I'm a low budget rookie lol, piecing together my build, $13,000 for heads & valvetrain WOW. 440-1 I don't know much about them except they're bad *** compared to the trickflows
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I don't know if this has been asked yet but how fast do you go with trick flow 240's ?
- Thread starter MOPARMAGA
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PRH
Well-Known Member
I think Greg’s assessment is about right.
Street/strip, and bracket race up to about 600-650hp, especially with motors in the 470ci and smaller range...... the 240’s make sense.
Get into that 500” and up range, and 650+ hp(or stock stroke combos looking for pretty high rpm peaks)...... the 270’s get the nod.
Street/strip, and bracket race up to about 600-650hp, especially with motors in the 470ci and smaller range...... the 240’s make sense.
Get into that 500” and up range, and 650+ hp(or stock stroke combos looking for pretty high rpm peaks)...... the 270’s get the nod.
cookietruck
Well-Known Member
why would someone port the PP240 heads when they could spend much less than cost porting and just get the PP270 heads?
Do it myself maybe
We all run what we run combo wise with reasons for it but your giving away a bunch there with those good TF heads with that small cam and hdrs, funds allowing I'd stick a .600+ sft in there with min 2" hdrs.
I had a very similar set up chassis wise and ran 10.71@125 at 3250+lbs in my back halved Cuda with 4.88's/32" tyres and a 4800 stall running a 440-6pk 10:1cr stock b/end motor with 265cfm@best 906's and a comp .650" SFT cam and an 850DP with a crappy Team G intake with 2" f/wells, trapped@6600, made very similar hp to what you have unless your running 128+mph and you outflow my heads by 50cfm....just saying as an example.
moparstud440
Well-Known Member
I used to have 2" hooker fenderwell headers on the car, but than tied the cage to the front frame and the fenderwells wouldn't work so I put on the 1 3/4" TTI I had (At the time I thought they were 1 7/8 so didn't think much of it, but Looking back I should have made the bars tie to the frame so it wouldn't affect the headers, but hind site is 20/20.) I kept the hookers and as a winter project I'm modifying them to fit. Only have to redo tube #7 and #8. Was also going to swap in a .590 cam I have, but don't feel like doing that much work. I'll wait until I freshen up the motor to do that. I'm curious what the headers alone will help pick it up.
PRH
Well-Known Member
Basically....... I don’t mess with porting heads......that are already ported.
Especially if I feel like they’re already working pretty good....... which is the case of the TF240 imo.
How much duration @.050 is the .590 ?
Wish I knew the answer to the header question engine masters did a header swap dyno session, I think it was 20+ hp gain on a 650+hp engine from 1.75 to 2 inch. I have 2 inch fenderwell hookers to go onto mine & will make the frame to firewall bars after the headers are installed If it's possible
I believe the .590 is 272/275@.050 without checking, my buddy ran that cam in his 3150lb 440 Dart to 10.1's@130>132 with MCH Eddys@320cfm, victor intake, 2" hdrs and a 1050 Dom at 12.5:1cr...motor made just at 600fwhp, blew a rod out the side eventually with the 1/2" internal pick-up oiling once he started trapping@6900rpm with 4.56/31"tyre 5000 stall.
For a goal of 10.00 with what you gave for a car i would go right to the 270s.
1. A race converter will get you into the torque peak of the 270, which would be higher rpm than 240s
2 you can easily get there with 270s and a flat tappet cam
3 my guess is 675 hp to 700 hp will be cheaper using 270s
4 you will have untapped power potential for the future
5 the 240 port size( or stock iron head port size) worked VERY well on a little 383 roadrunner motor. The 440 got the same head, but IMHO it should have gotten a max wedge (270 size?) Head! You have a 512, a full 1/3 larger motor than the 383.
I look back at a pivotal point in my engine program. 2002. I had unported 440-1 heads with great valve train, a megablock with 4.500 bore, a billet 4.50 stroke crank.
I spent money on porting the heads TWICE.
I sold the 4.5 crank and went with a 4.15 which cracked after 100 passes.
If i had kept the 4.5 crank and bought B1Mc heads, i could have made another 150 hp + for less money than i spent to get 847!
Cubes and great heads!!!!
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Good points, however I'm the owner already of my 240s. I have a 470 cube engine.
