I had already shut the engine down & left the electric fans running when I remembered to grab the IR gun, so it had been several minutes before I checked temps.
I "think" top was 205* & bottom 160*. I need to do this test again....
Pulley Diameters
- Thread starter 6pk2goDemon
- Start date
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I had already shut the engine down & left the electric fans running when I remembered to grab the IR gun, so it had been several minutes before I checked temps.
I "think" top was 205* & bottom 160*. I need to do this test again....
Also, I've never seen you say, but does the temperature cool down once at highway speed?
AND......how close is your temperature sending unit to the thermostat? I also am too lazy to read back and see what temperature thermostat you have.......which one is it?
Thanks C. Im using the stock factory ac rad(67 273) Although none of ac underhood components are being used. Always running around 210* for the past couple years. Don't like it.
I'm going to see a rad guy this afternoon and take my 69 340 rad to get it priced for recore. He comes fabo recommended, so I will take the cuda for a rip so he can see what I have for a current setup in it as well.
Maybe I'm too paranoid running at 210*??
I will pick his brain to see what he says.
I'm going to see a rad guy this afternoon and take my 69 340 rad to get it priced for recore. He comes fabo recommended, so I will take the cuda for a rip so he can see what I have for a current setup in it as well.
Maybe I'm too paranoid running at 210*??
I will pick his brain to see what he says.
Already done! After the Saturday drive, we pulled everything apart again & installed the 7.25" crank pulley. I haven't had a chance to drive it again YET. I think we're on the same page, but I'm trying to only do 1 change at a time. It's easier for me to track improvement that way...
The best thing about this whole experiment is I hadn't spent a dime up until the 7.25" pulley got installed. Then I needed 2 new belts. June/July/August are off season for car shows & events, so it's our time for car repairs
At any rate, I have to leave for work now. I will check back when I get home tonight. Maybe we can come up with something. That's a great temperature split. That indicates the radiator is working. I am wondering now if the gauge is correct. Have you checked the gauge against the temperature at the thermostat area?
210* is a FANTASTIC temperature for an engine to run. As long as it cools down any on the highway, you are good.
before sustained speed testing please put on your shower caps
I wanted to bring this quote back into the equation. I'm sure some of you are wondering WTH this means, but it will serve a purpose for add'l testing down the road.
I have a 72 snorkel scoop on my car. The hood has been cut out in the triangular area underneath which is allowing plenty of fresh air into the engine bay, BUT since my air cleaner is huge (6pk), I'm not sure if it's serving me well.
I had an idea to use a couple of shower caps to block the airflow thru the scoops into the engine bay. Maybe turbulence could be considered here also??
1 step at a time
Good point. Since you would also be running the fan while A/C is on it would require even more load.
It appears that the Radiator is doing its job if the temp drop is that much top to bottom.
Ok, so 210 is good, the weird thing is. At faster speeds the temp rises.
a little packing tape from the outside for testing...clear stuff so no one can see it
the scoop is effectively blocking an area of the radiator approximately equal to the scoops frontal opening size.
its putting air under the hood that did not pass through the radiator and provided no cooling. not what we want in the desert
If its not "sealed" to the carb/intake an open hood scoop is just stealing air that should be going through the radiator.
I know I still have my fluid dynamics textbooks somewhere...physics hasnt changed that much since the late 70's...has it?
the scoop is effectively blocking an area of the radiator approximately equal to the scoops frontal opening size.
its putting air under the hood that did not pass through the radiator and provided no cooling. not what we want in the desert
If its not "sealed" to the carb/intake an open hood scoop is just stealing air that should be going through the radiator.
I know I still have my fluid dynamics textbooks somewhere...physics hasnt changed that much since the late 70's...has it?
C, I would remove fans from front of radiator and if you can tilt your condenser forward at the top to let more unrestricted air pass thru the radiator may help. I did it on my 499" in the GTS and along with the Contour fans has my problem taken care of. No telling how . time and money I spent chasing heat problems. I would get to 240 before taking those underdrive March pulleys off and going steel overdrive and Contour fans. Joe
Then there is also this.........I KNOW DAMN WELL I remember a thread where people were talking about all the temp sending units that the stores sell being the WRONG resistance. Maybe @KitCarlson will remember. Someone posted the correct number and I wrote it down and lost it like a dumbass. The complaint was that the one that all the stores is the wrong resistance and reads too high.
No, it creeps up.
The t'stat is from NAPA and 180*. The sending unit for the gauge is next to the t'stat housing.
I can live with 210* if that as hot as it gets, but NOT the case. I agree with you & don't like it at all...
