Question about early 60's assembly line changeups.

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Wally-T

Wally-T

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Hi folks. I've got a 64 Valiant with a 273 V8. By all accounts so far as vin decoders say it's supposed to have a slant six in it. Personally I would think if anyone was going to swap a six for an eight they would put something later in there but this is a 64-65 style 273.
So my question is, did they make decisions during assembly to put different engines/transmissions in a car than was ordered? If so could they have mistakenly put the six cylinder vin tag on it? I know all manufacturers did some crazy things on the line back then so I wouldn't doubt an engine change mid build. Any thoughts?
Thanks, Wally.
 
Wally-T said:
Hi folks. I've got a 64 Valiant with a 273 V8. By all accounts so far as vin decoders say it's supposed to have a slant six in it. Personally I would think if anyone was going to swap a six for an eight they would put something later in there but this is a 64-65 style 273.
So my question is, did they make decisions during assembly to put different engines/transmissions in a car than was ordered? If so could they have mistakenly put the six cylinder vin tag on it? I know all manufacturers did some crazy things on the line back then so I wouldn't doubt an engine change mid build. Any thoughts?
Thanks, Wally.
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You know what my dads 64 valiant says 6 cylinder but had a 273 4 speed also. It looked completely factory except someone put a 4 barrel on it .
 
Unless you or you dad owned the car since it came off the assy line i would say no chance.
 
Does the car have a fender tag still, the VIN tag may say /6, but the fender tag will tell the whole story.
 
Demonracer said:
Does the car have a fender tag still, the VIN tag may say /6, but the fender tag will tell the whole story.
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It does have a fender tag but I've had no luck deciphering it except for the type of seats it has, which are still correct to the car. I'll re post it shortly to see if anyone can do it.Thanks
 
Wally-T said:
It does have a fender tag but I've had no luck deciphering it except for the type of seats it has, which are still correct to the car. I'll re post it shortly to see if anyone can do it.Thanks
Click to expand...
Here are the vin and fender tag.

20200428_144332[1].jpg


20200428_144240[1].jpg
 
Assuming the fender tag is original—philips head screws turn in both directions—yours decodes as follows:

VX: Canadian Valiant (=Dart body w/Valiant front clip)
2: 8-cylinder engine (=273)
P: Premium trim level (=Signet)
27: Convertible

Your VIN tag can't be properly decoded with an American decoder; you'd need to look in the '64 Canadian factory parts cattledog. That first digit (7) stamped out of alignment with the rest of them is interesting.
 
Personally, the non stock screws, and lack of rivets on the vin makes me suspicous, that either go with the car.

Was a vin stamped anywhere in those days. My 56 ford pu had vin stamped on frame and a riveted on vin tag
 
That must have been made late in the production run, 722883 =622882nd car made that plant that model year
 
There's always the possibility that someone did a VIN swap too, due to lost paperwork, ridiculous DMV fees, stolen car, etc.
 
Wally-T said:
Here are the vin and fender tag.

View attachment 1715523835

View attachment 1715523836
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Don't be too concerned about the Vin having been swapped out. I was worried about that as well with my car. After a bit of research I discovered that they were not riveted on back then and that the holes were used as an alignment tool. Have seen a bunch of Canadian valiants (64-66) in a vintage car wrecking yard here and all looked the same as yours (same on my 63 American dart). Can't speak for the fender tag though. I know some things were different for Canadian vs American valiants. Could have just been removed for paint as it appears the car has been repainted at some point. Possibly put back on with different screws.

Also same Canadian vins decode different than American ones of the same model. Not sure about the dart but something to be aware of.
 
Mineallmine said:
Don't be too concerned about the Vin having been swapped out. I was worried about that as well with my car. After a bit of research I discovered that they were not riveted on back then and that the holes were used as an alignment tool. Have seen a bunch of Canadian valiants (64-66) in a vintage car wrecking yard here and all looked the same as yours (same on my 63 American dart). Can't speak for the fender tag though. I know some things were different for Canadian vs American valiants. Could have just been removed for paint as it appears the car has been repainted at some point. Possibly put back on with different screws.

Also same Canadian vins decode different than American ones of the same model. Not sure about the dart but something to be aware of.
Click to expand...
Thank you very much. That makes me feel somewhat better:icon_fU:
 
I have never seen a fender tag on a 64 or any 63 to 66 A-Body that looks like that, but I have only owned American made Valiants and darts. What is the Canadian tag different from the American tag?
 
These old cars have serial numbers not vin tags. Sorry....not trying to be an a**.

I had an issue in the past when applying for a title. I told the DMV clerk that my car had a serial number not a vin tag. The 20-something clerk refused to believe there were any cars still in use from 1954.

Finally a call to a supervisor cleared that up. But the super made sure the clerk never mixed up the two again.
 
VIN = Vehicle identification number. Just because that number is not stamped in multiple places like later VINs doesn't make it not a VIN. Later VINs are also partly sequential, ie, serial numbers. The VIN on a pre '68 Mopar has more information on it than just a serial number. It is a VIN tag.
 
Back to the original poster:

There were cases (I worked the dealer front lines years ago.) where a customer came in and wanted a particular car NOW! Say red with white interior V8 4bbl. And the salesman would say we have what you want and part of the deal was to swap what ever was needed to make that red with white interior With a V8 4bbl. So the wrench was asked to stay late and make this happen.That involved repaints, engine swaps, axle and wheel swaps. Grant you it was not normal or often... but it did happen. Especially when the end of the month was near and the sales manager was low on deals. They did not care about ID tags or documentation or DMV as nobody paid attention to that stuff back then. Who knew there would be a following 50years later. Back then they were just cars. Just think about today’s Honda or toyota’s being worth 20 times now values in 2050.
 
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