Experince with B&M 50442 - B&M Tork Master Converter

-
trebor75

trebor75

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 12, 2009
Messages
980
Reaction score
447
Location
Sweden
Hello! I have another thread going on in the small block tech about sudden loss of get up and go power. Here it is if you are interested: http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=277904

My car is all of a sudden sluggish of the line and I cant for my life understand whats wrong all of a sudden. It runs great, no bogs, everything is tuned and it ran great just a week ago. It is like my converter no longer stall the 3000 it should. I dont know if it is because my engine lost torque or if my not even a year old converter has gone bad. The trans was gone through by a shop last summer and the converter I put in at the same time. A B&M Tork Master 3000 stall. What I'm asking here is, have anybody had a converter gone bad that fast, especially a B&M. I know it's a cheap one, but I dont have the most powerfull enginge either. The trans shifts great, but the converter don't flash or slip as it did before when taking of. Im suspecting it is not the engine because like I said, it runs great but is sluggish of the line, no bog though. Here's the combo. And again, it ran great last week, just as it always had before with this set up.

1970 duster
1965 - 273 commando
Cam: Comp Cams Magnum 282S - 282/282 Lift 495/495 (solid) Beehive Springs
Edelbrock D4B intake / Holley 670 Street Avenger
Pertronix Ignitor & Flame Thrower coil
Hooker Headers
2.5" Dual Exhaust / Super 44 Flowmaster
8 3/4 - 3.55 - SureGrip
727 auto / Shift Kit
10" 3000 stall converter
B&M Quicksilver Shifter
 
B&M makes good shifters. I'll stop right there.
 
Any metal (steel or bronze) or clutch like material in the oil? If the converter is going away, it could be the one-way (sprag) roller clutch, the vanes on the converter pump coming loose, bronze(brass) from any brazing that may have come off the pump vanes, cluch like material from the fibre washer in the converter, used by some instead of bearings to support the inards of the unit, and if there is a bearing used, the bearing itself coming apart. The sad part is if the converter is coming apart, there isn't anything you personally can do to repair it.
Drop the pan and check for junk in the pan/filter. If it's clean,pull the transmission and converter out, if you've eliminated all other possible causes for the lack of power. Tip the converter over and drain the oil see if any junk falls out.
I feel for you.
 
I hear you guys. Transman, thank you for your input. I have a drain plug in the front of the trans so I did a quick lift and drained the oil, I did not get it all out cause I had to lift the car up front, it's not very much space where I have the car so I could not lift it out back tonight. I did get much of it though. After filtering the oil this is what I ended up with, The texture of it is crisp. English is not my first language so I hope you get what Im trying to say. It's brittle, is that the right word, anyway, its not soft and it comes apart if you push against it. It's not metal though. A magnet would not catch it. There could very well be more of it in my drain jug that I could not get out by just taping the oil through the filter.
 

Attachments

  • 2.jpg
    64.2 KB · Views: 226
Quality custom converter = more power, more reliability simple as that. I could slap you on the hand for cheapening out on the most important part of your build. Experience is the best teacher sometimes.
 
PoisonDart74 said:
Better converter = more power, simple as that, I could slap you on the hand for cheapening out on the most important part of your build. Experience is the best teacher sometimes.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure it's the converter yet. It's my first build ever, came from no experience, learning by doing, reading, doing wrong, correcting etc.Believe me when I tell you that putting together a car like this in Sweden is anything but cheap. Buying parts from the US, shipping, customs, you get it.
 
All the more reason to do it right the first time. Not gonna play nice here, you had the forum, you could have asked, 'Hey whats a worthwhile converter because I live in Sweden' or searched and found the answer. The topic comes up three times a day. Sorry, just how it is. Enjoy your weekend!
 
PoisonDart74 said:
All the more reason to do it right the first time. Not gonna play nice here, you had the forum, you could have asked, 'Hey whats a worthwhile converter because I live in Sweden' or searched and found the answer. The topic comes up three times a day. Sorry, just how it is. Enjoy your weekend!
Click to expand...

