E85 Better with Dual Plane Intake

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72DMag

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I came across this thread and was curious if a dual plane intake with E85 is better than a single plane intake. Now lets say you shift at 5500 to 5800 and the car is drag car only. Given that its a drag car typically its better to go with single plane. The article compared a regular intake manifold to a tunnel ram and with E85 the regular intake gave 18 more hp compared to the tunnel ram. The OP thinks its due to the heat crossover heating up the e85.

Has anyone tested on their engines with E85 and seen any difference between a single and dual plane intakes? Also, if a dual plane is better I don't think the air gap intake has a heat exchange crossover so I guess a regular dual plane is better for e85 (based on article evidence).

Dyno test - std Performer beats tunnel ram
 
I came across this thread and was curious if a dual plane intake with E85 is better than a single plane intake. Now lets say you shift at 5500 to 5800 and the car is drag car only. Given that its a drag car typically its better to go with single plane. The article compared a regular intake manifold to a tunnel ram and with E85 the regular intake gave 18 more hp compared to the tunnel ram. The OP thinks its due to the heat crossover heating up the e85.

Has anyone tested on their engines with E85 and seen any difference between a single and dual plane intakes? Also, if a dual plane is better I don't think the air gap intake has a heat exchange crossover so I guess a regular dual plane is better for e85 (based on article evidence).

Dyno test - std Performer beats tunnel ram


All that shows is the guy doing the tunnel ram had no clue and was dead lost. That TR should have blown the doors off that DP intake everywhere.
 
I came across this thread and was curious if a dual plane intake with E85 is better than a single plane intake. Now lets say you shift at 5500 to 5800 and the car is drag car only. Given that its a drag car typically its better to go with single plane. The article compared a regular intake manifold to a tunnel ram and with E85 the regular intake gave 18 more hp compared to the tunnel ram. The OP thinks its due to the heat crossover heating up the e85.

Has anyone tested on their engines with E85 and seen any difference between a single and dual plane intakes? Also, if a dual plane is better I don't think the air gap intake has a heat exchange crossover so I guess a regular dual plane is better for e85 (based on article evidence).

Dyno test - std Performer beats tunnel ram

Yeah , thats why pro stockers run them !
 
Heres what I wish the article did but wanted to bounce this idea of of you guys. The article never mentions advancing the timing when testing comparison of the tunnel ram vs standard dual plane. I think he's right that the dual plane made more power cause of the heat exchange based on where the engine timing was set at. However, since the single plane kept the fuel cooler its safe to say more timing could easily be added using this intake and hence more power hp and torque "should" be achieved. Is my logic correct?
 
IDK anything about racing nor about E85. Hmmmmmmm

But from what I do understand, book-knowledge only,the only reason to run an alcohol based fuel is because of it's ability to resist detonation, which comes partly maybe mostly, from it's ability to suck up vast amounts of heat.
By itself, that fuel has less BTUs in it than does gasoline. So it requires a lot more of it, to make the same power.
The thing is, getting any fuel into an engine is usually pretty easy.
Getting the air in is always the hard part.
I'm sure you know all that, but here comes the point;
What if,
that intake was running so cold (he said icy cold), that ice was forming inside it, making the airflow crazy? or lazy? Hmmmm
I don't race, but if I did, I'd want to run a TR.

But here's what I do know;
My street car is a 4-speed 68 Barracuda with an alloy-headed 367 at 10.95Scr and she runs on 87E10. It has a small cam at 230/237/110.
I took it to the track one hot July day, and run it up the track 4 times. 3 runs were a bust but the 4th was as good as I thought it could be. She ripped off, lol, a 93mph Eighth. At 3467 pounds me in it , this translates to 433hp @930 ft elevation.
I thought that was too good.
I didn't believe it so I took my case to the starter booth, and they said no, the timers were working right (they had been having issues which negated one of my earlier runs, the other two being missed shifts on my part). I still didn't believe it, so I went over to the guy that TnTed in the other lane, and he said his time was correct for his car.
So what could I do? Thinking back, I suppose I should have made a back-up run, but that was 2004, and I really didn't gibachit how fast the car was. I was just there to shutup the car show fans who kept telling me I shouldda built a 340.
She runs an Airgap, and the timing was somewhere between 32 and 34 . I never even thought about the "up to 10% alcohol factor" in my fuel, but now that I am thinking about it; hmmmmmm
Another thing I can tell you; is in summer, it takes 3 to 4 miles for the engine to warm up, while cruising at 60mph. I can tell, by when, the car picks up about 4 mph, and I then dial back the cruise timing. ( dash-mounted, dial-back, timing-retard box) Now she's ready to rock!

Anyway, Like I said; IDK the answers to your questions; just pondering while the smarter than me men are away, thinking.
 
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I came across this thread and was curious if a dual plane intake with E85 is better than a single plane intake. Now lets say you shift at 5500 to 5800 and the car is drag car only. Given that its a drag car typically its better to go with single plane. The article compared a regular intake manifold to a tunnel ram and with E85 the regular intake gave 18 more hp compared to the tunnel ram. The OP thinks its due to the heat crossover heating up the e85.

