fishmarket
Well-Known Member
What pins do you have the Delrin bushings on?
Some strut bushing info
- Thread starter Oldmanmopar
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What pins do you have the Delrin bushings on?
THESE. perfect fit because they're designed for these bushings
That was a funny read lol. Some old song an dance from this oldmanmopar character. "Look what I have...no you can't have it...do it my way or you are stupid....my son an I are always having to fix things from all the top builders"... Get of your high horse man. I check into your threads in hopes of learning something but its always a pissing match ending with talks of how you do so much for this community and how you just might have to quit. Good riddance
Nice edit, but your childish response is still quoted here.
Clearly you can't have a logical discussion on the topic. If you understood how the suspension actually works, you could.
And, I have plenty of friends. Just none that work for Napa with access to storehouse inventories. I have what I need anyway, my cars all have adjustable strut rods. If the ones I ordered ever come in I have a little side project for them, but I'm not holding my breath and it really isn't important.
I have not. I have used the Energy Suspension poly LCA bushings with great success, and have recently started using BAC's Delrin LCA bushings. The Delrin is also supposed to be self lubricating. I have found that the Firm Feel greaseable LCA pivots fit both of those bushings very well, so, I'm not particularly concerned about the self lubricating bit. The FFI pivots are far better made than the stock pivots were, so no, I'm not worried about the grease hole reducing the integrity of the pivot either.
Actually, I've found that the life of the heims depends a lot on the location. The heims on the adjustable strut rods on my Challenger have gone over 70k year-round street miles and they're still tight and quiet.
But at the UCA's on the same car I've only been getting about 7-10k out of the heims, obviously it's the same car so they're seeing the same road and weather conditions.
So for me, I have absolutely no issues recommending adjustable strut rods with heims for the street. They'll outlast everything else in the suspension. By the same token, I don't recommend heims on the UCA's for street use, poly or delrin bushings at the UCA on the street for me.
I have my Delrin bushings on Firm Feel greaseable pivot pins. They had the best fit of all the ones I tried, but BAC has since started selling their own. I'm sure that theirs fit well too but they weren't available when I bought my Delrin bushings.
Dfr360cuda
Diagnosis... Plum Crazy.
Heim joints bud, they're called heims. And yours work the same way that every other heim ever made does. Which is to say that the aftermarket adjustable strut rods work the same exact way as yours do (without the K member butchery).
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Heim joints... We use them where I work. Damper drive linkage. We call them heim joints. Wikipedia calls them heim joints. Granger, NHRA, Amazon call them heim joints.
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Heim joints... We use them where I work. Damper drive linkage. We call them heim joints. Wikipedia calls them heim joints. Granger, NHRA, Amazon call them heim joints.
Wow didn't know we we were going to spelling class here. But who in the world would paint a early Cuda "perpile"? An english teacher? LOL . Keep on using the easy to install poly LCA butchings. Lube em up. You should be good at that. LMFAO. Your close why don't you stop on in for coffee. PM me for my address. Cuda parts galore. Maybe I can lube your bushings for ya.
Look! More K-member butchery for ya
Look! More K-member butchery for ya
Dfr360cuda
Diagnosis... Plum Crazy.
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Whoooooooa......
I’m on your side.
I like rubber, not poly.
I like PA, not CA.
I wasn’t crazy about perple, but now I love it. The more people tell me how ugly it is, the more I like it.
I’m considering getting a camo wrap. Plum crazy camo Cuda... that should give all the nebshits something to talk about.
I’d like to stop by for coffee if you weren’t so far. Chuck from Bridgeville told me it was worth the trip.
You called them "swivels". They're not. They don't even swivel. It's a heim joint. That's not a spelling thing, that's a not knowing what you're even talking about thing.
Rubber LCA bushings are easy to install too. They just require a press to reinstall them, that's it. You can remove the old outer shells with a cold chisel and a hammer if you have some patience. Any high school Auto-1 kid can do it, there are no special skills needed. And anyone can buy a hydraulic press at Harbor Freight. The idea that it requires some kind of experience, special skills, or knowledge to remove and install a set of rubber LCA bushings is just silly. Buy an 1-3/8" tap and a 20 ton press and you're a pro, piece of cake.
