brake pedal too high

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SirDan

SirDan

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car is a 73 dart swinger that was orginally power disc and auto trans but converted to manual disk and 4 speed using parts from a 76 duster.

The brakes are all bled out and feel good just the pedal is high. Its about an inch higher than the clutch pedal. The rod measures 6 1/4 inches from the middle of the bolt hole to the tip and has no adjustment just a solid rod.

Not sure why it is so high up there. I'm thinking to fix it to either cut the rod down and weld it or make a spacer for the master cylinder. Any suggestions or help?
 
i dont have a rod to reference but i do know that when in went from power brakes to manual i had to change my brake push rod. i would NEVER!!!!!! cut and re-weld a brake push rod. if it were ever to fail it would make for a bad situation. you can order an adjustable push rod or head to the local wrecking yard and have a look for one that is a little shorter.
 
...which brake pedal did you use? I am not 100% sure but there were some differences either in the pedal and /or the mounting hole up in the dash. Manual brake cars needed more leverage so the lever action was different on the brake pedal. I believe the manual brake cars had the brake pedal mounted lower and the distance from the pivot to the pushrod was shorter.
Might cause the pedal to sit higher if you have the wrong pedal. They probably had a different rod also. I seem to remember this from a 76, PB valiant that I parted out. It was different than my 71 duster.
(some one chime in on this to tell me if I am wrong....)
 
the 76 duster had manual brakes and a 4 speed. So I have the manual rod and pedals. no idea why it sits higher though.

I might be able to cut the end off then grind it round instead of doing any welding. I'm just wondering what the o ring on the rod is for.
 
What master cylinder,are you using? You did not grab.or re-use the 76 one.My bet,the 76 Matching master,has a deeper recess.You still using,the original master,before the swap?
 
I would check,who you bought that master from,match the number you bought,vs the 76 part number.Have em check the picture catalog.Sorry, I am a way anal parts guy.
 
The full length of the brake rod is 6 3/4" a body length is supposed to be 6 1/2" ill have to fix it i guess.
 
SirDan said:
I might be able to cut the end off then grind it round instead of doing any welding. I'm just wondering what the o ring on the rod is for.
Click to expand...

The O ring holds the rod into the master cylinder, it prevents the push rod from being easily pulled out (and falling out) of the master cyl.
 
I also have this problem. I have a 1967 Barracuda that I swapped over to disc brakes back in 1987. My donor vehicle was a 1974 Duster so when the master cylinder started leaking I ordered a new one for manual disc/drum and I have the same pedal problem.

I already took my old master cylinder back to NAPA for the core and now I wished I had hung onto it until I had the new one installed and it looked right. I also have a pedal that is about an inch higher than the clutch and before it was the same height.

I don't have the brakes bled yet so I think I'm going to take it back off and try to find the one that fits correctly. That should prove to be the ultimate pain-in-the-*** because there must be 15 master cylinders that will "work" on my car but I want to find the one that leaves the pedal even with the clutch.

I'm a little anal when it comes to this but besides the obvious issue of it not looking correct, I also see it as a safety issue. I'm used to driving the car with both pedals even and if the brake pedal is too far back I'm not sure I'd remember that in an emergency situation.

The search begins..........
 
Ive noticed the same problem also. I have converted a 69 swinger from power disc to manual and a 68 valiant from power drum to manual. I purchased two used pushrods from manual cars and noticed the pedal is way up off the floor. I tried the adjustable pushrod from mancini on the 69 swinger and you cant make it short enough to solve the problem. I reused the same master cylinders on both cars, and i dont think that is the problem. Someone stated in an earlier post that the pedal may be different, and that makes the most sense. if some one has some info on pedals, that may help solve this problem.
 
SirDan said:
The full length of the brake rod is 6 3/4" a body length is supposed to be 6 1/2" ill have to fix it i guess.
Click to expand...
where did you find this information? i purchased two rods at different times from members here and must have the wrong lenghts for both.
 
FWIW, I don't remember if the donor vehicle had a high pedal. The guy was a mopar guy so for all I know he converted it and used the wrong pushrod.

Vitamin c said:
where did you find this information? i purchased two rods at different times from members here and must have the wrong lenghts for both.
Click to expand...

