Offensive to sellers but have people gone over the cliff on Car values

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Right... "THOSE" guys. C'mon...You were flippin' cars with a trailer. Now since its a game that has grown in sophistication and dollars you no longer recognize you are a part of developing what it is today?
Maybe you are right, I doubt it. If you were in this hobby back in 85 or so, I will recognize your opinion.

All I was saying was it was fun back then. I was a country boy that worked hard to find parts cars, parts, projects that I could afford, and yes I made a few buck to help pay for my hobby. Guys that bought cars from me were glad to get them. I worked hard for it all. I drove 3 states away for parts cars, projects, sometimes 700 miles ONE way. Back then, musclecars at BJ, clones, and $100,000 resto jobs probably did not exist.
As time marches on, good project cars are fewer and harder to find, good ones cost more, the sorry POS ones still are priced way high, the cost of building any car gets higher and harder, and ability to sell off a car and get just your money back gets harder ( most of us can't afford to keep them all), and so it goes. I bet 99% of the guys are BJ today are not in my league, buyer or sell. I am just a country boy.
 
And that brand new Duster in 1970 was around 2500 bucks .How did we get to 30 grand for a car ? We are being -ucked

well cars, as with everything else have gone up in price much higher than what an equivalent car cost back in the 1970's. but to be accurate, $2500 dollars for a 1970 Duster that a person in 1970 gave a dealer would be equal to giving that dealer $16,500.00 today for a similar car factoring in inflation on the purchase power of 2020 dollars. so a person who gives mecum or barrett-jackson $30,000.00 for a restored 1970 GTX would be like paying $5000.00 for that GTX in 1970. to put that idea in perspective, a heavily optioned RS/SS 69 z/28 cost around $4100 in 69. a 70 Corvette 454 with several options cost around $6000 in 1970. that 1970 GTX with a Hemi and some other options would have cost someone around $4800 in 1970. so we are paying more money for muscle cars now but the money we are paying represents about the same "percentage" of money we would have paid when we were all back in high school saving up for our "dream car."
 
well cars, as with everything else have gone up in price much higher than what an equivalent car cost back in the 1970's. but to be accurate, $2500 dollars for a 1970 Duster that a person in 1970 gave a dealer would be equal to giving that dealer $16,500.00 today for a similar car factoring in inflation on the purchase power of 2020 dollars. so a person who gives mecum or barrett-jackson $30,000.00 for a restored 1970 GTX would be like paying $5000.00 for that GTX in 1970. to put that idea in perspective, a heavily optioned RS/SS 69 z/28 cost around $4100 in 69. a 70 Corvette 454 with several options cost around $6000 in 1970. that 1970 GTX with a Hemi and some other options would have cost someone around $4800 in 1970. so we are paying more money for muscle cars now but the money we are paying represents about the same "percentage" of money we would have paid when we were all back in high school saving up for our "dream car."
Not really the one thing that hasn't gone up equally is your wages so the purchasing power of your dollar is way less today which means you need to spend more of your life chasing after the money it takes to buy this stuff. You can't only look at one side of the picture .We , for the most part , are slipping backwards economically . It took one income to raise a family and buy what you needed 50 years back , now two struggle
 
There's a lot of greedy sellers looking for a rich guy. Too many rich guys now. I've had my '70 Dart for close to 30 years. It was all I could afford at the time and I never bought another car. I didn't like paying over $500 for any car at the time. One time I went to look at new cars but an aggressive dealer tried to get my drivers license to keep me from leaving! I thought man these guys are crazy or desperate. I don't think I'll ever get a new car now as they are being robotic and having there own intelligence. This is just getting insane. Then there's the repair bills for the thing. Big money.
 
And that brand new Duster in 1970 was around 2500 bucks .How did we get to 30 grand for a car ? We are being -ucked

I bought one of those $2,500 Dusters new. I was making $2 an hour, and gas was .39 a gallon. Just like water, it all runs to level.
 
Just a thought. Is it really fair to directly compare the price of a new car to an old one when new? Even the hot cars of the 60s must in reality have cost much less to build than, say, a hellcat, or even a challenger r/t. The engineering that goes into a new car is undoubtedly far more involved than our classics. Shouldn’t the price necessarily reflect that?

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In 1970, average income was about $10,000, now it's about $64,000. I hear all the time, "wish I could buy one for that now". Adjusting for inflation, you pretty much can. I bought a '72 Duster new. Car payment, and insurance ate a little over 1 week take home pay. If you look at it that way, a new car doesn't sound so bad.
 
