A-727 small metal debris in pan - rebuild?

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Both sides of the direct drum. Just move the direct drum back and forth. Sun gear shells wobble all over the place.
 
All of that debris could have come out of the cooler. But are you saying that your trans shifts into third at below 20 mph even at wot?
 
All of that debris could have come out of the cooler. But are you saying that your trans shifts into third at below 20 mph even at wot?

Yea, because all that black crap stuck his governor.:lol:

Just kidding, but that bright red fluid kind of blows my theory of a possible burnt clutchpack doesn't it?
Unless it's been changed, but he said it hasn't.
 
All of that debris could have come out of the cooler. But are you saying that your trans shifts into third at below 20 mph even at wot?
It is difficult to discern the gear changes, must be very soft. It will accelerate like fury and is a bit of a handful; I hope to take my foot off the load pedal before it gets too out of shape, but any time I choose to check (by changing from D to 2) it always shows that it was already in 3rd by then.
I can't feel the 1-2 shift and I have to really concentrate to feel the 2-3 shift.
The fluid could have been changed just before I bought it (Aug19). All of the other parts are good quality; Blueprint crate motor, aluminium radiator, tubular upper control arms, rear discs, F&R anti-roll bars. Plenty spent by previous owner such as braided trans cooler lines; it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to have abused/not serviced the fluid until just before selling.
 
None of that other stuff matters whatsoever. Transs are a whole different breed and I see guys spend $50k on a car and slap in a used trans. If they went first class on the trans, why does it shift like that? Rhetorical question..They didn't. BUT, I was just trying to find out if it shifts into third at under 20 mph at Wide Open Throttle. Shift it manually from second to third with the gas pedal floored. It shouldn't shift into third at 20 mph floored; even manually shifted.
 
There is a new twist to the story... Please see pics
The shuttle valve primary spring has a piece of tube inside, this looks alien and must limit shuttle travel. The ends of this tube are mushroomed over and worn badly.
On page 44, Monroe says that "The shuttle valve controls kickdown "feel" by restricting how fast the fluid is released from the front clutch pack and the outside of the front servo".
I don't see this piece in Monroe's book; has anyone ever seen such a thing?
Is it potentially from a shift kit mod?

ShuttleValvePrimarySpring-1.jpg


ShuttleValvePrimarySpring-2.jpg


ShuttleValvePrimarySpring-3.jpg
 
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There is a new twist to the story... Please see pics
The shuttle valve primary spring has a piece of tube inside, this looks alien and must limit shuttle travel. The ends of this tube are mushroomed over and worn badly.
On page 44, Monroe says that "The shuttle valve controls kickdown "feel" by restricting how fast the fluid is released from the front clutch pack and the outside of the front servo".
I don't see this piece in Monroe's book; has anyone ever seen such a thing?
Is it potentially from a shift kit mod?

View attachment 1715506848

View attachment 1715506849

View attachment 1715506850

One of the b&m shift kits calls for the removal of the shuttle valve spring and the installation of the rod behind the shuttle valve. (or leaving the spring and adding the rod)
What it is supposed to do is block some of the accumulator function making the shifts firmer.

It sounds to me like someone screwed up somewhere in the VB, and those screwups can be really tough to track down.
I'm not saying there isn't a reasonable explanation for the way it's working but it could save you a lot of grief to look for a different VB.
 
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Hey TrailBeast,
It's interesting to hear that the rod may be from a shift kit, thank you for sharing your experience. I'm looking carefully at all of the components in the VB and comparing to the book. I appreciate what you say about using a fresh VB, I've read accounts of spending much time diagnosing and never managing to sort it out.
If I needed to, is there a particular era and type of original VB or a decent aftermarket VB?
 
I've found the B&M shuttle rod mod in the instructions for 10225, pls see pic. It's interesting to see the punishment that this rod (assuming B&M or similar) has received in my VB, considerable force needed to deform the rod in the previous photos.
My new concern is whether I have the original Chrysler separator plate or perhaps a B&M or similar substitute. Is there a reliable means of identifying the Chrysler plate?
Maybe there is no concern, if the holes sizes are checked/modified as per the Transgo TF2 instructions, it could be any plate?
BandM-Shuttle.JPG
 
I hear a lot of talk about a "fresh" valve body..These are like fifty years old...any fifty year olds out there feeling very "fresh"?...The devil you know versus the devil you don't know..
 
It will be next weekend before I get under the Dart again; I'll do the direct drum end play check and hopefully adjust the bands and get the valve body back in.
 
I've found the B&M shuttle rod mod in the instructions for 10225, pls see pic. It's interesting to see the punishment that this rod (assuming B&M or similar) has received in my VB, considerable force needed to deform the rod in the previous photos.
My new concern is whether I have the original Chrysler separator plate or perhaps a B&M or similar substitute. Is there a reliable means of identifying the Chrysler plate?
Maybe there is no concern, if the holes sizes are checked/modified as per the Transgo TF2 instructions, it could be any plate?
View attachment 1715507057

Yea, these are the concerns and why some buy a new aftermarket valve body after screwing with an unknown forever.
Better buy one of the re usable pan gaskets.:D

A person could do as you asked and try and see if the plate has been modded, but there are other parts involved as most kits require changing some of the springs in the VB also.
I have never seen a good way of determining if those are stock or not.

I hear a lot of talk about a "fresh" valve body..These are like fifty years old...any fifty year olds out there feeling very "fresh"?...The devil you know versus the devil you don't know..

My problem with his valve body is that he apparently has some sort of kit and it still shifts too early and soft.
So now we can't be sure of anything that was done to it.
 
Just find exploded views of each valve train and make sure they're all where they're supposed to be and their springs are as well; and that they all move freely.
 
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