Problem with rear drum brakes

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Peter Ardell

Peter Ardell

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Hi!

When I bought my 1963 Dart wagon 3-4 months ago, the previous owner said that all drums was overhauled. I think that is sort of correct since both brake cylinders and the brake shoes look fresh.

However, the right drum brake does not work and the left one is not pushing shoe pointing backwards in a straight fashion.

I am a total rookie when it comes to drum brakes, so now I wonder: How do I know that they are fitted correctly? Look at those washers on top mount for the brake shoes (where the two springs are attached). Should they really be there? Are they needed to push the brake shoes in place against the plate?

The left brake shoes seems to be hold in place very sporadically? No plate/washer pushing the springs down?

Is the parts even made for these actual drum brakes?

If I want to buy spare parts (spring, shoes, dust covers for the two adjust holes in the back of the plate, etc), where do I find them?

Thanks in advance!

Kind regards /Pete

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HERE IS MY 66 7 1/4 REAR SHOES I TOOK A PICTURE OF BEFORE I REMOVED THEM ,THEY WORKED PERFECT
This was about 7 years ago :steering:

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And I believe I was told the pas side was on wrong, looks like the small brake show was not in the front as I think it should be, a good tec will be here soon and get you going :thumbsup:
 
Short shoe-front.
Cable with eye should be on before springs hook on anchor pin.
Hold down parts missing in second picture. Do yourself a huge favor,get a service manual
A new hardware kit is like 20 bucks, buy one. Its all the springs pins and caps.
Lastly get the proper tools to do the job. They make light work of a difficult task. I will never regret buying snap on tools for dealing with brake springs. Not a lot of coin, worth every penny. Imagine repeating the battle without the right tools 4 times. If anything,the right tools buy your sanity.

Dont drive it until its right.
I could go on,i want to leave room for others to comment.
 
Tooljunkie said:
Short shoe-front.
Cable with eye should be on before springs hook on anchor pin.
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Yes.

Tooljunkie said:
Hold down parts missing in second picture.
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Hm. That's what I thought. But look at Memike's installation above. Missing on both sides?

Tooljunkie said:
A new hardware kit is like 20 bucks, buy one. Its all the springs pins and caps.
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Do you have part number or web addresss?

Tooljunkie said:
Lastly get the proper tools to do the job. They make light work of a difficult task. I will never regret buying snap on tools for dealing with brake springs. Not a lot of coin, worth every penny. Imagine repeating the battle without the right tools 4 times. If anything,the right tools buy your sanity.
Click to expand...

Seen some spring tools. But which one of them is the best? Got picture of yours?

Kind regards /Pete
 
Also there are diagrams in the service manuals, which you can download from MyMopar

There is LOTS of pitfalls on drum brakes.........

If the drums are turned/ worn too large, the shoes effectively become "smaller" and contact only the center of the shoe surface. This means not only is your drum not effective anymore as a brake, but "all the work" (AND ALL THE HEAT) is on a small section of the brake lining. This wears and glazes the thing until it WON'T stop

Drums can be worn unevenly, "bell mouthed" and so on. This adds to poor braking

If they've been turned improperly, you can come up with chatter marks which make noise and decrease braking, as well as quickly wearing the lining, or "record player" spiral marks which pull the lining/ shoes sideways, then snap back, making a clickity--clickity sound, etc. There are others, those are a few
 
I am a total rookie when it comes to drum brakes, so now I wonder: How do I know that they are fitted correctly? Look at those washers on top mount for the brake shoes (where the two springs are attached). Should they really be there? Are they needed to push the brake shoes in place against the plate?

If I want to buy spare parts (spring, shoes, dust covers for the two adjust holes in the back of the plate, etc), where do I find them?
Click to expand...

Generally the best illustrations are in the service manuals. This was said before, I'm just agreeing. But there were changes from year to year. So the best for your will be1963.

Next, especially for you, will be all the tips and advice Chrysler offered their techs.
Most of those films and pamphlets are available on-line in a few different formats.
There's one for 1963 here: Master Technician Service Conference Films - 1960 to 1963
and you can scroll down this list for more before and after 63:
Master Technician Service Conference - Chrysler's Training for Mechanics

There's one in '67 about brake hydraulics and another in '69 about drum brakes. But be aware that in '67 the tandem brake master cylinders were introduced; and in '69 uses a new style of self-adjuster. That said, there's useful service tips and diagnostic concepts in both.

You should be able to get parts but it may require some hunting. Depends on how many other vehicles it was used on, and whether it was correctly entered into a catalog.
 
Peter Ardell said:
Those films are wonderful! Time for a beer. Saturday evening is saved!!!
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No matter how they look externally, always check the wheel cylinders for free piston movement, get a blunt tool like a dull smaller screwdriver or such and push in
beside the shoe "blade". All 4 pistons back there should move in fairly smoothly and easily, don't "jam" 'em in hard or more than about a 1/4", but they should go
there readily. My '64 'vert had a collapsed rear hose on the axle, make sure there is free-flow of fluid back there.
 
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Heres some choices, the kits are for both wheels.
 
If you get a hardware kit, I suggest one w/ the newer style self-adjusters (say 1971+ Dart). There are 9 & 10" drum systems. Looks like yours is 9". 10" has a triangle washer at the top to help secure the shoe ends. The 9" doesn't. I first thought those washers were missing in my 64 Valiant (based on 65 Dart w/ 10"), then found they were correct for 9". As said, swap your shoes on both sides (short lining to front). The washer on your L side is incorrect, but probably doesn't hurt if it fits. But keep it simple. Any parts that come lose can jam between shoe and drum, which happened in my 69 Dart when a self-adjuster cable broke.
 
Going back to post #1, as to the shoes coming out at an angle. that would be normal.The shoe moves in an arc, pivoting on the adjuster.
Consider that during use,with the drum installed; the shoes only move out a very little amount. And in the forward direction, the rear one moves hardly at all.
When you apply the brakes moving forward; the pistons move out, the spinning drum grabs the front shoe and jams the rear shoe,thru the star-adjuster,back onto the anchor, and then the braking begins.All the force goes into that pin. When moving in reverse everything happens in the other direction, but the force still ends up in the pin. And from there,yada,yada....lol
 
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