Cam/Head Swap Disaster.......

-
Well, upon further inspection it appears that the intake sealed fine as far as I could see. But, I did see a spot that broke through but it appears to be into nothing? It’s between the cooland passage and the intake passage. I went on and followed the advice given by @nm9stheham. I pulled the lifters out and disassembled them, clean them and put back in order, tedious is an understatement. I believe now that the head gasket has an issue I’m assuming from the high oil pump pressure. I’ll be pulling them tonight or tomorrow. I’ll be buying a new oil pump. Thanks again for the helpful info.

Jake

730F397C-B148-4606-973A-A52555EACF7A.jpeg


E51F9435-8CF3-4A43-AF9F-5901A4706D24.jpeg


80BA6473-3255-459D-AC66-52ACACCEFE23.jpeg


0DB76436-B6BA-445A-B75D-FEAA8537D626.jpeg


76B9DF78-990C-4BBC-B808-B1E6BDFDD5F7.jpeg


1B7493F8-F5D5-41B7-B31C-DD1A82A6B767.jpeg


D460F493-D833-460D-9839-BE26A55AE56D.jpeg


238AC7A1-FFCE-44E2-95E6-AC0D8325696A.jpeg


DC9AA6ED-E058-44D8-8147-9023F2DC01DD.jpeg


2E27253D-7B4C-49AF-8699-58DBA7607520.jpeg
 
Last edited:
Also, was the micro finish brought into spec for the stainless shim head gasket when the block and heads were machined? Even though it’s a slight loss of compression, a standard Fel-Pro gasket or this one Mr. Gasket Head Gaskets 1121G
is a better choice.
 
Garrett Ellison said:
Also, was the micro finish brought into spec for the stainless shim head gasket when the block and heads were machined? Even though it’s a slight loss of compression, a standard Fel-Pro gasket or this one Mr. Gasket Head Gaskets 1121G
is a better choice.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I’m thinking now that I’ll do that but might **** me on the intake side since it’ll make the gap between them bigger. I’ve used them quite a lot but thought I’d try the shim.

Jake
 
That .028 compressed Mr. Gasket deal shouldn’t hurt you too much being that it’s only.004 thicker, but I know they require a very true surface with a specific micro finish to seal.
 
Pulled the driver side head off, it looks like maybe the copper coat didn’t set? Thoughts? Also, anyone know if they require the registration bolts on the heads to be removed to use shim gaskets? I noticed that water passage I block on the front and not the rear? I ask because it appears to only go one way.

Jake

1D3B8EF8-8086-463C-8CE0-4EC1C1E406BA.jpeg


0D3DA145-0B3B-4AFB-A4C7-4B4D0D7C3088.jpeg


CC85AF8A-4D9C-461C-BF0F-2F6BA43D7DAF.jpeg
 
generally head gaskets will only fit one way because of the dowel pins in the block....
 
xLURKxDOGx said:
Pulled the driver side head off, it looks like maybe the copper coat didn’t set? Thoughts? Also, anyone know if they require the registration bolts on the heads to be removed to use shim gaskets? I noticed that water passage I block on the front and not the rear? I ask because it appears to only go one way.

Jake

View attachment 1715344128

View attachment 1715344129

View attachment 1715344130
Click to expand...

Look at the head bolt holes in the first picture and the small water passage holes. The holes are off.
 
Use high temp or copper rtv lightly both sides around water passages next time. Maybe not enough and not set up of the spray.

Is the missing copper coat stuck on the head surface?
 
MOPAROFFICIAL said:
Use high temp or copper rtv lightly both sides around water passages next time. Maybe not enough and not set up of the spray.

Is the missing copper coat stuck on the head surface?
Click to expand...
No, it was wet and wiped off way too easily. I order a new set of Mr. Gasket head gaskets and thicker intake manifold gaskets as reassurance for the next chapter of “karma ruins everything I touch” :/

Jake
 
xLURKxDOGx said:
No, it was wet and wiped off way too easily. I order a new set of Mr. Gasket head gaskets and thicker intake manifold gaskets as reassurance for the next chapter of “karma ruins everything I touch” :/

Jake
Click to expand...

Mr Gasket HEAD GASKETS? Are you wantin a repeat of this bullshit? Jake get the FelPro blue gaskets and be done with it. Mr Gasket makes piss poor head gaskets.
 
