A903 to A833

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Coastie

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Howdy, y'all. 1st time posting here so sorry about any faux pas.

Anyways, ive got a 72 Dart swinger with a /6 and an A903. Currently im having a few issues with the trans;
1; when in neutral and not touching the clutch, i hear a whirling sound. Im thinking throw out bearing?
2; when driving, itll pop out of 2nd as soon as i start to let off the clutch. Its happening more often and really annoying me. Ideas on whats causing it? The problem didnt start till i had a shop grease up the linkages, but now theyre claiming synchros.

So with these problems (if theyre not easier fixes), i was considering swapping to a 4spd (found 1 that was mated to a /6 truck), a833. What would i need to do? I read on hotrod that theyre the same size, so i can reuse my driveshaft and only need a bell housing (and cutting a hole in the the floor). Any truth to this or will it be a major undertaking?

20180121_173106.jpg
 
Coastie said:
Howdy, y'all. 1st time posting here so sorry about any faux pas.

Anyways, ive got a 72 Dart swinger with a /6 and an A903. Currently im having a few issues with the trans;
1; when in neutral and not touching the clutch, i hear a whirling sound. Im thinking throw out bearing?
2; when driving, itll pop out of 2nd as soon as i start to let off the clutch. Its happening more often and really annoying me. Ideas on whats causing it? The problem didnt start till i had a shop grease up the linkages, but now theyre claiming synchros.

So with these problems (if theyre not easier fixes), i was considering swapping to a 4spd (found 1 that was mated to a /6 truck), a833. What would i need to do? I read on hotrod that theyre the same size, so i can reuse my driveshaft and only need a bell housing (and cutting a hole in the the floor). Any truth to this or will it be a major undertaking?

View attachment 1715133312
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You'll need the following:

Flywheel and flywheel bolts
Clutch
Throwout bearing
Pilot bearing
Bellhousing
Clutch Linkage and Z bar set up, including brackets
A body clutch and brake pedal assembly.
obviously the trans and shifter

I'm sure I'm forgetting a few things.

One thing to note that I'm not sure with the slant 6s but on the V8s, the crankshafts had to have been drilled for a pilot bearing. Not all were, only those designated for manual trans were though some did make it into auto cars so that might be something to look into.
 
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dukeboy_318 said:
You'll need the following:

Flywheel and flywheel bolts
Clutch
Throwout bearing
Pilot bearing
Bellhousing
Clutch Linkage and Z bar set up, including brackets
A body clutch and brake pedal assembly.
obviously the trans and shifter

I'm sure I'm forgetting a few things.

One thing to note that I'm not sure with the slant 6s but on the V8s, the crankshafts had to have been drilled for a pilot bearing. Not all were, only those designated for manual trans were though some did make it into auto cars so that might be something to look into.
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Well the trans for sale is the whole set up, so other than the clutch. And would the flywheel not be the same or come with it?

And any ideas what my problems could be from?
 
Coastie said:
Well the trans for sale is the whole set up, so other than the clutch. And would the flywheel not be the same or come with it?

And any ideas what my problems could be from?
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First Welcome to The Forum! Second I'm not sure at this point whether this is your first start your first car you've had a thousand of them and you know what you're doing or what? The first thing I would do right out of the gate is fix it myself! Synchros are $50 and a whole rebuild kit for that transmission is probably another hundred. The problem is too many people having just simply taking things apart and that's how simple it is there's no tolerances or anything crazy and if the one spot were a bunch of bearings fall out and they actually fall out that can be put back in with a piece of broomstick handle! But with that said how much money do you want to put into things that go to a /6 in this Dart?? I'm already scared the four speed you're looking at is actually the overdrive? And not a true 4-speed? If it is a true for Speed and NOT a 4 speed overdrive, I would grab that anyways if you can get it cheap. But think about how much you're putting into this car and how much you like the little rice burners to show you how it is out on the streets? That's what I thought, I don't think so? Quite honestly it's probably just one of the little fingers inside one of the gears that's worn out and making it pop out of gear. There's a $25 book you can buy at any bookstore any good book store that can show you how to rebuild almost any transmission with pictures! LOL
Don't be scared of your car unless you don't use jack stands! LOL
 