And yeah, another hacked up drag race car. Big deal. Wasn't this thread supposed to be about strut rod bushings? Didn't Jimacuda already provide all the information anyone actually needs?
oi81b4uu812b4
Well-Known Member
That's actually a lot misinformation! And as usual, very incorrect.
The do swivel. Many people use the slang "Swivel Joint" when referring to Heim Joints. But they are also called "Rod Ends", "Spherical Rod Ends", "Mechanical Rod Ends" or "Bearing Rod Ends". QA1 manufactures some of the best on the market, you won't see them listed as "Heim" joins by them in their advertising. Because they aren't the H.G. Heim Company that holds the patent.
Usually they are listed to have between 5 to around 20 degrees of swivel for most automotive application. Some are manufactured to "Swivel" on some Heim joints as much as 65 degrees. You would need to look up the manufacturing drawings and specs to know how much they "swivel", but they all do to some degree. It all depends on how much load you need them to carry.
The fact that they do "Swivel" is also the main reason they prematurely fail. If you were to have the axis of the ball close to the degree limit they were designed for (say 18 degrees in the attached picture), the rod end portion will dig into the ball. They work their best when installed close to 90 degrees so the loads are carried correctly through the race between the ball and rod end. I saw pictures on FAO where a guy installed Hotchkis upper control arms on his Challenger and did just that.
Been using them for 30 years on suspension R&D test fixtures for GM. Installed correctly they can get cycled a million times. Installed incorrect I've seen them wasted in under 100 cycles.
The do swivel. Many people use the slang "Swivel Joint" when referring to Heim Joints. But they are also called "Rod Ends", "Spherical Rod Ends", "Mechanical Rod Ends" or "Bearing Rod Ends". QA1 manufactures some of the best on the market, you won't see them listed as "Heim" joins by them in their advertising. Because they aren't the H.G. Heim Company that holds the patent.
Usually they are listed to have between 5 to around 20 degrees of swivel for most automotive application. Some are manufactured to "Swivel" on some Heim joints as much as 65 degrees. You would need to look up the manufacturing drawings and specs to know how much they "swivel", but they all do to some degree. It all depends on how much load you need them to carry.
The fact that they do "Swivel" is also the main reason they prematurely fail. If you were to have the axis of the ball close to the degree limit they were designed for (say 18 degrees in the attached picture), the rod end portion will dig into the ball. They work their best when installed close to 90 degrees so the loads are carried correctly through the race between the ball and rod end. I saw pictures on FAO where a guy installed Hotchkis upper control arms on his Challenger and did just that.
Been using them for 30 years on suspension R&D test fixtures for GM. Installed correctly they can get cycled a million times. Installed incorrect I've seen them wasted in under 100 cycles.
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Any word on these?
Sure be a handy part number to have on site.
I've checked my sources with no luck.
Suppliers I dealt with 40 years ago aren't there anymore.
Thanks.
Swivels are for fishing, not engineering.
20°’s of misalignment (the correct term, btw) is not swiveling. I've heard them called misalignment joints in professional settings, which is accurate.
The fact that you’ve been using inaccurate terminology for 30 years doesn’t make it correct, it's just slang not the proper term. Same as OMM being wrong about poly bushings for 30 years doesn’t make him right about them either. Doing something wrong for a long time doesn't ever make it right, it just means the involved party doesn't learn.
And “a lot of misinformation”? Sorry, but no. There’s a lot of information in that post, using the term “swivel” when you mean heim is the absolute least of it. The rest of the information is 100% factual, I’ve done everything else I said in that post and it works. Any high school kid can install LCA bushings if they've got access to a press.
And I know how a heim works. The heims on the strut rods on my cars have logged over a 100,000 miles of combined, year round, everyday street driving, I’m perfectly aware of what they’re capable of.
Moog is currently listing them as a 5-8 week delay, you have to accept that term to even place an order.
Amazon actually made me confirm my order again just now, they're listing as trying to ship by September 25th. Order has been pending since July 27th.
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It'll always be a spherical rod end to me.
oi81b4uu812b4
Well-Known Member
Wrong again 72blubberboo. They swivel. If you worked in engineering you know the many different terms for Heim Joints. That name came from a patent the Heim company held for a “Mechanical Joint”. And they all swivel.
Oh, my terminology is correct. I know the names that are used. But you are the guy that installed them wrong on your Challenger, because you don’t know the axis thru the ball swivels and needs to be as close to 90 degrees as possible through its motion.
