A body sports car handling

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Lots of good advice here for you to sort through. I would just add body stiffening to the mix. Our unibody cars flex like crazy. Eliminating body flex will help you keep the car planted, improving handling as well as safety. If you can weld or know some one can you can take 2"X2" square steel tubing and make your own sub-frame connectors for cheap.
 

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Jim Lusk said:
Many people like the light spring/big sway bar approach. I like big spring/large sway bar.

Check out the suspension on lilcuda's car (when I sold it to the guy he bought it from it still had stock handling package suspension. He's taken it a bit beyond that).
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I had 340 t-bars on it for a long time along with a 1 1/8" front bar and a 3/4" rear bar. Now it has the same sway bars, but with 1" Firm Feel t-bars and FF upper control arms.
 
Lee, does it still have the original steering box in it? The car has to be close to 200,000 miles, give or take...
 
63/64 Darts have different front wheel wells than Valiants/Baracudas and 205/60R15 is the biggest that will fit on front. Unless you trim the bottom inside edge of the front fenders.


Jim Lusk said:
805 is about spot on. As far as tires, Lee (lilcuda) is running 215-60-15 Yokohamas on all four corners. That is in stock wheel wells. You have to ask Lee if there is more room or how those tires perform.
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Jim Lusk said:
Lee, does it still have the original steering box in it? The car has to be close to 200,000 miles, give or take...
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No, it has a 16:1 manual box I put in about 20 years ago. It had been gone through by the guy I bought it from. I'm assuming "gone through" means new bearings and seals.
 
I have 2, 7" x 14" steel rims fitted with 235/60R14 tyres under the back of a 62 Valiant sedan.....they are within the guards all round.
 

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lilcuda said:
No, it has a 16:1 manual box I put in about 20 years ago. It had been gone through by the guy I bought it from. I'm assuming "gone through" means new bearings and seals.
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Yeah, now I seem to remember...it's hell getting old, you know...
 
Couldn't you just run complete C body tie rod setup? Outer, inner and tube? Maybe weld a bit of the slot up in the middle to eliminate distortion? I dunno. Good thread! Just asking.
 
lilcuda said:
I had 340 t-bars on it for a long time along with a 1 1/8" front bar and a 3/4" rear bar. Now it has the same sway bars, but with 1" Firm Feel t-bars and FF upper control arms.
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can you post a pic of your rear sway bar and exhaust routing, are there any clearance issues?
 
Rice Nuker said:
Couldn't you just run complete C body tie rod setup? Outer, inner and tube? Maybe weld a bit of the slot up in the middle to eliminate distortion? I dunno. Good thread! Just asking.
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I put C body tie rods on my Barracuda. I didn't weld the slots though.
 
340duster340 said:
can you post a pic of your rear sway bar and exhaust routing, are there any clearance issues?
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I can take a pic and post it in the next couple days. No clearance issues on my car. My exhaust was done by a really talented exhaust guy.
 
While I did buy those 11/16" tie rods from mopardude, I'll throw this into the mix for the tie rods.

The problem is not the 9/16" ends flexing. The problem is the standard slotted adjuster. Using a solid tube adjuster and 9/16" ends will solve pretty much all the flex in the tie rod that most folks will ever encounter. I would assume that the "trick" of using the 11/16" tie rods came about using stock hardware, an 11/16" adjuster is quite a bit beefier than a 9/16". But a tubular 9/16" adjuster is better than a stock slotted 11/16" adjuster.

You can buy a set of Global West tubular adjusters for $60 at Summit. That's for the pair! The $49 at PST is for one adjuster. I've only been able to find the Global West sleeves in 9/16" though.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/gls-adj-6/overview/make/dodge

I wouldn't personally mess with welding up a stock adjuster. While that might help some, the wall thickness of the stock adjuster is still pretty minimal, so just welding it up won't eliminate the flex problem. And, if you're REALLY lucky, you'll warp the stock adjuster welding it up, causing yourself unnecessary alignment grief later.
 
72bluNblu said:
While I DID buy those 11/16" tie rods from mopardude, I'll throw this into the mix for the tie rods.

