Waterless Coolant

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chasb

chasb

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Has anyone tried the Evans waterless coolant system I have a 440 dart GTS ( bored to 472) Runs hot after flushing the system, adding new coolant, adding a shroud, adding an electric push fan and adding an overflow tank.

Runs at 180-185 on the highway but around town gets up to 210/220

I read the posts on the "Do all A bodies overheat" thread but I'm still at a loss. Thinking of trying this. Any experience/opinions?? Thanks
 
Your problem is airflow at low speed. If you aren't going directly after your airflow at low speed issues, you are wasting your time, in my opinion.
 
I'm running the Evans in my '69 Dart 340.

I do notice the engine runs hotter, near 3/4 of the temperature gauge, whereas before Evans, it was around the 1/4 mark on the gauge.

I tried it because I wanted to avoid a hose blow off in stop and go traffic (I now have A/C installed), as it does not create as much pressure in the system as coolant/water.

Evans did mention the engine temp would be slightly hotter, and it does run a bit hotter now, but without the danger of over boiling though.
 
chasb said:
Has anyone tried the Evans waterless coolant system I have a 440 dart GTS ( bored to 472) Runs hot after flushing the system, adding new coolant, adding a shroud, adding an electric push fan and adding an overflow tank.

Runs at 180-185 on the highway but around town gets up to 210/220

I read the posts on the "Do all A bodies overheat" thread but I'm still at a loss. Thinking of trying this. Any experience/opinions?? Thanks
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At 220° your engine is not overheating. Is it boiling over? Water boils at 212°. A 50/50 mix of antifreeze boils at 223° and for every pound of cooling system pressure you add 3°. With antifreeze and a 15# cap, your coolant won't boil until 268°. As mentioned, air flow is the key.
 
chasb said:
Has anyone tried the Evans waterless coolant system I have a 440 dart GTS ( bored to 472) Runs hot after flushing the system, adding new coolant, adding a shroud, adding an electric push fan and adding an overflow tank.

Runs at 180-185 on the highway but around town gets up to 210/220

I read the posts on the "Do all A bodies overheat" thread but I'm still at a loss. Thinking of trying this. Any experience/opinions?? Thanks
Click to expand...

Do you have a mechanical fan? Diameter, blade count, factory?

How many rows in your radiator? High efficiency core (higher fin count, tighter rows)

Pictures?

Do you run antifreeze? What ratio?

You have factory pulleys with factory ratios?
 
chasb said:
So fan size might be the problem??
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Your cooling system is capable of cooling the car, as indicated by the highway temps.

At low speeds (below about 35 mph) the cooling system is relying on the fan for airflow. Over that speed, you don't even need a fan.

So my best guess is that your fan is not capable of moving enough air or the air it is moving is not correct directed through the radiator.
 
I too had chased an overheating/runs hot issue in my A body.
While the rad looked ok, I also opted for a nice mopar clutch fan, shroud, flush and even added a pusher.
The fix was in the radiator itself, as the original rad had enough scale build up it just wouldn't cool at idle or constant high freeway speeds.
You didn't mention how old or what condition yours was in, and if originality is not a problem there are plenty of cheap aluminum ones.
 
Also make sure of the direction your electric fan is blowing in or out. To make sure your not going against yourself.
 
I am running the Evans. It save my motor when the thermostat stuck closed and it over heated rapidly before I could pull over.
So to say I am sold on it, even though it is on the pricey side.
 
Evans runs at Zero pressure. and boils at, some crazy, high temp. -- You'll cook Your motor before it boils. -- The zero pressure, can just hide other problems. -- If You use it, pay close attention to Your temperature.
 
Thanks everyone I am going to check the fan size and radiator itself. I do want to keep it the original black four core look but am not opposed to a black aluminum replacement if someone makes one.
toolmanmike said:
At 220° your engine is not overheating. Is it boiling over? Water boils at 212°. A 50/50 mix of antifreeze boils at 223° and for every pound of cooling system pressure you add 3°. With antifreeze and a 15# cap, your coolant won't boil until 268°. As mentioned, air flow is the key.
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Not boiling over. The cap is new I'm not sure what the number is.
 
BB73Challenger said:
I too had chased an overheating/runs hot issue in my A body.
While the rad looked ok, I also opted for a nice mopar clutch fan, shroud, flush and even added a pusher.
The fix was in the radiator itself, as the original rad had enough scale build up it just wouldn't cool at idle or constant high freeway speeds.
You didn't mention how old or what condition yours was in, and if originality is not a problem there are plenty of cheap aluminum ones.
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Radiator is 16 years old ( car was restored in 2001) Fan is direct not clutch, What model is the Mopar clutch fan? Will it work on the 440? I put a half moon shroud on as that is all that would fit. It arcs over the top. I do want to keep it original looking. Any aluminum radiators that are painted black that resemble the four core ?
 
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Evans is Propylene based just like RV antifreeze. You can purchase it at RV stores. Don't confuse it with the cheaper ethanol (alcohol) based products that is sold at Wal Mart.
 
toolmanmike said:
Evans - _ _ _ __ _ _ Don't confuse it with the cheaper ethanol (alcohol) based products that is sold at Wal Mart. --
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-- Mike -- You're correct, on that. It sells for , around, $45 per gallon, and You can't mix it - must use 100%. -- It was in My 408, when I bought it, and it hid a warped head. -- Obviously, I'm not a fan of it.
 
