833 behind a stout 440?

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brian6pac said:
I think it was only the track pak cars
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I guess all my 440 cars were track pak cars then and every 440 car with a 4 speed that I worked on were also.

The Hemi 4 speed gears are cut at a differant angle from the 23 spline 4 speed gears so there is no swapping gears between them. This I well know so anybody that doesn't know it look it up yourself.
 
Huh, how 'bout that. Learning all the time...

From.... Chrysler A-833 four speed manual transmissions — history, tech, and swap

Most importantly, another gearset was incorporated for the new Street Hemi models, featuring Oilite™ bushings lining each gear and new gear tooth angles for more strength. Hemi cars also had a new, larger main drive pinion (input shaft), with a larger (No. 308) bearing and retainer, and a new coarse-spline clutch disc. A unique, beefier clutch release bearing completed the package.
Click to expand...
 
Cuda416 said:
Huh, how 'bout that. Learning all the time...

From.... Chrysler A-833 four speed manual transmissions — history, tech, and swap
Click to expand...

I'm learning that way all the time too..lol
I have never broken a gear in a 23 spline behind a small block Mopar.

I can't say the same about a 23 spline behind a 383. I crunched one so bad it looked liked the gears had been ground up in a blender.
I personally never broke an 18 spline. I ran them in b and e bodys. I ran them behind 440-4,440-6 and Hemis.

As for the od tranny I have seen at least a dozen broken to pieces inside.
Some had aluminum front housings with cast tail housing and some had cast front housing and aluminum tail housing.
Just my personal experience.
 
I have the iron 833od 4 speed and it is not made for fun. The ratio's are way too far apart and it make the shifting difficult and downshifting almost impossible. I have 2 of them if you want to find out for yourself I let them go at a reasonable price. :)
 
I had a '68 Charger R/T 440HP 4-speed.

Before I bought the car, I was told by the previous owner to be sure to have the transmission looked at, 'cuz it leaked bad. The dealer 'checked' it, said it was fine.

I drove it home; about 100 miles. Drove it a good bit after that too, no leaks no problems until the question came up again. Can't recall exactly what brought it back to mind; the car was driving fine.

Turned out the bearing retainer had been broken, welded, and welded poorly with a nice hole at the bottom from which all the fluid could leak out. At the time of the real fix, there wasn't any fluid IN the thing!

100 highway miles home, weeks/months of city driving, NO fluid in the trans. It didn't leak that I observed because the fluid went all gone on the way home!

The end result being nothing bad that could be heard/felt or impacted the trans in any way.

I'd run an 833 behind a 440 and never give it a second thought. They're tough.
 
Well too late for me. I’ve already fabricated engine and trans mounts, and started removing manual stuff. Lockar installed on the 727. Test firing by end of April.
 
I have seen original both Cast iron and Aluminum main cases and tail housings for A Bodies. Not sure why they used what they did on the O/D or when? I actually have a low miles all aluminum A body O/D. It is slated for a 65 cast main case and normal countershaft to beef it up, then it will go into the 66 Formula S.
 
Cuda416 said:
Worst I've seen is a twisted 23 spline input shaft and only pictures of them...
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My clutch alignment tool is an 833 shaft I snapped off flush with the case.
Never exactly figured out what caused it, but it made a mess of everything around it.
 
trapster said:
I have the iron 833od 4 speed and it is not made for fun. The ratio's are way too far apart and it make the shifting difficult and downshifting almost impossible. I have 2 of them if you want to find out for yourself I let them go at a reasonable price. :)
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Hang on trapster
I agree; that the ratios are too far apart for a high-revving cam, like a 230 or bigger. But with a 220 or less it ain't all that bad.
I agree that downshifting into 3.09low is a bit of is a bit of a stretch unless you blip the throttle. Otherwise, once you get used to the splits, downshifting into the other gears isn't that bad. It certainly ain't any good for any kind of track work, but for a mild street build it ain't all that bad. So
I agree that in stock form that it is not made for fun. But in a lo-performance application like a smogger teen with 3.91s or better, it ain't all that bad.

Ok now;
That box needs a torquey low-rpm engine. Perfect for a slanty or stock 318.
if you street slickshift second, and rough up the shift cones, and run ATF, and run 4.10s, then badaboom; now it is fun time. This makes 60mph at the top of second to be 5100rpm, about perfect for a teener with a bit of a cam. The starter gear is 12.67, and you just have to hold it in first a lil longer than you are used to, before grabbing second. Then it buzzes up nicely to 35mph at 5500, dropping to 3000 in second. So then yes it is a bit of a pull to 60mph with that combo,so don't run a 108LSA cam. The factory 318-112*LSA cam does pretty good with 340 springs. And the bonus is that 65=2400rpm.
I ran that box with up to a 223/230/110 cam in my HO367 @10.9Scr,(aluminum heads and 185psi-cranking) and with 3.55s for a couple of summers, and I agree that it wasn't the best idea I ever had. So I got me a GVOD and started splitting gears. I set it up with 4.30s in the back and the first four Road-ratios were; 13.29-10.36-7.18-5.60, so second/over was 73mph@5000 with the teener, and 100@6950 with the 367, and the splits were .78-.69-.78.. So that was two electric shifts and one tug on the stick; perfect for the 4bbl/otherwise stock, smogger-teen; and also perfect for the 367/223 cam. And 65 was still 1980 rpm. I ran that combo for a fun couple of years, until that 223 cam started dropping lobes.So then I up-cammed to a 230/237/110 cam, and that was the end of that combo. And also the end of swapping in the teener every fall, swapping in the 367 every spring.
So I guess what I'm saying is; while I agree that box ain't icing on the cake; for a streeter there are ways to make that overdrive box work. And for my swap-meet buy-in price of $50C for the box plus $2300usd (in 2005) for the GVOD, I thought it was a reasonably good combo.
 