The problem is not the 9/16" ends flexing. The problem is the standard slotted adjuster. Using a solid tube adjuster and 9/16" ends will solve pretty much all the flex in the tie rod that most folks will ever encounter.

You can buy a set of Global West tubular adjusters for $60 at Summit. That's for the pair! The $49 at PST is for one adjuster. I've only been able to find the Global West sleeves in 9/16" though.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/gls-adj-6/overview/make/dodge

I wouldn't personally mess with welding up a stock adjuster. While that might help some, the wall thickness of the stock adjuster is still pretty minimal, so just welding it up won't eliminate the flex problem. And, if you're REALLY lucky, you'll warp the stock adjuster welding it up, causing yourself unnecessary alignment grief later.
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uhh... no its not for one adjuster... the ones i ordered last week are sitting on my kitchen table... 66 shipped for a pair of 11/16 billet steel sleeves and a pr or rubber torsion boot seals...
 
805moparkid said:
uhh... no its not for one adjuster... the ones i ordered last week are sitting on my kitchen table... 66 shipped for a pair of 11/16 billet steel sleeves and a pr or rubber torsion boot seals...
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That's not what their website says, but if you say that's what you got I believe you.

This is why grammar is important. Sleeve is one, sleeves is two. And if you say tie rod sleeve $49, 2 per car, folks think you need to buy 2.
 
72bluNblu said:
That's not what their website says, but if you say that's what you got I believe you.

This is why grammar is important. Sleeve is one, sleeves is two. And if you say tie rod sleeve $49, 2 per car, folks think you need to buy 2.
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no agree, and i honestly was wondering if i needed a pair by their site as well, quick call to clear it up.
 
something cool on this site would be to "call" or "tag" someone in the thread, so in this call "tag/call" the pst vendor and have them get a notification they were needed in this thread.
 
A/MP said:
w/o the harsh ride.
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I think we should not forget this part of A/MP question. IMO the torsen bar suspension on Mopar's of the day were some of the best out there when it came to handling and road feel so you have something already good to work with. When comes down to it I'm sure there's a price to pay in ride quality when you stiffen springs and bushings, added bracing, increase wheel diameter and so on. For those of you those of you that have done such "improvements" it would be nice to here from about how the ride as well handling was effected in your car (good or bad)?:thumbup:

Great thread by way!
 
well...i had the 1 inch diam. torsion bars in my 68 fastback, and a 1 1/8 sway bar. i adjusted the QA1 shocks accordingly..ride wasnt harsh at all..in fact i woulda gone with 1.03 bars, or even larger...
 
You can also make a "Monte Carlo" bar to tie the front end together and can feel the difference that will make. Yes, I know that it is a Ford idea and have no problem stealing it.
 
amx364 said:
You can also make a "Monte Carlo" bar to tie the front end together and can feel the difference that will make. Yes, I know that it is a Ford idea and have no problem stealing it.
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You are gonna hafta 'splain.....................................
 
The bar ties the right and left suspension points together and give less body flexing when cornering. Mustang "Monte Carlo" bars for early Shelby's. Can not buy for a Mopar so must make it yourself, but that means costs are very low. If you tie it to fenders, to clear the motor easy then you will see the paint crack at that location. Forces transferring to other side due to "spirited" driving on street driving.
 
amx364 said:
The bar ties the right and left suspension points together and give less body flexing when cornering. Mustang "Monte Carlo" bars for early Shelby's. Can not buy for a Mopar so must make it yourself, but that means costs are very low. If you tie it to fenders, to clear the motor easy then you will see the paint crack at that location. Forces transferring to other side due to "spirited" driving on street driving.
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you do understand that very little of the force generated is transferred into the shock towers? most all the force goes into the k frame and frame rails. now if he was running the stupid magnum force system that STILL uses the shock tower as the coil mount then yes it could help.
 
Enough to crack the paint where it is mounted. I would try to mount near the front upper bushings and try to make a section that comes out to do engine work. To remove a 1 piece bar is not much fun.
 
I would do this stregnthing under the fender... sorta tri-angulate the firewall/cowl area into the the upper shock mount area.
 
the lower control arm stiffening plates are also a worth while addition. they unitize the control arm and help limit deflection.

I think it is AR engineering that sells them for like $25
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