Let us know what your radiator guy says. I'm determined to fix the problem this year once & for all....I HOPE
(Fingers Crossed)
TrailBeast
AKA Mopars4us on Youtube
I can live with 210* if that as hot as it gets, but NOT the case. I agree with you & don't like it at all...
Let us know what your radiator guy says. I'm determined to fix the problem this year once & for all....I HOPE
C, I have to agree with a few of these post and since I have seen your cooling system and you even swapped out the fan clutch AND have a shroud I have to lean towards Robs radiator thoughts.
I don't remember specifically what electric fans you have, but it sure is possible they are blocking too much air when not in use.
I'd pull those and see if the car will idle and stay at pretty much what your thermostat temp rating is.
If it wont keep the temp down at idle with the electrics out of the way you know right then there's going to be a problem when out somewhere with the car.
If it can idle without getting too warm then take it out for couple of miles and see if it runs 200-210 or so without going higher.
If it does that ok turn your air on and see if it stays around the 210 or so area.
I am taking into account an approximate 80 degrees out when estimating this.
If it keeps climbing you need a more efficient radiator.
Oh, and 1:1 or close to it on crank and water pump pulleys is an acceptable norm so please excuse me for being skeptical on that new pulley helping anything.
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famous bob
mopar misfit
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^a little packing tape from the outside for testing...clear stuff so no one can see it
the scoop is effectively blocking an area of the radiator approximately equal to the scoops frontal opening size.
its putting air under the hood that did not pass through the radiator and provided no cooling. not what we want in the desert
If its not "sealed" to the carb/intake an open hood scoop is just stealing air that should be going through the radiator.
I know I still have my fluid dynamics textbooks somewhere...physics hasnt changed that much since the late 70's...has it?
I have found this to be right on !!
I went and saw local rad guy yesterday. He couldn't shed light on pulley sizes and pros vs cons. He looked at my current factory 273 ac rad. He said it has been redone as he could tell by the seam on top tank is perfect. From factory it got one pass for solder and weren't concerned on looks. Mine apparently is " too nice" lol.
His concern was more for coolant mfg.
He showed me an article which explained additives in the coolant. Article was by John Malks and from 2010 so a bit dated. But it states, no OATS. OATS are Organic Acid Technology. OATS will eat silicone amongst other things, and a large amount of our gaskets are comprised of silicone. It has also eaten liners, and solder.
OATS can be in either ethylene or propylene glycol. Same goes for HOAT/NOAT technology. Its service life is 150000/5years.
IAT(Inorganic Additive Technology)is the type of antifreeze we should be using and has a service life of 30000 miles/2 years.
Apparently in North America its known as "conventionally inhibited"
At the time of this article it stated some Peak/Sierra coolant was IAT. All Prestone and ZEREX are OAT technology and not to be used.
I have to do my own research on this to see if these "findings" are current.
I also took my 69 340 2 row rad for a quote. Not cheap...but I trust his judgement/advice. He's been doing it for 50 years and has some real nice old stuff he's working on.
Showed me how he fits 3 rows in it. Top tank has lots of room, bottom needs the mods.
I plan on putting 340(when done) in cuda so wanted a stress free cooling system so 340 rad will go in as well.
This may not help C at all with current issues but might help alleviate future ones for some members.
His concern was more for coolant mfg.
He showed me an article which explained additives in the coolant. Article was by John Malks and from 2010 so a bit dated. But it states, no OATS. OATS are Organic Acid Technology. OATS will eat silicone amongst other things, and a large amount of our gaskets are comprised of silicone. It has also eaten liners, and solder.
OATS can be in either ethylene or propylene glycol. Same goes for HOAT/NOAT technology. Its service life is 150000/5years.
IAT(Inorganic Additive Technology)is the type of antifreeze we should be using and has a service life of 30000 miles/2 years.
Apparently in North America its known as "conventionally inhibited"
At the time of this article it stated some Peak/Sierra coolant was IAT. All Prestone and ZEREX are OAT technology and not to be used.
I have to do my own research on this to see if these "findings" are current.
I also took my 69 340 2 row rad for a quote. Not cheap...but I trust his judgement/advice. He's been doing it for 50 years and has some real nice old stuff he's working on.
Showed me how he fits 3 rows in it. Top tank has lots of room, bottom needs the mods.
I plan on putting 340(when done) in cuda so wanted a stress free cooling system so 340 rad will go in as well.
This may not help C at all with current issues but might help alleviate future ones for some members.
I can live with 210* if that as hot as it gets, but NOT the case. I agree with you & don't like it at all...
