As I look again at the left rear wheel - it appears that the bottom edge of the front shoe is separating from the lining. Perhaps no surprise since that wheel was smoking hot yesterday. Unfortunate since its was installed about a 100 miles ago.
Ever had self adjusting brakes overtighten?
- Thread starter Ken71Twister
- Start date
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E brake partially applied,shoes will cycle away from anchor pin,pulling cable and tightening adjuster. If parking brake is hanging up even a little, this will cause an issue. The backing up to adjust, as in slamming on brakes and coming to a stop is incorrect. With top of shoes seated against anchor pins you adjust shoes so you can get drums on/ off without force. Normal driving will adjust them.
Thats it. I dont have time to back up and stop 50 times.nor is it effective in the middle of winter.
I have done several hundred brake jobs, and never backed a single vehicle to adjust brakes.
If you expect a parking brake to hold, especially a hand brake, it likely wont. They just dont pull as hard as a foot operated parking brake.
Thats it. I dont have time to back up and stop 50 times.nor is it effective in the middle of winter.
I have done several hundred brake jobs, and never backed a single vehicle to adjust brakes.
If you expect a parking brake to hold, especially a hand brake, it likely wont. They just dont pull as hard as a foot operated parking brake.
rustycowll69
Well-Known Member
obviously, there is something wrong with the e-brake. Just because you're hitting the stop doesn't mean that you necessarily have to keep tightening it, nor does it mean that it isn't still isn't applying undue force on the shoes. Like I said before, back off, or better yet, disconnect the front cable from the axle cables entirely. Then pull the cables forward and backwards in the sheaths to make sure you have unrestricted travel of the cable. They can get rust and dirt in those cables which can bind them up. Then pull the axle cable anchors rearward so there is absolute slack in the cable and no pressure on the shoe lever.
Somebody mentioned earlier about the flex line, but it didn't seem relevant then because the hose feeds both sides, and you said only one drum was getting hot. Now you say both are too tight which raises the possibility that the hose may be breaking down inside where it will allow fluid to flow to the w/c's, but not backwards. If that is the case the w/c's will "pump up" even when your foot is no longer pressing on pedal.
rustycowll69
Well-Known Member
there's nothing wrong with adjusting brakes by backing up. I can't remember if it's in the owners manual, or if it's in the FSM, but it's in there. But good lord, it shouldn't take 50x! Two or three times should be sufficient.
I have read many service manuals but dont recall backing up to adjust brakes ever mentioned. Mind you, i only look at the pictures...
It is a stick.
rustycowll69
Well-Known Member
well that makes it more important to have a functioning e-brake, but unless it's parked on a hill all the time, you can still take the e-brake out of the equation until you get the regular braking sorted out
Are your springs installed correctly in the top pic looks like they are riding on the wheel cylinder pistons
Good catch. Too photo left spring.
Interesting.... looks like both springs on the left are upside down vs the way they are installed on the right side. ....I’ll fix that but not optimistic that the total fix will be that easy since both sides are getting too tight. The previous posts give me a lot to look at. I also have a new master cylinder and parts on hand to rebuild the front brakes. I did the back brakes first because I was replacing the right rear wheel bearing last month. I can’t swear to it - but I’m pretty sure that the rear break lines were replaced back around 2007 when I first got the car back on the road and had some brake issues that I didn’t know how to fix. Now that I’m retired - I want to work thru this myself. Guess I getter quit putting springs in upside down. :-(
rustycowll69
Well-Known Member
when you say you replaced the back lineS, I take it you mean the hard lines on the axle housing. But what about the rubber flex line from frame to axle tee fitting?. Those can deteriorate internally and act like a one way check valve. It usually happens at a strain point. I've never seen it on a rear axle flex line, but I've seen it twice on front brakes on Darts about 20-25 yrs old. Your Duster is almost 50yrs old.
In your first picture, the short spring on the left is installed upside down. Look at how the hook on the end is almost pulling through the hole in the shoe. That bend in the hook should not be visible at all. It should be completely inside the hole. Installed correctly, that spring will pull the shoe tighter and allow it to fully release when your foot comes off the brake pedal. As it is now, it may be allowing the show to not release fully.
Strange but true.... Brother-in-law had replaced brakes at all 4 corners of his 73 Torino. During a short beer run the brakes went hot and dragging. When I popped the wire on master cylinder a gusher of fluid was released and flame jumped up at me. Fire went right out. No harm done. Problem solved.
I dug thru records (actually receipts) this AM and found where the rear hose was replaced in 2007 as part of a brake job. As you can see in the photo - the rubber hose looks pretty healthy.
Daves69
Well-Known Member
Sure looks like it. Compare the gap between the driver and passenger sides. Spring flipped as stated previously pulling the shoe upward (note wheel cylinder front pin angle).......
Separating as said previous. Really time for new...........
I’m going to remove and re-install the brake springs. I’m reluctant to replace the brake shoes before I have reason to think brakes are working okay..... I’d hate to smoke another set of new brake shoes. I’m thinking that the separated piece of liner might drag the drums. Would it be nuts to cut off the loose bit of liner to test the overall brake installation?
I have seen some pretty burned up brakes,what you have there is some inferior brake shoes.If i was in this situation, i would be seeing about warranty.
Doesn't matter what it looks like on the outside, brand new hoses have swelled up on the inside and caused the brakes to stay on. Symptoms are usually exactly what you've described, the brakes work fine initially then start to drag as the drive goes on. Sometimes to the point of locking up solid until a bleeder is cracked to relieve the pressure. Most don't lock up that tight, they usually bleed back once enough pressure builds up. But in the meantime your brakes are dragging.
2007 was 13 years ago too, that's not new. I would expect more from stainless lines, but plain old over-the-counter rubber lines are a quality crapshoot nowadays. And have been since before 2007.
It could be an issue with the return springs too, but you can't rule out that hose just because it "looks healthy".
Either way, those shoes are toast. I'd be surprised if anybody warrantied a scorched set of shoes, but even if they did I dunno that I'd want the same brand shoes if they separated so easily.
rustycowll69
Well-Known Member
get new shoes, but this time get bonded AND riveted, they won't fall apart so easily.
After you replace them, don't go out on the freeway. just drive down around the block and check it. I use my hand to feel the wheels, to tell if one brake is dragging and heating up more than the others.
I ordered new shoes this evening before I saw your recommendation - I didn’t request rivited shoes. I’m curious... how do you describe a properly adjusted brake? My Dad taught me over 50 years ago (on his ‘55 Chevy) to adjust ‘till I could barely feel the brake starting to drag. Not sure if this is correct. How would you describe?
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I’ve ordered brake shoes, flexible rear brake line, and new spring & hardware kit for rear brakes. Also ordered a vacuum kit to assist brake bleeding. Already have new master brake cylinder, front brake shoes and new wheel cylinders for front brakes. Rear brake cylinders were just replaced. I’ll do all of this at once and be extra careful to get springs installed correctly this time. I think I’ll disable the automatic adjusters for now and consider them later.
rustycowll69
Well-Known Member
with all the problems you've had, I would suggest you make changes on a minimal scale, so you can treat problems logically, and as they crop up and not muddy the waters by wholesale changes.
rustycowll69
Well-Known Member
on this forum site, I've heard there are some FSM's for download. I've never accessed them, because I have many of my own, but they are invaluable for reference for members who don't have their own manuals.
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