Um, I think you are agreeing with me :) The OD was really built for a slant six in my opinion. I like your gear vendor solution, but that is expensive and not just a drop in, you did have to modify your tunnel to get it in there correct ?

I am running a 340 with a 3.55 rear and standard tires.
 
To the OP...a 23 spline 833 will take all that and more. What breaks gearboxes is the junk **** clutches. I've broken so many 23 spline boxes I can't count them all. My buddy had a Nova and he broke as many as I did. I even broke two Hemi boxes and I got sick of my wallet getting raped to buy parts.

Finally, I jerked my head out of my *** and listened to a local Stock Eliminator racer and spent big $$$ on my clutch. I've never broken another box since then. Not one. And I had a 2850 pound car (with my fat *** in it) with 14x32 tires and I left at 8000 without a 2 step and never broke another box and they were all 23 spline boxes. My buddy spent the same money and ran high nines with a 3400 pound car and never broke another box either.

Clutches kill parts. Get the right clutch, learn to tune it and have fun.

Of course, if you have no bite, it won't break anything anyway.
 
72Duster440 said:
I’ve been wanting to swap my 727 out for a manual of some sort (like I do in all my vehicles) and am wondering if its worth putting an 833 behind it. The motor puts out just shy of 500 horse, do I need to get a Hemi 4 speed, or will any of them work? I’m more than likely leaning towards something with OD, since I have 3.91’s out back, and with the price of the Hemi 4 speeds, it would be an even swap price wise to get a T56 of some sort.
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The 833 can handle some big power. I'd say the 23 spline 833 can take 600hp/500's +tq hp and live long.
The transmission I have NEVER had a problem/failure. Meanwhile I've blown to bits 3 904 at's and 1 518od
 
Comments inside the quote
trapster said:
Um, I think you are agreeing with me :) The OD was really built for a slant six in my opinion.
I wouldn't box the od into that small a corral; the bigger the engine or the lower the operating rpm, the better it can be fit into the combo; which is why I suggested a 220*cam as about the maximum cam size. The 220 power peaks around 5000,and torque peaks around 3500,and will likely be shifted at 5500 in a streeter. The splits in the od box are .54 and .60 so dropping into second will be 2970 and into third 3300. This makes a powerband requirement of 2500....... A little more than the 727/904s(.59/.69splits), but not outrageous. And the overdrive comes as a bonus. So as long as you put the right LSA cam in there,IMO, it's not all that bad. And if you then gear it hit the power-peak at 60 mph in second gear, then you don't hardly feel the 1-2 split, cuz that takes about 4.10s to no more than 4.30s. First gear is gonna smoke the tires anyway with that starter gear, so the pull is from 33 to 60. The mistake that guys make with this box, IMO, is running lo-perf rear-gears and having to get into third before 60mph. That just brings acceleration to a grinding halt. I ran 4.30s and bigger, and left the line easy,lol.
I like your gear vendor solution, but that is expensive and not just a drop in, you did have to modify your tunnel to get it in there correct ?
A couple of shots with the bfg to get the critical spots, then I just dropped the tail about a quarter inch in the 73-up spool mount. and of course the driveshaft had to be shortened.
I am running a 340 with a 3.55 rear and standard tires.
Yes a 340 gets a lil torque-challenged as you go up in camsize without an accompanying compression increase. I knew this would happen so just started with a 360. And I saved quite a few paychecks to get the aluminum heads, so I could crank the pressure up to 185psi or better. With the extra pressure, I could run a 110LSA cam. I ran the 3.55s for a short time during the first summer I got the odbox; but redline was 95mph in second gear,so the 3.55s had to go...... lol
I tell you what tho, when I put the GVOD behind it, and with the 3.55s again, and with that 223/230/110 cam, hi-way rpm was a tic under 1600@65. I put a lil 600 on her, cranked the timing up, and, leaned her right out. On one trip, point to point, she hit 32mpgUS. That made it all worthwhile.
I first licensed that car in 1999, and the GVOD came in 04/05(not sure which). That unit has saved me so much gas money, and so much wear and tear, that I bet I could freshen the engine , maybe a couple of times, on the stash.
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So, I am not disagreeing with you said perzactically, but I thought, the poor maligned odbox deserved more than where you left her hanging. And IMO, a big engine with a wide powerband, properly geared, could pull it off.
And for me, being able to put it in second at 20 mph, and leaving it there to 60 mph, has it's own kind of appeal. I'd put a small ThermoQuad on her and and let her moan all over town.
 
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