Brewers has the lengths listed for the ones they sell.

http://www.brewersperformance.com/products.asp?cat=279

I cut and welded mine to 6 1/2" end to end. pedal height is GREAT now!

downsized_1224121501_zps308b6138.jpg


I also noticed the master cylinder came with one of those o rings so i slapped that on there as well. very happy with the results. I would not recommend cutting and welding unless you know what your doing.
 
Nice find! and cut/weld job! 50.00 bucks is steep for a reconditioned rod, but im not sure welding is the way to go. Im an average welder with access to a nice miller wire feed so ill have to sleep on this one and decide.:glasses7:
 
Always tig weld not mig. Mig welds are to brittle for this use. some of the later cars have a different pedal. The way to tell is the arm is sideways at the pad. Also sometimes that rubber is already in the master . So you need to remove the old one from the rod so it goes in the proper depth. Do not reuse the old rubber or brake failure is sure to happen. There are different length rods. 73 back to 67 are all the same manual disc or drum
 
I'm not sure about the length of my push rod, but OldManMopar said they were all the same from 73 back to 67 so I will agree with that. My 1967 Barracuda came from the factory with the four piston fixed calipers in front and manual master cylinder.

When I upgraded my brakes back in 1987 with the more modern sliding caliper and larger upper ball joints I just went to NAPA and asked for a new master cylinder for a 1974 Duster with manual brakes and it worked great. One thing I do remember about the master cylinder I removed here a few weeks ago is it had a retainer clip (pic) holding the piston in the cast iron body and not the more modern snap ring.

I wonder if this is how I would tell whether or not I had the correct master cylinder for my car or would that external retaining clip be independent of the depth of the recess in the piston. If the depth of the recess was greater to would allow my push rod to go deeper into the piston and therefore let my brake pedal rest in the proper resting position.

I have not changed the brake pedal in my car, there is only one hole for the push rod bolt and everything else is the same as when I purchased the car which leads me to believe it has to be the wrong master cylinder.

Merry Christmas to all!!
 

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That is the same MC i have on the two cars im having trouble with. That little tab is very soft and not very safe. When trying to install the adjustable push rod to lower my pedal, i tried pulling up on the pedal to unseat the rubber retainer on the origional pushrod and it just pulled the piston out the back and dumped the fluid all over the new carpet. Then I noticed a buddies car had the snap ring style, that places the piston a little deeper into the bore, so I tried to fab up a tab that would push the piston in my MC further into the bore to lower the pedal. It wouldnt let the brakes release properly, so that was a no go. Is there i different part number for the MC with the snap ring? Or would it be wise to switch to the newer aluminum style MC?
 
I ordered the following from rockauto.com for a '73 Duster 340 with power disc to run on my '69 Barracuda with manual disc cause I wanted the 15/16" bore. Direct bolt on. It has a snap ring:

RAYBESTOS Part # MC36406 Professional Grade; Bore Size=15/16" One of our most popular parts Front Disc Brakes; Power Brakes
 
IMO, I think its better to use the later 2 bolt aluminum master cylinder, with the adapter plate.

IMG_2179.jpg
 
If you are concerned about the shaft fracturing from being welded, weld it, grind it down, then sleeve it covering the weld joint.
 
my apologies, maybe not "better", but imo, and opinions most certainly vary, i think it LOOKS better than a cast iron piece that people rarely paint and starts to rust away...it's also 'lighter', not much to make a difference all by itself, but every little bit helps, and i like the twist off caps to add or check brake fluid, no need to get a straight screwdriver and pry off the spring retaining clamp...:)
 
Somebody must have moved the brake switch a lot to set the pedal 1" higher than the clutch pedal.

The adapter plate will move the MC further out. You can use just about any alum 2-hole MC if the ports work and bore diameter is right. Many use an MC from an 80's Dodge truck and most people prefer 7/8"D or 15/16"D bore for manual disk brakes.

Haven't tried, but doubt the rod could drop out of the MC once installed. I expect the O-ring eliminates rattles. Cutting and grooving your rod sounds smarter than welding.
 
Here is what my pedals look like with the master cylinder installed. There is a significant difference in the pedal height. I'm going to remove the master cylinder and see if I can work with my local NAPA store (the guys are pretty cool) to find the right one. The master I removed had the brake pedal at the perfect height.
 

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