I hear you and I can take it, no worries. Before tearing down the tranny I would greatly appreciate some input on the picture I posted. Anybody? I also have this thread going on the engine in the smallblock section if you have the time: http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/...d.php?t=277904
 
I've run B&M in several street cars with no problems.
I wouldn't run one in a drag car that I was trying to race
but street no problem.
 
Here is some more info for you. When I start up my engine when its cold it fast idles at 1500 rpm until reaching operating temp and then it drops down to normal idling. My converter used to slip enough for me to easily drop it into drive/reverse at 1500 rpm. Now it's not like that. I could also by holding the breaks rev it up to approx 3000 rpm and then release and take of hard. Now if i try this the car wants to go forward hard even at 1600 rpm.

Some questions I have:
1. can loss of torque from enginge cause such a big differnece? To me the engine runs just fine, I still have more to check though.
2. See the picture above, what do you think this material comes from?
3. Could my problem be tranny releated, or is it the converter?
4. With this material in the oil, ,I need to drop the tranny anyways and have it looked up by a shop?

Tranny was gone trough last summer, have not been driving very much since. Converter swapped to a brand new at the same time.

Need the tranny experts advice here!
 
Sounds like you broke the converter by putting it in gear at 1500 RPM. That's entirely too high to drop it into gear.
 
The stuff on the picture actually was plastic and came from the brand new oil spill jug. Thats a relief. No metal, no bronze in the oil, it does not smell burnt either.
 
Do you have a spare input shaft, or can you get one. If you can, stick it in the converter and twist the shaft. If the sprag is good, one direction will be easy, the other not so easy. If it's easy in both directions, the one way roller clutch may be defective.
The big problem is trying to GUESS what is wrong with a converter as they are a sealed unit. There have been some good ideas passed your way, but again, unless you cut the converter open you never really know what is going on inside.
I wish I could give you better information.
 
Hmmm....could the same thing be done by taking the bolts out of the flexplate and trying to rotate it on the input shaft while still installed, or would that not work the same way?

If the converter went bad (worn impeller/stator vanes) wouldn't it essentially "stall" to a higher RPM? Or is it possible there is seizing inside that basically turns it into a lockup converter?
 
txstang84 said:
I think I already asked this once, but do you take off in Drive or 1st?
Click to expand...

I have a B&M quicksilver so I have tried both. If in drive, it does take of in first. If I cruise and stomp it, it will either shift to second or first depending on speed. So the tranny shifts perfect.

transman said:
Do you have a spare input shaft, or can you get one. If you can, stick it in the converter and twist the shaft. If the sprag is good, one direction will be easy, the other not so easy. If it's easy in both directions, the one way roller clutch may be defective.
The big problem is trying to GUESS what is wrong with a converter as they are a sealed unit. There have been some good ideas passed your way, but again, unless you cut the converter open you never really know what is going on inside.
I wish I could give you better information.
Click to expand...

I really appreciate your help. Like txstang84 wrote: "could the same thing be done by taking the bolts out of the flexplate and trying to rotate it on the input shaft while still installed"?

txstang84 said:
Hmmm....could the same thing be done by taking the bolts out of the flexplate and trying to rotate it on the input shaft while still installed, or would that not work the same way?

If the converter went bad (worn impeller/stator vanes) wouldn't it essentially "stall" to a higher RPM? Or is it possible there is seizing inside that basically turns it into a lockup converter?
Click to expand...

Good thinking! I hope this works!
 
....................maybe the weights are seized in the dist, check ur timing.....if the converter is going bad u will have lower stall speed ....kim.......
 
txstang84 said:
Hmmm....could the same thing be done by taking the bolts out of the flexplate and trying to rotate it on the input shaft while still installed, or would that not work the same way?

" This might work, although I've never heard of it being done this way. Remember doing it this way, you're also turning the pump and the forward drum." transman

If the converter went bad (worn impeller/stator vanes) wouldn't it essentially "stall" to a higher RPM? Or is it possible there is seizing inside that basically turns it into a lockup converter?
Click to expand...
It might if there was a major failure inside the converter, but with the lack of metal in the oil, I'm wondering if there is a converter issue at all. If the impeller or the pump or the stator vanes came apart, there'd be a lot of contamination in the oil.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
-

Back
Top