You can unpurse your lips now and take your hand off your hip before your mascara starts to run.
It'll always be a spherical rod end to me.
Right?!
You want to be technical that's what it is. But "spherical rod end" is a bit of a mouthful, "heim" is easier.
The LCA travels in an arc and the strut rod is attached at an angle to it and also travels in an arc. So 90° to what now? They sit at an angle so the end rides through the middle of the range of misalignment from the top of the travel to the bottom. Hook 'em up like you describe and they won't last the 70k+ miles the ones on my challenger have done. They still look brand new too, nice and tight.
And just like OMM. Massively insecure personality, immediately resorts to name calling when questioned, incapable of logical discussion. It's pretty clear why you work in a second rate contracted brake R&D shop that just cycles the parts they get from GM on a test fixture and reports back. Not even your shop. After 30 years any engineer worth his salt should be running a shop of that caliber, not working under the engineers that do.
Wow
oi81b4uu812b4
Well-Known Member
Right?!
The LCA travels in an arc and the strut rod is attached at an angle to it and also travels in an arc. So 90° to what now? They sit at an angle so the end rides through the middle of the range of misalignment from the top of the travel to the bottom. Hook 'em up like you describe and they won't last the 70k+ miles the ones on my challenger have done. They still look brand new too, nice and tight.
And just like OMM. Massively insecure personality, immediately resorts to name calling when questioned, incapable of logical discussion. It's pretty clear why you work in a second rate contracted brake R&D shop that just cycles the parts they get from GM on a test fixture and reports back. Not even your shop. After 30 years any engineer worth his salt should be running a shop of that caliber, not working under the engineers that do.
They aren't called Heim's, because that's a vendor name. Just like you wouldn't call phenolic by Synthane. Maybe we should call them QA1's because they make the best ones. It's your logic? One guy I work with calls them Heimi's when we test for Chrysler.
Actually... you didn't have them installed right on your Challenger, then you got into all pissy & bitchy with your panties in a bunch when I responded to your numerous posts on FAO and FEO, the ones where you were telling the world that Hotchkis sold you junk and they were worn out in 7,000 miles. Crying, lots of crying until Hotchkis just gave you a set because you were ruining their business and our hobby. You didn't know how to install them correctly, you even provided pictures to that fact. ( But let's all wait now for your snarky come back about how something that has various names, that you can't accept because of your princess title ).
I never did thank you by the way. They were doing a Power Point presentation at work about problems and solutions. We had to show what happens when you install a spherical rod end beyond the "Swivel" specs of a manufacturer. The only place I could find an example of some idiot installing them incorrectly and not trying to hold 90 degrees between the axis on the ball and the threaded rod end was your pics that you posted all over the internet...
Long story short. I got a raise for all my help ( copy and pasted your pics in my email ). But, I really needed to thank you for posting those pics. I owe you a beer... or a Zima or whatever you fruits in California drink. ( Can you drink liquids out there? Or do you have to use them to put out your state which is always on fire ).
Sorry to bother you, it must be rough not knowing how to put out a fire and be employed as a firefighter. Couple that with forgetting your purse in your house when you stormed out to your car that takes you 4 hours to start.
512Stroker
We are all here because we are not all there.
You are correct JimmyIt'll always be a spherical rod end to me.
I have been purchasing Rod Ends from these folks for a couple of decades.
ROD END SUPPLY - Rod End Supply
Heim joint is always capitalized I see. It must be a brand name. Like Kleenex or Q tip.
oi81b4uu812b4
Well-Known Member
Spherical rod ends we’re invented in Germany by the Nazi’s. In WW2 we Americans shot down a Nazi plane and we discover them used on it. So we gave them to the Heim Company and the Brits have theirs to the Rose Company to produce for the war effort. As much as we call them Heim joints here, the Brits call them Rose joints.
Neither company is around now. So ... QA1 joints? Nazi joints?
Kleenex? You mean Booger Blasters.
Neither company is around now. So ... QA1 joints? Nazi joints?
Kleenex? You mean Booger Blasters.
