Sometimes brand loyalty really sucks....

grassy said
Actually, I was referring t the ferds..

I remember the Pony and Stellar....they have come a loooong way since then...Kia has a long way to go to catch Hyundai.

Were we live, they are all the same basic price...

Just as a note, we put 345 K on our civic and went to buy another and they just felt chinzy...so we moved to Subaru in '95 ....800k later, we are on out third chalking up 100 k...instead of the legacy, we bought an imprenza...my wife likes the smaller car but it doesn't feel as solid..

Oh, my wife rents a lot and she had a new civic...I took it out and it just felt numb..but this is what folks want nowadays...I was bored within the first mile...reliable or not, they certainly not fun...

Since Hyundai has acquired Kia, they're working on it.

And what you're talking about with Honda and Subaru is pretty much the standard game plan. They're going in reverse of what Hyundai's been doing. The little POS's from the '80's and '90's (you'll never hear anyone say an Excel was a good car) are still over the company's head.

To me, Honda's reputation today is what they built up over the years, but can't quite reach the bar of yesterday.