The factory big block heads aren't 240 cc's though (correct me if I'm wrong). Honestly I can't afford to go faster than 10s, definitely not these next couple years
PRH
Well-Known Member
I put together a bracket race low deck 452 about 20 years ago or so using std port stage 6’s that flowed around 300.
12:1cr, 280@.050 roller, RB TG/4500 intake, dominator carb, 2-1/8 x 4 headers.
Made 650hp.
The TF240’s outflow that pair of stage 6’s across the board.
12:1cr, 280@.050 roller, RB TG/4500 intake, dominator carb, 2-1/8 x 4 headers.
Made 650hp.
The TF240’s outflow that pair of stage 6’s across the board.
yellow rose
Overnight Sensation
I have a question about head gaskets my finished bore is 4.375 & I'm trying to get all the compression I can with my flat tops, is it safe to use a 4.380 bore cometic ?
PRH
Well-Known Member
A lot of time too much emphasis is placed on the flow number.
When, many times the port “area” ends up becoming the more dominant feature in terms of power production.
If the heads for a particular combo are grossly undersized, having them flow a little more cfm and staying too small isn’t as effective as having them flow the same..... but with more area.
Ideally...... you’re looking for a good balance of flow vs area vs engine displacement.
This is why there are so many runner size options for the more popular brand X stuff.
When, many times the port “area” ends up becoming the more dominant feature in terms of power production.
If the heads for a particular combo are grossly undersized, having them flow a little more cfm and staying too small isn’t as effective as having them flow the same..... but with more area.
Ideally...... you’re looking for a good balance of flow vs area vs engine displacement.
This is why there are so many runner size options for the more popular brand X stuff.
PRH
Well-Known Member
“Generally”, when talking about exactly the same head, then yes.
But...... not necessarily.
Depends on where the extra cc’s come from, which may or may not result in a change to the minimum CSA(cross sectional area).
For example, if you’re working on a head where the min CSA is the pushrod pinch, and you do some porting everywhere else in the port....... but leave the pinch area untouched....... you have increased the “volume”(cc’s), but you have not increased the minimum CSA.
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Ah, good explanation. So theres still a choke point. I have a fuel injected 5.9 magnum in a 99 r/t dakota I put engine quest heads on before I knew much of anything I went hog wild with my carbide, going at it from the bowl area & port side I think I gained 3/8th on cross section pulling from both sides of the pinch, what I did made it so the tires blow off consistently at 3800 rpm, for a street truck I think what I did was slowed the velocity down & now I get near 7 mpg city. (If that makes any sense) does that sound right? Too big of port for the application
Depends on the car. A 470 with TF240 heads in a rail would go pretty darn fast. In an A body, 10's should be fairly easy to accomplish. The previous owner of my Duster used to drive it to the track and run 10.90s on street tires thru the exhaust. That was with a full interior, all steel Duster. The engine was a stock stroke 400 with high compression pistons and Edelbrock heads from PRH. Those were good heads for the time but I don't think they were any better than a set of 240 heads.
That 400 made around 575 hp on the dyno, maybe made 525 in the car with fenderwell headers and a full exhaust. Car probably weighed 3400 lbs with driver.
A 470 with decent compression, good cam and 240 heads shouldn't have any trouble making 600+ hp. Should run mid to high 10's without any trouble in an A body as long as the car is half way set up.
Thanks Andy, I'm pretty much copying your 470 with a little more compression, I'd like to run as much of the stuff you had, besides crank trigger & that amazing oiling system. I've got the hV external milodon kit
Going to sell my solid f/t stuff & go for the solid roller, what's your opinion on 4500 (950-1050) on a spacer to the trickflow intake? Was that tried in your tests ?
Yes we did a lot of carb testing with those 470 engines. Basically what we learned was that a big 4150 worked best on a 4150 intake and the 4500 carb worked best on a 4500 intake. The adapters were all kind of blah. For the 4150 intakes we ended up using a QuickFuel 1050AN. I had a bunch of different Dominator carbs that I tested. A custom 1050 usually worked the best. I eventually sold all my carbs (I had about 20 at one point) and used the cash to buy a few different EFI systems. I don't mess with carbs anymore.
I have a nice solid roller cam for a street/strip 470. Might be a tad small for a drag race only 470. It is one of the last dyno parts I have left from those 470 test engines. Shoot me a PM if you're interested.
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