j par said:
First Welcome to The Forum! Second I'm not sure at this point whether this is your first start your first car you've had a thousand of them and you know what you're doing or what? The first thing I would do right out of the gate is fix it myself! Synchros are $50 and a whole rebuild kit for that transmission is probably another hundred. The problem is too many people having just simply taking things apart and that's how simple it is there's no tolerances or anything crazy and if the one spot were a bunch of bearings fall out and they actually fall out that can be put back in with a piece of broomstick handle! But with that said how much money do you want to put into things that go to a /6 in this Dart?? I'm already scared the four speed you're looking at is actually the overdrive? And not a true 4-speed? If it is a true for Speed and NOT a 4 speed overdrive, I would grab that anyways if you can get it cheap. But think about how much you're putting into this car and how much you like the little rice burners to show you how it is out on the streets? That's what I thought, I don't think so? Quite honestly it's probably just one of the little fingers inside one of the gears that's worn out and making it pop out of gear. There's a $25 book you can buy at any bookstore any good book store that can show you how to rebuild almost any transmission with pictures! LOL
Don't be scared of your car unless you don't use jack stands! LOL
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Ive had a few while trying to figure out what classic i want (66 dart, 53 customline, 74 camaro, 66 ranchero, 67 impala), but now im back to the darts and here to stay. Its a 4spd OD, but its 60k miles and only $125, so a swap may be cheaper than a rebuild. My only issue is that i live in an apartment so having a vehicle out of commission for more than a day is kinda out.
 
Coastie said:
Well the trans for sale is the whole set up, so other than the clutch. And would the flywheel not be the same or come with it?

And any ideas what my problems could be from?
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the flywheel is bolted to the engine, an auto trans doesn't use one, they use a flexplate instead. So you'll need to make sure you have the flywheel with the trans or you'll have to source one. Clutch kits dont usually include the flywheel
 
Coastie said:
Ive had a few while trying to figure out what classic i want (66 dart, 53 customline, 74 camaro, 66 ranchero, 67 impala), but now im back to the darts and here to stay. Its a 4spd OD, but its 60k miles and only $125, so a swap may be cheaper than a rebuild. My only issue is that i live in an apartment so having a vehicle out of commission for more than a day is kinda out.
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Okay cool I know I'm talking to somebody who at least knows what they're talking about. Okay grab that 0/d 4 Speed regardless, $125 is a good price. And it may have parts or linkage that could be useful when we get that real four-speed in there and that Stroker motor!
 
dukeboy_318 said:
the flywheel is bolted to the engine, an auto trans doesn't use one, they use a flexplate instead. So you'll need to make sure you have the flywheel with the trans or you'll have to source one. Clutch kits dont usually include the flywheel
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Its already a 3spd manual, so should those parts be compatible?
 
j par said:
Okay cool I know I'm talking to somebody who at least knows what they're talking about. Okay grab that 0/d 4 Speed regardless, $125 is a good price. And it may have parts or linkage that could be useful when we get that real four-speed in there and that Stroker motor!
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What about fitment? Will the stock drive shaft and cross member work? Im willing to do it if its a bolt on job, but if the cost of fabrication/lots off extra parts out does a simple rebuild, i may just keep it. I want to keep the slant 6 (and beef it up), so im not worried about making it fast or anything.
 
Coastie said:
What about fitment? Will the stock drive shaft and cross member work? Im willing to do it if its a bolt on job, but if the cost of fabrication/lots off extra parts out does a simple rebuild, i may just keep it. I want to keep the slant 6 (and beef it up), so im not worried about making it fast or anything.
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Okay first let me address your apartment situation. I bought my duster in the same situation. I ended up taking the automatic transmission out and putting a 4-speed in it. What I did was a couple miles away I found that my uncle for $50 or so LOL would let me borrow his car port! For a few days not even the garage but just somewhere I could work on it for a few days at a time. Then I called the Towing on my car insurance and said that my car was broke down and I need a place called my uncle's garage! LOL and I actually towed it back and forth twice before it was done. I'm not saying that's what to do but don't forget to get creative if you have too! as far as fitment goes I know the transmission crossmember is pretty much Universal for anything you put in the car. I would probably go with a simple Google search to see how long the tail shaft are. I know the both a body 4 speeds are the same length as the 904 automatic. Well they may have a different diameter yolk the driveshaft would be the same length. Where are the 727 automatic would have a longer tail shaft with a shorter drive line but share the same size yoke as a 4-speed. If that makes any sense? Now quite honestly you're 903 I don't know a lot about those old 3 -speeds. But I do know if they're anything like the four speeds they are colossally easy to fix if you can get the time and space.
 