In 1970, average income was about $10,000, now it's about $64,000. I hear all the time, "wish I could buy one for that now". Adjusting for inflation, you pretty much can. I bought a '72 Duster new. Car payment, and insurance ate a little over 1 week take home pay. If you look at it that way, a new car doesn't sound so bad.
It all depends on whether you are young and working, or old and retired poor. Old retired guy like me needs no new $30,000 car or $60,000 truck, anyway! If I was young ish and working and made that $64,000 I still would not pay the price for a new vehicle.
Wife is 64 and a R/E agent. That means self employed, no benefits, she pays all her expenses wears out vehicle, and it is feast or famine!!! I HOPE she retired in 6 months at 65 and draws Social Security. At least she can get Medicare,... unless Bernie (and pigs will fly)goes in and you know will happen then.
I have a 90,000 slant Volare, perfect car that's not worth squat, that I can drive till I can't drive anymore, if and when that is all I have to drive!!!!
 
I bought an '03 Monte Carlo new. I drove about 60 miles round trip to work,6 days a week, and had to have a dependable car. It lasted (250,000 miles) until I almost retired, when I switched to the 2000 Impala my aunt gave me. When I retired, I bought a 2013 Impala with 150,000 miles, (salesman's car for $3,500, highway miles, meticulously maintained) , and a new truck. Both of which I plan on lasting me for a long time. My last new truck I bought in '96, hope this one lasts as long. I don't plan on, and don't see any reason I would have to purchase another, as I don't drive 25% of what I did. I have more important things to spend my money on. Grandkids for one. If I was 30-50 years old, with the income I had while working, it would likely be a different story.
 
Price always always always comes down to the buyer. The seller will only need to say yes at a number. The buyer has to push the cash over. Personally the last 3 cars I've gone to look at, that looking at the pictures looked like reasonable value for the price, I walked away from. Pictures made them look great, and the sellers had little idea what they really had. By that I mean rust that was "repaired" (cough), and previous painting and bodywork coming through, and mechanical shortcomings that I honestly felt in each case the seller was ignorant of. Some I mentioned as part of say no, some I didn't want to hurt feelings knowing I'd never see the guy again.
I think the market is a combination of a few things: stocks are doing well along with the economy for most people, the hyperfocusing on auction type pricing, and the ever-shrinking pool of potential buyers all effect the market reality. Personally I see the pricing coming down, except for rare or super desirable models that still have originality, or are correctly (and completely) restored.
 
Supply and Demand. Never changes.

What would you rather drive? A 4 cyl junk box, or a nice older car that is reliable and simple to work on? What does that new junk box cost?
 
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Oh man all the crying in this thread.

This is not a cheap hobby. Want play ya gotta pay. Simple as that.

I always find it funny that when looking to buy everyone has their junk priced too high. When looking to sell you want top dollar.

The flipper haters crack me up too. They do a lot of work networking, finding a deal and being there first with cash to get it.

When buying you can find good deals still. Just have to be patient and wait till it comes along.

When selling Always ask for top dollar in my opinion. You may have someone pay it. Or you can negotiate to where you wanted to begin with and the buyer thinks he got a deal. Win/win.
 
Oh man all the crying in this thread.

This is not a cheap hobby. Want play ya gotta pay. Simple as that.

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If you restore a car, and do all the work, you do deserve some reward for your labor. If you pay to have everything done, you have probably dug a hole, you'll never climb out of.
 
Even doing everything yourself you may still be upside down on a project. Less chance then paying everyone though. Your time is money also. A lot of people seem to forget that.
 
Like said, our hobby costs money, but we decide what model we must have, and what condition it is or will be and how it will get there. I agree the value in general of driver cars, those not perfect show poodles, and not models of great rarity and desirability, will continue to fall. As us older guys fade away, the middle group will, for a large part, graviate toward the reto rod. That group will have the $ and will many lack what it takes to resto the old muscle type car.
I bet the younger generations, will get tired of make believe video stuff, and car wise, will find an interest in having wheels and actually doing something! What it will be, dunno!! LOL
 
Auto-Driving cars will make all self-driving cars museum pieces. Insurance will be unaffordable for anyone who wants to steer themselves. Enjoy your cars now!
 
Auto-Driving cars will make all self-driving cars museum pieces. Insurance will be unaffordable for anyone who wants to steer themselves. Enjoy your cars now!