Well unfortunately that half moon shroud is not going to help.
I don't know about your big block application, but what I had done was measured my clearance, and walked a few swap meets before finding a used one for 5 bucks.
As for an aluminum radiator, I opted for a champion, and it is clearly aftermarket.
I'm not sure if there is an aluminum produced to look oem.
 
BB73Challenger said:
Well unfortunately that half moon shroud is not going to help.
I don't know about your big block application, but what I had done was measured my clearance, and walked a few swap meets before finding a used one for 5 bucks.
As for an aluminum radiator, I opted for a champion, and it is clearly aftermarket.
I'm not sure if there is an aluminum produced to look oem.
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I think there is an aluminum that is based on an OEMmbut as per normal I can't think of the name of the place. If I can find it, I'll post it up.
 
You can just have you current radiator checked for flow and blockage and go from there. You can get a high density core put in. Friend has one in his Hemi dart clone. Doesn't run a fan shroud to keep the original as delivered look.

Original 69 m-code 440 darts had fan shrouds. Don't know if the 340 shrouds are the same.

Here is a stock-ish looking aluminum radiator. Various resto parts places sell these. OER is not the only place that sells these. I've seen guys at local swap meet that sell aluminum radiators carry these.

OER Authorized aluminum Radiator
 
BB73Challenger said:
I'm not sure if there is an aluminum produced to look oem.
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I have a Griffin aluminum radiator in my car I think it was called the "exact fit" or something like that. When I called their 800 number, a guy told me it looked so much like an OEM Mopar radiator that a lot of people painted them black. When I got mine, I painted it black with Eastwood radiator paint, and I must say that it does rather look OEM.
 
BB73Challenger said:
Well unfortunately that half moon shroud is not going to help.
I don't know about your big block application, but what I had done was measured my clearance, and walked a few swap meets before finding a used one for 5 bucks.
As for an aluminum radiator, I opted for a champion, and it is clearly aftermarket.
I'm not sure if there is an aluminum produced to look oem.
Click to expand...
Look on Summits website, they have alum. shrouds that can be modified to fit anything. I had to split mine in the middle of the sides, and make it bolt together to even get it on my 440/505-w/ alum. griffin radiator, and run a short oil filter, because of no room w/ the 2 row -1 1/4' tube rad. Look at a early 90`s GM pick up shrouds for ideas. I don`t even have room for a short clutch fan. A mech. 17", and a 15" elec. booster in front that`s set to come on at 200, it doesn`t come on at all so far. Haven`t got the engine broke in yet tho, about 300 miles on it. Oh yeah, forgot, my rad. is a 28x19 crossflow, didn`t cut the rad. opening out for it either. the tanks are still behind the cradle.
 
I use Evans in 6 of my 7 vehicles. It won't cool better, indeed less so than pure water (w/ anti-corrosion). The main advantage is that you get no corrosion, so if it works for you now it will work the same in 20 years and your radiator and heater core will still be pristine. It may be better at giving even temperatures and no hot spots in the head, since it doesn't boil until ~350 F. BTW, it will burn. I heated some in a pot on a backyard grill since I thought it might have some water. After kind of forgetting, I came back in 30 min w/ it boiling strongly and noticed a barely visible flame above. It caught paper I held on fire, which the vapors alone shouldn't do (Ray Bradberry said >451 F). I understand that original Evans was pure propylene glycol, but today is a mixture w/ ethylene glycol (check MSDS). Some say they have a patent on finding that mixture is non-toxic. Some say you can get similar effect using 100% Sierra coolant which is propylene glycol and only $14/gal at Ace Hardware, though it specs a few percent water content. Perhaps you could boil the water off. I carry it in the trunk as backup, since sure don't want to resort to water after thoroughly drying my system.

My 1985 M-B diesel strangely started creeping hot at long stop lights after a year running Evans, but seems unrelated to Evans since last summer I tried pure water (isolated heater core) for a few weeks and no difference. I also citric-flushed again, w/ no change. I think it isn't moving water thru the radiator at idle, since I saw no water flow from the disconnected upper hose until I rev'ed the engine, and the temp quickly drops if I rev the engine at a stoplight, and never overheats when moving. Yes, I changed water pump, T-stat (several), checked hoses, checked radiator flow, changed radiator, yada, ... Not actually a problem since my mileage has increased from 22 mpg to 25 mpg in city/hwy commute. Thus, one idea is to run a hotter T-stat w/ Evans and enjoy the better mileage. My similar 1984 M-B runs Evans with no such temperature creep.
 
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Until you get your system sorted out, I highly recommend straight water with a water-pump lube,and a 7-blade direct drive fan,installed as close to the rad as you dare. Remember; it may want to suck the rad in at high rpm, so easy does it.
Afterwards you can experiment with anti-freeze,a thermostatic clutch, and after that, pressure reduction.
IMO, sacrificing cooling system capacity for oem appearance is ummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm, a bad idea. How much is a motor-job worth?
 
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