j par said:
Okay first let me address your apartment situation. I bought my duster in the same situation. I ended up taking the automatic transmission out and putting a 4-speed in it. What I did was a couple miles away I found that my uncle for $50 or so LOL would let me borrow his car port! For a few days not even the garage but just somewhere I could work on it for a few days at a time. Then I called the Towing on my car insurance and said that my car was broke down and I need a place called my uncle's garage! LOL and I actually towed it back and forth twice before it was done. I'm not saying that's what to do but don't forget to get creative if you have too! as far as fitment goes I know the transmission crossmember is pretty much Universal for anything you put in the car. I would probably go with a simple Google search to see how long the tail shaft are. I know the both a body 4 speeds are the same length as the 904 automatic. Well they may have a different diameter yolk the driveshaft would be the same length. Where are the 727 automatic would have a longer tail shaft with a shorter drive line but share the same size yoke as a 4-speed. If that makes any sense? Now quite honestly you're 903 I don't know a lot about those old 3 -speeds. But I do know if they're anything like the four speeds they are colossally easy to fix if you can get the time and space.
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Any idea what a shop might charge me for it? Sadly time seems to be more important than money right now.. thank god for tax returns.
 
Coastie said:
Any idea what a shop might charge me for it? Sadly time seems to be more important than money right now.. thank god for tax returns.
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Yes that's terribly sad to have a car like that and have to have it taken to a shop. I can give you this for an estimate. When I called Aamco and they said drive your car and drive it out and will rebuild your automatic 904 it was $1,900 yes. When I called the next shop and they said drop it off on our bench and will rebuild it and pick it up off her bench for $800. I bought $104 rebuild kit and rebuilt it myself. That was my experience.
 
Take (always) my post with a grain of salt please. I'll almost always encourage you to"do it yourself". It's cheaper and you learn more about the car witch makes it cheaper. About the time someone tells me what there mechanic told them I kind of shut down. Anybody does it for under 5 or $600 I would be leery of. If it's not a car needed to get to work or for necessity please consider what the cost would be to maybe rent a space of some sort to do it yourself and end up with all the knowledge? And how much is that worth? You wouldn't be asking the question if this Driveline fit or that transmission fit if you done it yourself. Or I mean if you do it yourself sorry. Please remember that grain of salt.
 
j par said:
Big question: do you need this car to run to get you to work?
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j par said:
Take (always) my post with a grain of salt please. I'll almost always encourage you to"do it yourself". It's cheaper and you learn more about the car witch makes it cheaper. About the time someone tells me what there mechanic told them I kind of shut down. Anybody does it for under 5 or $600 I would be leery of. If it's not a car needed to get to work or for necessity please consider what the cost would be to maybe rent a space of some sort to do it yourself and end up with all the knowledge? And how much is that worth? You wouldn't be asking the question if this Driveline fit or that transmission fit if you done it yourself. Or I mean if you do it yourself sorry. Please remember that grain of salt.
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Well i broke down and took it a reputable shop for them to look at it. If its linkage issues, then the price should be pretty low. Otherwise ill have to look at doing stuff myself.

No i dont need the car as i have a perfectly good tacoma just sitting there, but my issue is i have a bay at work i can work on it at, but it needs to be removed by monday morning. So only 2 days to rebuild a trans for the 1st time in my life will really be pushing it.

God i hope its just linkages that the other shop fucked up.... i think my cut off will be $350 for the repair; any more and ill do it myself.
 
Coastie said:
Well i broke down and took it a reputable shop for them to look at it. If its linkage issues, then the price should be pretty low. Otherwise ill have to look at doing stuff myself.

No i dont need the car as i have a perfectly good tacoma just sitting there, but my issue is i have a bay at work i can work on it at, but it needs to be removed by monday morning. So only 2 days to rebuild a trans for the 1st time in my life will really be pushing it.

God i hope its just linkages that the other shop fucked up.... i think my cut off will be $350 for the repair; any more and ill do it myself.
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Oh my goodness! I misjudged! Yes the linkage we should have went through that the very first thing! Simple as pie!
 
I would be more apt to say drive the car into the shop take the transmission out over the weekend have it towed home for the week and towed back the next weekend put it back in and drive it home? Or take longer if you need at that point an extra week?
 
Just throw another 3 speed in there even an older one that came out of a valiant will fit right in.That swap will take you about 2 hours. Get the car back in service this way while you chase after all the 4 speed crap and information you need as well as the time and place to do the change over to the 4 speed.Then when it's a 4 speed sell the 3 speeds and get all your money back.
 
Have the linkage adjusted by a shop that's familiar with old cars. If your car is a floor shift 3sp its easy to go 4sp. If it's a column shift 3sp you need more stuff. But from what you say, they greased the linkage and now the not-quite-right adjustments are not proving usable. So get that fixed before you spend a bunch on other stuff.
 
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