolts? Stainless graded or what?
 
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