Lifter gallery

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Matthew4Jesus

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I have a 1985 slant six that is a fresh rebuild. I used a hyd. comp cam and comp lifters. I also used a mech. Adjustable set of rockers off an older engine and had a set of Manton pushrods made to accommodate them since needing new ones anyway due to deck/and heavy head milling. I set the adjuster screws to 1 turn preload on rockers. And also The rear cam bearing was grooved and I aligned The oil hole properly. Camshaft had proper break in procedure and seems to be fine. Broke-in with Joe Gibbs Driven racing break-in oil 5w30 per oil clearances for The rods and mains The problem I'm having is, the lifters seem to not be pumping up, causing lots of lifter noise. I've built many engines, but this is my first dealing with the slant 6. This may be a stupid question and sounds like it coming from my mouth, but are the lifter bored pressurized with oil like normal v8's, meaning do they have oil gallery's to them, or are they solid/blind? I never thought to check during the build because why would you? Lol all normal mopar v8's are. But before I tear it back down to see myself I figured I would ask, and if no one knows for sure maybe someone has a late model block stripped and can check it out for me? If it does and is like all the rest I guess I will be getting another set of lifters and replace the ones that are leaking down. Thanks in advance!
 
Did you use pushrods with a hole thru them? Need to use hydraulic shaft, rockers and hollow (oil thru) pushrods.

Hydro Slants get oil to the lifter top down via the push rods. Mechanical rockers and solid push rods will not work.

sb
 
What you really need to do, is get a new set of push rods made (length you need, with ball/ball ends, and oil hole). Use the 1985 rocker shaft, and the non adjustable hydro rockers. You cannot mix and match hyro and solid valve train parts. Need to be all solid or all hydro parts. Cam, lifters, shaft, rockers, push rods.
PS: I have never seen the rear cam bearing grooved. The cam should have the groove on the journal.
 
Ok, thanks for all the replies. This was a learing mistake for sure. I will be swapping all of it back around to the hyd rockers. Never heard of an engine oil system backwards like this. By the way what's the differences in the rocker shafts, hyd vs mec? They both are oil through. Does it matter which one I use? How can I tell them apart if so? Thanks
 
Anyone know who is the cheapest on making these custom length pushrods? Just went out and measured for the hyd setup and I need 9.930 length. I figured I would asked since this is an oddball length that nothing uses and I really don't want to pay Smith Brothers $170 again to make another set. (I thought I used Manton for this engine when i posted earlier, until i dug through my paperwork) I dont need .083 4130 rods for these ridiculously weak springs comp cams sent in the kit. I'm just looking for someone that will make a set from regular mild tubing like the factory were. But, Smith nor Manton makes cheap rods anymore . Anyhow figured I would asked where y'all get yours from besides the regular 10.00 length before I throw the money at Smith Brothers again. Thanks
 
if you need them shorter, just pull the ball tips off slant pushrods and cut down the shafts and press the tip back in. Chrysler went uber cheap when converting to hydros, like almost nothing changed! Sort of a splash oil system. read up slants on allpar.
 
Man,.....first You gotta tell Me if those were hollow cups & balls to feed oil down to the lifters from the rockers, which as You now know need to be non-adj. hyd rockers to do that cam. If not, You need new push rods either way. I had a set of .375" dia. Cranes, which I pulled the cup ends out of, shortened, & re-pressed in the cups. Those were mech, but the idea is the same, but only if the tips are both hollow & pressed in.
Check Crane & Comp etc. catalogs for anything in a cut & finish Yourself kit, there was a kit from Mopar long time ago, now all They wanna sell is Hellcrate engines...............................
 
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pishta said:
if you need them shorter, just pull the ball tips off slant pushrods and cut down the shafts and press the tip back in.
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This. It is really not too hard. Hardest part is measuring to find the correct length and it seems you have that knocked out.

sb
 
Thanks for all the suggestions and details for cutting them down and reassemble. I've actually made many pushrods from comps 4130 material and ends and cut down others for certain engines on the lathe.
I'm not interested nor have the time right now to do all that for just this slant 6. It's just not worth the time to do it right on this 140hp engine lol, but I also won't just throw it together with a bunch of "close enough's" on the length pushrods 9.933,9.942,9.938, ect. Just to slam it together.

I just wondered if anyone knew of a company that would throw a set of low buck tubes together to save a little money before going back to Smith Brothers which I use on my custom stuff, but normally it's for something a little higher end than this so it's not such a big deal. I mean I literally spent like $70 bucks for all 6 piston on this engine and had $170 chromoly pushrods in it lol. That's what I'm getting at. It doesn't make since.
I'll call comp tomorrow to see if they will throw a cheap set together for me since they still have the mild steel line of low buck rods. But I'm pretty sure the last time I spoke with them they acted like they stopped doing custom orders. Idk I'll check thanks for all the help guys, much appreciated.
 
