My 340 is pretty tired, and I may rebuild at a later date. I found a good price on a low mileage 2014 5.7 out of a truck. I have an MSD Atomic injection set up plumbed already in the car, so aside from the spark controller from MSD, an oil pan/pickup , filter remote set up and an intake and an adapter for the 727 and headers..... my main concern is the VVT on the Hemi. Will the VVT continue to operate on oil pressure/rpm, or is there another way to control it without the stock ECM? Been looking in the sticky section and havent found an answer yet.
Considering 2014 Hemi (5.7) 1971 Demon
- Thread starter chaditotx
- Start date
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If you are interested in selling your 340, PM me & let me know. I'd like to have it to build a backup motor for my 71 Demon bracket racer.
Thanks.
Thanks.
Joe Dokes
Well-Known Member
Chaditotx,
It is my BELIEF, that the MSD controller will only work on the 03-08 5.7 motors, and will not work on your VVT motor.
As of right now there also APPEARS to be no aftermarket control of VVT from a standalone controller. As a result I'd strongly recommend a stock computer and a wiring harness from Hot-Wire. Megasquirt has a VVT controller but I don't think anyone has gotten it to work with the Hemi, YET.
What intake are you running?
One option is to get a VVT lockout kit from Comp Cams, remove the MDS lifters and actuators from the motor, and then get the appropriate plugs for your motor. Unfortunately this may still NOT work as Chrysler changed the tone ring on the crank in 2009, and I am UNSURE if the MSD Hemi 6 controller can read the 09 and later tone rings.
Hope this helps,
Regards,
Joe Dokes
It is my BELIEF, that the MSD controller will only work on the 03-08 5.7 motors, and will not work on your VVT motor.
As of right now there also APPEARS to be no aftermarket control of VVT from a standalone controller. As a result I'd strongly recommend a stock computer and a wiring harness from Hot-Wire. Megasquirt has a VVT controller but I don't think anyone has gotten it to work with the Hemi, YET.
What intake are you running?
One option is to get a VVT lockout kit from Comp Cams, remove the MDS lifters and actuators from the motor, and then get the appropriate plugs for your motor. Unfortunately this may still NOT work as Chrysler changed the tone ring on the crank in 2009, and I am UNSURE if the MSD Hemi 6 controller can read the 09 and later tone rings.
Hope this helps,
Regards,
Joe Dokes
Damn that's good info. Haven't bought anything yet , just trying to figure out which way to go.
This car was a bracket racer back in the early 90s before I bought it. Motor hasn't been apart since. I bought it 2 years ago after it set. Overbore is unknown at this time, and car was originally a 318 car I will let you know .
Hellcat Cuda
Well-Known Member
Joe Dokes points out the very valid concerns and issues for retroing a later ('09 up 5.7 and '11 up 392) into our old Mopars. The easiest, most simple method would be an '05 down 5.7 truck engine or any 6.1. With that said, certainly the newer engines are the most tempting because they are, well, NEWER and have more hp.
Get in touch with Dave Weber at Modern Mopar Muscle Group who can set you up with a modified OEM ECM and a harness to go with it. If you go this route, I'm pretty sure you can retain the MDS and VVT. I like simple, but this IS pretty cool technology.
Get in touch with Dave Weber at Modern Mopar Muscle Group who can set you up with a modified OEM ECM and a harness to go with it. If you go this route, I'm pretty sure you can retain the MDS and VVT. I like simple, but this IS pretty cool technology.
Joe Dokes
Well-Known Member
The 09 and later motors have a number of advantages. I would not shy away. Just be aware that you're probably going to run a factory computer, and according to the buzz you can now tune them to your hearts desire.
If I didn't already have a 6.1 L Hemi, I'd probably get an 09 and later 5.7. The 09 heads are phenomenal and with the truck motor at 390 hp a great value.
If I didn't already have a 6.1 L Hemi, I'd probably get an 09 and later 5.7. The 09 heads are phenomenal and with the truck motor at 390 hp a great value.
MopaR&D
Nerd Member
Any improvements to the block for the '09-up 5.7? From what I've read here and there the hot ticket for swapping into an older car is an '08-down block with '09-up heads... best of both worlds??
Joe Dokes
Well-Known Member
The ONLY advantage to running an early block with late model heads would be that you can get a better timing chain. Currently there are no double rollers for the VVT setup.
Also, the early pistons with the smaller chamber heads and the early pistons with a slight dome would result in a very high compression ratio over 11:1. This would be too high for pump gas, but if you were building for E85 it might work. Though, I think piston to valve clearance MIGHT. Also the intake and exhaust port are shaped like the 6.1L Hemi, so changes to intake and exhaust manifolds would be in order.
The short answer to running Eagle (09 and later) heads on a 03-08 Hemi block is to build a fresh motor, choosing the right pistons and manifolds to get the best performance. Personally, I'd just buy a 09 and be done with it.
Regards,
Joe Dokes
MopaR&D
Nerd Member
Great info I wasn't aware of that thanks. I forgot Chrysler changed the valve angles and the chambers got smaller as a result.
That sloppy vvt timing set always scared us too. Thats why on our eagle crate we use a shorter proprietary performance timing set, with a custom spring tensioner.
Also correct me fully if im wrong, as we dont mess with the pre eagles, but isn't there a spacer involved with new heads on the old block? Intake spacing differs if I remember correct.
Also correct me fully if im wrong, as we dont mess with the pre eagles, but isn't there a spacer involved with new heads on the old block? Intake spacing differs if I remember correct.
72BBSwinger
Well-Known Member
Heads will swap fine but the later heads need later valve covers.
Joe Dokes
Well-Known Member
A thicker head gasket is sometimes used to lower the compression ratio to a more acceptable level. The Eagle heads have bigger intake ports so the early intake manifolds won't fit without modification.
I wasn't aware that any aftermarket timing sets were available for the Eagle motors. Glad to hear that the aftermarket is catching up.
Regards,
Joe Dokes
Idk about the rest of the aftermarket, as ours is proprietary to our eagle. But ours is a heck of alot shorter and tighter than the oe one we take off. I didnt care for the factory tensioner, or the clunky oe upper timing gear either. We replace all of it. With performance / longevity in mind, I was happy with how it came out.
CichliDart
Well, where is it now?
Please let us know if you guys decide to sell these. I am sure you will get a enough business to make a profit.
Mike
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