No question. Manual steering vehicles are on the cusp of a huge shift in our country. 20 years from now Autonomous vehicles will have their stronghold. What's holding things up now are the inconsistencies of all drivers but through attrition and time that will self-eliminate that problem....

I would venture to say that if a newborn came into this world right now there is a possibility they will never have a drivers license....

I guess those Jetson's were forward thinkers after all lol....

JW
 
Good thing I am 72 years old and will never see the dome you guys are forecasting! IF I was young enough to live to see a that kind of future, I bet I would become one of those that went off the grid and rode my horse and packed the others to the store every so many months!!!! lol
 
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OK, this might be a tad off topic, but I'll let others decide that. Yesterday I went to look at a '79 Thunderbird, not because I really want it, though I did own something very similar in the late '80s, but because my buddy asked me to check it out as it belongs to one of his staff. The car was a project that this young man's father had taken on, but most unfortunately the gentleman passed away last year, leaving the T bird unfinished, and the son is not interested in it, but has no idea what it may be worth.
It is a fully loaded car, including the very rare T top option, either a Heritage Edition or Diamond Jubilee model. The engine is a 351 Windsor, it has been rebuilt, has had a QFT 4 bbl carb and aftermarket intake added, trans is rebuilt, body and paint are done, and appear to be a quality job, he has all of the parts to complete it, front end, brakes, etc. all been done. Basically just needs interior put in and all trim pieces re installed. He has most if not all receipts for all the work done. This was a car that this man had been doing for himself, talking with the son it was clear that it was his dream car, no expense spared, he intended to keep it for a long time, a great amount of attention to detail given to doing it right.
I estimated between 10 and 12k in receipts alone for engine rebuild, body and paint, etc. He is hoping that he can sell it for 5k, but the reality is that between the depressed economy and the very limited appeal for a car like this, I think he would do well if he sold it $3500.00. I feel that someone is going to get a great buy on this car, which is good for the buyer, but is it good for the hobby?
 
How funny is all this? It started simply enough with someone trying to gauge what his cars worth basing it off of going prices of other similar cars. The reality is, there are delusional folks out there (Rare this and rare that) whose cars have been for sale forever. Just checkout Marketplace. Put a price on your car and sell it. It seems some are more concerned with the worry that they may sell it for X amount and that buyer will flip it and make more and now you feel like "damn"!! OR they're worried someone else says "man if I knew you were only asking that much" I would've bought it, or the best friend, "man you gave it away"! There are a ton of non buyers that always have to ask their wife or "if I lived closer" on and on. So start much higher than what your bottom dollar is you can always come down but you can never go up and you're never going to retire on the equity. The person that's really interested will inquire regardless of price. My 2 cents deposited.
 
^^I have owned a bunch of old Mopars, but on cars for sale, IF they can't give a price I never ask, and if it is way overpriced as to what it is worth to me, I pass. Plenty of cars for sale without having to deal with meth heads and idiots.
 
OK, this might be a tad off topic, but I'll let others decide that. Yesterday I went to look at a '79 Thunderbird, not because I really want it, though I did own something very similar in the late '80s, but because my buddy asked me to check it out as it belongs to one of his staff. The car was a project that this young man's father had taken on, but most unfortunately the gentleman passed away last year, leaving the T bird unfinished, and the son is not interested in it, but has no idea what it may be worth.
It is a fully loaded car, including the very rare T top option, either a Heritage Edition or Diamond Jubilee model. The engine is a 351 Windsor, it has been rebuilt, has had a QFT 4 bbl carb and aftermarket intake added, trans is rebuilt, body and paint are done, and appear to be a quality job, he has all of the parts to complete it, front end, brakes, etc. all been done. Basically just needs interior put in and all trim pieces re installed. He has most if not all receipts for all the work done. This was a car that this man had been doing for himself, talking with the son it was clear that it was his dream car, no expense spared, he intended to keep it for a long time, a great amount of attention to detail given to doing it right.
I estimated between 10 and 12k in receipts alone for engine rebuild, body and paint, etc. He is hoping that he can sell it for 5k, but the reality is that between the depressed economy and the very limited appeal for a car like this, I think he would do well if he sold it $3500.00. I feel that someone is going to get a great buy on this car, which is good for the buyer, but is it good for the hobby?

I'd go half of receipts. You can always go down, but never up. One never knows who loves something and all it takes is one buyer. What depressed economy?
 
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