Killer6 said:
Man,.....first You gotta tell Me if those were hollow cups & balls to feed oil down to the lifters from the rockers, which as You now know need to be non-adj. hyd rockers to do that cam. If not, You need new push rods either way. I had a set of .375" dia. Cranes, which I pulled the cup ends out of, shortened, & re-pressed in the cups. Those were mech, but the idea is the same, but only if the tips are both hollow & pressed in.
Check Crane & Comp etc. catalogs for anything in a cut & finish Yourself kit, there was a kit from Mopar long time ago, now all They wanna sell is Hellcrate engines...............................
Click to expand...
mopar_nocar said:
This. It is really not too hard. Hardest part is measuring to find the correct length and it seems you have that knocked out.

sb
Click to expand...
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get a carbide or cobalt drill and drill through the hardened tips and cups? Its almost free if you got the old pushrods, a bit and a saw.
 
pishta said:
9BNL0BkPm1SbonZVP4-Pf2hDJ6jrgrL14asjKFF6K1iUqvUSdLDrC0oy72ep5M10atMxlPJARwowL412J_8=w391-h220-rw


get a carbide or cobalt drill and drill through the hardened tips and cups? Its almost free if you got the old pushrods, a bit and a saw.
Click to expand...
That's a down hill battle lost before you start lol. Even a centerless carbide end mill in the lathe would not hardly scratch those Smith bro harden tips; I've shattered enough of them on the Bridgeport to know how that goes. I'll just use those rods on a more time worthy build and order the 2 extra to go with them and just order another set for this engine.

Just wondered if someone had a low buck source on compete rods that I may not have known of for this odd ball size before I ordered again. It was worth a shot. Thanks.
 
Matthew4Jesus said:
That's a down hill battle lost before you start lol. Even a centerless carbide end mill in the lathe would not hardly scratch those Smith bro harden tips; I've shattered enough of them on the Bridgeport to know how that goes. I'll just use those rods on a more time worthy build and order the 2 extra to go with them and just order another set for this engine.

Just wondered if someone had a low buck source on compete rods that I may not have known of for this odd ball size before I ordered again. It was worth a shot. Thanks.
Click to expand...
Post over on the Slant Six Forum, one of the members might have something, worth a shot B4 droppin' the coin again.
 
was talkin' up the standard Chryco 5/16 slant pushrods, circa 1965. Not sure if the ball ends are hardened, as I scuffed a few with the grinder taking the shell off the cut tips. You can see the scars in the pic. I wouldn't chop up Smith Bros pushrods either.
 
The non-gallery lifter bores inadvertently helped me ~1994. My 1969 slant had a bad cylinder (no compression). To keep driving until I got a rebuilt engine, I had the bright idea to just remove its lifters and pushrods to deactivate it and not waste gas. Bragged of my cleverness to a tech at work who was a GM rodder. He told me I would lose oil pressure doing that. Actually, not since there are no oil feed holes to a slant bore, even 1985 ones, but didn't know that then. I put the lifters back, lowered the adjusters so the valves stayed shut and rigged weak springs to keep things from rattling. Worked fine, but unnecessary. Got a rebuilt engine a few months later. I lived in the Mojave Desert then, so couldn't just run out and get an engine. Had to wait for the next trip to L.A.
 
BillGrissom said:
The non-gallery lifter bores inadvertently helped me ~1994. My 1969 slant had a bad cylinder (no compression). To keep driving until I got a rebuilt engine, I had the bright idea to just remove its lifters and pushrods to deactivate it and not waste gas. Bragged of my cleverness to a tech at work who was a GM rodder. He told me I would lose oil pressure doing that. Actually, not since there are no oil feed holes to a slant bore, even 1985 ones, but didn't know that then. I put the lifters back, lowered the adjusters so the valves stayed shut and rigged weak springs to keep things from rattling. Worked fine, but unnecessary. Got a rebuilt engine a few months later. I lived in the Mojave Desert then, so couldn't just run out and get an engine. Had to wait for the next trip to L.A.
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Did you at least pull the plug to reduce pumping pressures? That's Billy rigged right there! :)
 
pishta said:
Did you at least pull the plug to reduce pumping pressures? That's Billy rigged right there! :)
Click to expand...
No, left the spark plug in, otherwise it would probably spit oil out the hole. Probably not much energy loss. If it had compression, it would be an "air spring", but even cranking fast, I measured no compression. I recall that was cyl #5, which seems to be notorious for throwing a connecting rod out the driver's side of the block and nobody seems to know why.
 
BillGrissom said:
No, left the spark plug in, otherwise it would probably spit oil out the hole. Probably not much energy loss. If it had compression, it would be an "air spring", but even cranking fast, I measured no compression. I recall that was cyl #5, which seems to be notorious for throwing a connecting rod out the driver's side of the block and nobody seems to know why.
Click to expand...
yeah, I can see where that would be an issue with no plug now. Wild! I thought me driving an old SAAB with a 2X4 wedged between the alternator and block for belt tension from Sacramento to SF was a journey. The alternator bracket bolt sheared off and the STUPID motor is backwards in those cars! The belts are facing the firewall and the trans tail is behind the radiator! Shop had to hole saw the firewall and drill out the old threads from inside the cabin......They knew how to do this from an old tech that worked on old 99's. Here is a shot of one to feel my pain....It was my Sis's car, and I felt I had to lend a hand when I visited her in college.
saab990303strip.jpg
 
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