Let us know what your radiator guy says. I'm determined to fix the problem this year once & for all....I HOPE
I believe it was mostly to spin the fan faster. The AC condenser blocks airflow though the radiator, so overdriving the fan would move more air to help compensate.
The down sizing on the water pump that was done on the cars with overdriven pulleys kind of indicates that they didn’t want a big increase in water movement. The standard pump with the overdriven pulley might move a little more water than the HV pump with the slightly underdriven pulley, but it would be close.
My plan is to run a HV Milodon but underdrive pulleys so my fan/pump wont turn so fast at 7k rpms . Of course I wont have A/C and will be running 3.91s. Plus my 1st gear is a 3.09 which will keep my rpms up at lower MPH.
KitCarlson
Well-Known Member
engine temp sensor specs
Post #5 by RedFish, he is an instrument expert.
Post #5 by RedFish, he is an instrument expert.
Rick Riffle
Well-Known Member
Rick Riffle
Well-Known Member
I have been following this discussion because I have the same problem with my car. Temperature is fine at speed but rises in traffic. I am in the process of adding AC, so I am concerned what is going to happen. I already have a Flowkooler water pump and a Be Cool radiator.
My car currently has a 2 electric puller fans and 6 1/2" pulleys on both crank and water pump.
My question is: where can I purchase either a 5 3/4" water pump pulley and a 7 1/4" crank pulley? I may need to consider going this route in the future.
My car currently has a 2 electric puller fans and 6 1/2" pulleys on both crank and water pump.
My question is: where can I purchase either a 5 3/4" water pump pulley and a 7 1/4" crank pulley? I may need to consider going this route in the future.
plumkrazee70
Well-Known Member
Your problem sounds like not enough fan. The fact that it rises in traffic as opposed to at speed. Most electric fans aren't adequate enough, you need at least 3500 c.f.m. Any chance you can go with a mechanical fan and shroud?
Col_Steve
Well-Known Member
Changing a mopar alternator pulley isn't difficult or technical but does require the special pulley puller.All belts and accessories are now lined up except for the alternator. I think if we replace the single alternator pulley with a dual pulley, the last piece of the puzzle will fall in place....
From doing some research, the pulley change over is not a piece of cake
We have a puller to get the pulley off, but not sure about installing the new one. Words of advice??
Instructions:
removal;
Remove alternator from engine.
Remove 2 brush holders being careful not to break the brittle castings.
Remove the 4 case cover screws.
Carefully work the front cover loose from the stator about 1/4 inch, leave the stator solidly installed in the rear cover.
The Rotor and front cover will now lift straight out, nothing will go "sprang" or fall out on the floor.
Clamp the outside of the rotor in a soft jaw vise.
Install the puller onto the removal flange on the front of the pulley.
I use a 3/8 drive impact to power the puller due to the fast hammer action.
After about 1" of movement the pulley will pop off.
Installation;
Balance the rotor into the press on its rear bearing with the pulley end facing up.
Lightly oil the front shaft and the inside of the new pulley with any oil.
Balance the new pulley on the front shaft and press in place until it stops solidly on the bearing.
Reassemble the alternator in reverse order.
If the bearing needs replacement (don't they always?) carry on from where removal left off.
Removal:
Looking into the back of the front cover in under the rotor you will see a three sided black spring steel retainer plate covering the back of the front bearing. Use a flat screwdriver to pry the three corners off from their little ledges on the front cover.
Now sit on a soft chair and lay the front case edges over the top of your thighs with the rotor between your legs.
Rap sharply on the front end of the shaft repeatedly with a bronze or plastic hammer until the rotor and bearing are dislodged from the front case, about 3/8 inch. Use caution to catch the rotor so that it does not fall on the floor - the reason for the soft chair.
Remove the old bearing using the same puller as you did to remove the pulley.
Installation:
Clean out the bearing recess in the front case and apply a bit of oil to it and the new bearing inside and out.
Lay the front case on a hard surface and drive the new bearing into the recess much as you would install a wheel bearing seal.
Once the bearing is fully seated the hammer will bounce.
Reinstall the three cornered black retaining clip.
Set the rotor in the press front end up.
Balance the case on the front of the shaft and set the pulley on top of the front of the bearing.
Press into place until fully seated.
Reassemble the alternator reverse order.
The entire job takes about 45 minutes.
Steve
I haven't forgotten to update this thread, but the weather has just been too hot for testing.
We had a huge monsoon storm last night so the temps are in the low 80's this morning. Off for a long drive & will let everyone know. Fingers crossed!!
We had a huge monsoon storm last night so the temps are in the low 80's this morning. Off for a long drive & will let everyone know. Fingers crossed!!
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