Dyno testing a stock(?) 1972 440
very kewl thread.........thanks iq........what was the total cost of all the componants? u have a guestimate?
higgs
Don't have a total, just bought inexpensive stuff for the most part. HV oil pump, stock intermediate shaft (rats, I broke all the rules on that one didn't I? Too bad.) 85 psi cold at rpm, 81 psi at 5800 hot (pull that down to 60 psi and we're over 450 HP), 45 psi idle hot. The cylinder heads would be the expense with the porting, valves, springs, retainers, and locks.
I think it would run some strong 11s in an A body with the right gears.
Near 11.60-11.70 @ 3600#
I agree. I want to see what the loss is at the higher rpm with the manifolds. I have guys asking me this all the time, "how much will I loose with manifolds". And I would like to know what size pipe your running with the manifolds.
Thanks for this thread Jim, its very informative. What was your idle set to, and what was the Vacuum? Not much I bet.
2-1/2" stub right to 3". The thing would idle at 650 rpm 4"-5", 7.5" @ 1000
LOL I really dont see how its a definitive answer that flow Trumps compression on this thread. The compression part wasnt even tested, just the flow.
Cylinder pressure is power, no matter how you get it. Low compression with high flow or low flow with high compression, the results will be about the same. But combined the 2, high flow and high compression and you will see the power go way up.
Take for instance 2 kinds of Circle Track engines. One with max ported heads and big carb, intake, cam will make great power and they normally run around 9 to 1. On the other hand you can have a 2bbl class where head porting is not allowed, smaller intake, small carb limited on cam, but run 12 to 1 compression. The cylinder pressure is whats important. If you have low flow, the compression will help make the cylinder pressure higher for better performance. If you have high flow, the cylinder pressure will be higher and compression can be lower and still have great performance.
Cam design play a big role in this as well. Jim built a awesome 440 making good HP/TQ with less than 8 to 1 compression. Put flat tops on this engine, bump it up to 10 to 1 and it will make well over 500HP/TQ. Just having the piston close to the intake valve ont he intake stroke(*read* zero deck) will make the engine flow even more air, thus increasing the cylinder pressure and making more power.
What is shown here is, you dont need a lot of compression to make REAL power. Its great info. Definitely one for the memory banks for the low budget guys that think they can not make power without compression.
Right
Cool test.
Wonder how it would have run with an RPM on it. Probably right in that manifolds wheelhouse.
There's a post on slowparts about guys using low comp engines in their strip cars. Some run pretty stout.
I believe the RPM intake would have been superior, I only have one and it's on another 440 in a truck.
For a STREET engine that needs pump gas. I guess I left that part out. Of course the power will go up with more compression. But the ability for pump gas goes away. I get the *impression* here that Jim is trying to show us what can be had in a VERY pump gas friendly engine. In THOSE parameters, flow trumps compression. That's what I meant and I'm stickin with it.
Darn tired of hearing that the first thing you gotta do is "get that compression up". So they take it to the edge and say, HOWAMI GONNA STOP THE DETONATION!
How are you going to make this one detonate?
No kiddin. This kinda stuff just shows that all those fancy high priced crate engines aren't necessary for a good stout street car. Essentially, you can take a stone stock short block, cam it throw some good heads and intake on and have some real power. For a lot less than the 10K stupidity. I think that's Jim's point and it's a goodun.
pahzackly
GREAT thread, and thanks for sharing! Couple of questions. You never mentioned the head gasket thickness and whether or not the 516's were big or small ex. valve. Also, the test was done with a .509..was it installed straight up, or advanced. Also, what of low comp. specific grinds, like the Hughes Whiplash. What's your opinion on these..what do you think the differences would be on the dyno sheet?
8519PT1 gasket, 2.14/1.81, 509/108 LS/103 ICL
Whiplash? Never run one. I think they are for guys who can't make 'um run........so gimme noise. Kinda like, If it don't go fast, CHROME IT!
Doesn't mean I'm right, but that's what I think, you know, my opinion. Get the cylinder heads flowing right on the exhaust side. Put on any set of headers, even shorties. And get rid of the long exhaust duration because you won't need it. Speak softly and carry a big stick. Who wants to sound fast and go slow? Really