RustyRatRod said:
Mr Gasket HEAD GASKETS? Are you wantin a repeat of this bullshit? Jake get the FelPro blue gaskets and be done with it. Mr Gasket makes piss poor head gaskets.
Click to expand...
I agree Mr. Gasket is not the way to go, i use Fel-pro .039 #1008 thicker but never had any sealing issues
 
At this point I would go Fel-pro 1008 head gaskets and ARP head studs not head bolts.
I'm using both the studs and gaskets on a 408 that is seeing 8 psi of boost. They have not blown out yet so you should be really set on a N/A engine.
 
Did you go through your oil pump before putting things back together after wiping out the first cam? Enough metal went through my pump when I wiped a lobe to crap up the rotors pretty good, maybe your's did too and the pressure relief got wedged open. That could explain the filter leak at least.
IMG_20170918_102100.jpg
 
Chase the threads in the head bolt holes in the block all the way to to the bottom, preferably with a bottoming tap. It is possible that some crud is in the bottom of a few holes that prevented 1 or more head bolts from fully seating, even with the proper torque. Also, measure/compare the head bolts to each others to make sure you don't have one stretched.

I would not expect head gasket issues with the Mr Gasket gaskets IF the heads and block have indeed been milled to good flatness. But something is up that made the head gasket not seal.... shim gaskets seal fine if all is good. IMHO, you would be wise to borrow a known very straight flat edge and check the head and gasket surfaces for flatness within +/-.002", regardless of them being machined; things get messed up.

xLURKxDOGx said:
Pulled the driver side head off, it looks like maybe the copper coat didn’t set? Thoughts? Also, anyone know if they require the registration bolts on the heads to be removed to use shim gaskets? I noticed that water passage I block on the front and not the rear? I ask because it appears to only go one way.
Click to expand...
That makes 100% sense.... the coolant flows back through the block and then up and forward through the heads. So forward top hole should indeed be blocked.
 
And take your time on the clean up and clean, clean clean.... it will pay off. I know you are anxious to get this resolved and behind you, but this is no time to get into a hurry.
 
I did a Hemi that went to Australia or some place like that and it came in with its own parts. It had stamped gaskets like that.

There was a problem with the stamping that made the gasket leak, and it wasn't a problem that could be fixed.

That style gasket works by trapping air in those channels and as the head moves away from the block when the cylinder fires (they all move, that's why you need the gasket) the gasket should move with it to keep everything sealed.

One of those channels on that Hemi gasket was stamped so it fed coolant right out the back of the head. The other gasket wasn't that way. Evidently, there was an issue and some bad gaskets made it out to market.

Look very close at what you have. Follow all the channels and see where they dead end, and they need to dead end. If that channel opens to anything that will be your leak. I'd change them both out anyway.

FWIW I was working with Fel Pro gaskets and had to get an engineer on the phone to explain what happened.

Never got a penny from the customer to change out both gaskets. After that, the customer used my parts, and not junk **** he brought in, or I gave him a list of other local shops who would love to do their work.
 
I'm as tight-wad as they get, but when it comes to sealing things 1008 Fel-Pro head gasket, 1213 s Fel-Pro intake gasket, remflex header gaskets, and "the right stuff"(black) RTV on EVERYTHING that needs it...
 
yellow rose said:
I did a Hemi that went to Australia or some place like that and it came in with its own parts. It had stamped gaskets like that.

There was a problem with the stamping that made the gasket leak, and it wasn't a problem that could be fixed.

That style gasket works by trapping air in those channels and as the head moves away from the block when the cylinder fires (they all move, that's why you need the gasket) the gasket should move with it to keep everything sealed.

One of those channels on that Hemi gasket was stamped so it fed coolant right out the back of the head. The other gasket wasn't that way. Evidently, there was an issue and some bad gaskets made it out to market.

Look very close at what you have. Follow all the channels and see where they dead end, and they need to dead end. If that channel opens to anything that will be your leak. I'd change them both out anyway.

FWIW I was working with Fel Pro gaskets and had to get an engineer on the phone to explain what happened.

Never got a penny from the customer to change out both gaskets. After that, the customer used my parts, and not junk **** he brought in, or I gave him a list of other local shops who would love to do their work.
Click to expand...
Every time I hear one of your made-up machinist stories I get closer and closer to hitting the ignore button...
 
j par said:
Every time I hear one of your made-up machinist stories I get closer and closer to hitting the ignore button...
Click to expand...


In fact, several years after the engine was gone, I saw my customer on TV. Classic. It was a motorcycle show. And there he was.

That should make you hit the ignore button.
 
And, I just checked the old interweb and he's still in business. Yup. On TV. Hemi. Went to Australia. Maybe New Zealand. All the same to me.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
-

Back
Top