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Oh I see, now you're talking about a COMPLETELY different application. The heims on the strut rods on my Challenger have gone 70,000 miles and work great. The heims on the Hotchkis UCA's on my Challenger did wear out in 7k miles. And Hotchkis did send me new ones, after I spoke with their tech and their tech reviewed the pictures I posted as well as others that I sent them directly when they asked. We spoke several times both directly and by email. Their conclusion was that the UCA's were installed correctly, which I confirmed because I wanted to make sure the replacements were installed correctly. Everyone makes mistakes, me included. If Hotchkis had contacted me and said they thought I installed their UCA's incorrectly I would have updated my posts to say exactly that and installed the new ones according to their tech's instructions. But that's not what they said. They said there was nothing wrong with the installation, and sent a new set of heims and the new rod end boots that they were not selling when I originally purchased my UCA's.
I'm also not the only one that's had issues wearing out heim joints at the UCA. @autoxcuda has had the same issue with his Hotchkis UCA's. Hotchkis was great to me, and I never blamed them or said their UCAs or even their heim joints were junk. I still have their UCA's on my Challenger and intend to keep on running them. I didn't even ask for any replacements, the parts were not within warranty. Hotchkis reached out to me. And to say that I'm important enough to "ruin their name and our hobby" is pretty hilarious. Hotchkis never asked me to alter my posts or take down the pictures either. I made a big deal out of saying how they went out of their way to send replacement parts, and that their techs were very helpful. All of that said, I do not think that heims at the UCA are a good choice for a street car, because they have proven to have longevity issues in that application. Not just on my car, and not just Hotchkis.
I do have to compliment you on your imagination though, because I can't imagine any professional setting where you'd need to do a powerpoint on something like you describe, or that it would be worth a raise even if you did. Cool story though.
Keep on digging with the insults, it really just demonstrates that you're a toddler.
Yup, and people ask for a kleenex when they want a tissue too. Some brand names become synonymous with the product.
oi81b4uu812b4
Well-Known Member
Nope. You had them installed wrong. You just won’t admit it. And I have first hand knowledge you did so and Hotchkis just wanted to quiet you down because you were ruining their business.
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Just in case anyone here still wants K7068 strut rod bushings, I received this email from RockAuto yesterday.
First hand knowledge? So, you were there when I installed them then? Dang man you should have said something!
I'm beginning to think you've mixed me up with your weed dealer!
And I would think if Hotchkis was all that worried about the business I was costing them they'd have emailed me about my alternate TVS parts list by now. As you've pointed out I've posted it plenty of times, and if every member I posted it for skipped a TVS system it would mean a lot more money than anything I posted about their heims. Which I still post about, so, that didn't work.
Gosh, maybe Hotchkis should comp me a couple of TVS systems so I'll stop recommending BergmanAutoCraft UCA's, Firm Feel torsion bars, Hellwig sway bars and QA1 strut rods and LCA's! You hear that Hotchkis? Just PM me for my name and address, because I don't want Brian Prichard to get my parts.
First hand knowledge? So, you were there when I installed them then? Dang man you should have said something!
I'm beginning to think you've mixed me up with your weed dealer!
And I would think if Hotchkis was all that worried about the business I was costing them they'd have emailed me about my alternate TVS parts list by now. As you've pointed out I've posted it plenty of times, and if every member I posted it for skipped a TVS system it would mean a lot more money than anything I posted about their heims. Which I still post about, so, that didn't work.
Gosh, maybe Hotchkis should comp me a couple of TVS systems so I'll stop recommending BergmanAutoCraft UCA's, Firm Feel torsion bars, Hellwig sway bars and QA1 strut rods and LCA's! You hear that Hotchkis? Just PM me for my name and address, because I don't want Brian Prichard to get my parts.
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I didnt see anything specific about "oi81's" employment....just that he worked in a r&d shop...cycling spherical rod ends and GM suspension components for the last 30 years.
I have read through this thread and when I get some time I will clean it up. (take all the bull **** out from both sides of the fence.) If you guys want to talk civil about strut bushings fine. Otherwise don't post. Repeat offenders will be removed from the thread or worse.
I will leave the this thread up but close it for further comments. I will be busy this afternoon but I can clean it up later today.
Well as soon as I closed it jimacuda gave me a big red x. Sorry guys. To the trash it goes. I will clean it from there. If i hear **** about my decision it will stay there.
This thread is closed until further notice.
Well as soon as I closed it jimacuda gave me a big red x. Sorry guys. To the trash it goes. I will clean it from there. If i hear **** about my decision it will stay there.
This thread is closed until further notice.
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