Has anyone tested on their engines with E85 and seen any difference between a single and dual plane intakes? Also, if a dual plane is better I don't think the air gap intake has a heat exchange crossover so I guess a regular dual plane is better for e85 (based on article evidence).

Dyno test - std Performer beats tunnel ram

Feel free to notice that its a single carb tunnelram. those tend to have huge *** plenums and terrible distribution creating all kinds of isues and with so much heavy fuel in a big plenum that moves slow it appears logical that the appliction might work slightly better when hoter but i bet the correct tunnelram with TWO carbs on top would leave the performer behind at most points.

All that shows is the guy doing the tunnel ram had no clue and was dead lost. That TR should have blown the doors off that DP intake everywhere.

Notice the single carb part?

Yeah , thats why pro stockers run them !
They work good on alot of things just needs to be the right tunnelram for the appliction

Heres what I wish the article did but wanted to bounce this idea of of you guys. The article never mentions advancing the timing when testing comparison of the tunnel ram vs standard dual plane. I think he's right that the dual plane made more power cause of the heat exchange based on where the engine timing was set at. However, since the single plane kept the fuel cooler its safe to say more timing could easily be added using this intake and hence more power hp and torque "should" be achieved. Is my logic correct?
timning seems to be more related to combustion chamber,unless you are forced to run less timing to stay out of detonation due to to much compression.

IDK anything about racing nor about E85. Hmmmmmmm

But from what I do understand, book-knowledge only,the only reason to run an alcohol based fuel is because of it's ability to resist detonation, which comes partly maybe mostly, from it's ability to suck up vast amounts of heat.
By itself, that fuel has less BTUs in it than does gasoline. So it requires a lot more of it, to make the same power.
The thing is, getting any fuel into an engine is usually pretty easy.
Getting the air in is always the hard part.
I'm sure you know all that, but here comes the point;
What if,
that intake was running so cold (he said icy cold), that ice was forming inside it, making the airflow crazy? or lazy? Hmmmm
I don't race, but if I did, I'd want to run a TR.

But here's what I do know;
My street car is a 4-speed 68 Barracuda with an alloy-headed 367 at 10.95Scr and she runs on 87E10. It has a small cam at 230/237/110.
I took it to the track one hot July day, and run it up the track 4 times. 3 runs were a bust but the 4th was as good as I thought it could be. She ripped off, lol, a 93mph Eighth. At 3467 pounds me in it , this translates to 433hp @930 ft elevation.
I thought that was too good.
I didn't believe it so I took my case to the starter booth, and they said no, the timers were working right (they had been having issues which negated one of my earlier runs, the other two being missed shifts on my part). I still didn't believe it, so I went over to the guy that TnTed in the other lane, and he said his time was correct for his car.
So what could I do? Thinking back, I suppose I should have made a back-up run, but that was 2004, and I really didn't gibachit how fast the car was. I was just there to shutup the car show fans who kept telling me I shouldda built a 340.
She runs an Airgap, and the timing was somewhere between 32 and 34 . I never even thought about the "up to 10% alcohol factor" in my fuel, but now that I am thinking about it; hmmmmmm
Another thing I can tell you; is in summer, it takes 3 to 4 miles for the engine to warm up, while cruising at 60mph. I can tell, by when, the car picks up about 4 mph, and I then dial back the cruise timing. ( dash-mounted, dial-back, timing-retard box) Now she's ready to rock!

Anyway, Like I said; IDK the answers to your questions; just pondering while the smarter than me men are away, thinking.

Seriously doubt you will find ice on the inside of a intakemanifold, seeing frosted outsides of runners on E85 burners is not uncomon,but frosted insides? What does windshild washer fluid do on a frosted windshield does it ice it up worse or melt the frost?
 
Feel free to notice that its a single carb tunnelram. those tend to have huge *** plenums and terrible distribution creating all kinds of isues and with so much heavy fuel in a big plenum that moves slow it appears logical that the appliction might work slightly better when hoter but i bet the correct tunnelram with TWO carbs on top would leave the performer behind at most points.



Notice the single carb part?


They work good on alot of things just needs to be the right tunnelram for the appliction


timning seems to be more related to combustion chamber,unless you are forced to run less timing to stay out of detonation due to to much compression.



Seriously doubt you will find ice on the inside of a intakemanifold, seeing frosted outsides of runners on E85 burners is not uncomon,but frosted insides? What does windshild washer fluid do on a frosted windshield does it ice it up worse or melt the frost?


Yeah, I saw the single carb. Still should have blown the doors off that dual plane junker intake.
 
I agree the control of the tests should have been better. I plan to test this with my engine I have both the m1 magnum and hoping to find the eddy air gap intake for my magnum. Will be interesting to see after a jet change what the car does. Thanks all!
 
In the beginning of his article it says he used similar jetting to a gas combo making similar hp and bsfc numbers. No way should that be accurate. I’d like to know more about his “e85 package” and what that consists of.
 
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And later on he posts that he had to switch from a 6.5 power valve to a 3.5 on the tunnel ram to get “any sort of idle”. IDLE?? Ok now I question the validity of the whole test. He clearly has no idea how to tune a carburetor.
 
And later on he posts that he had to switch from a 6.5 power valve to a 3.5 on the tunnel ram to get “any sort of idle”. IDLE?? Ok now I question the validity of the whole test. He clearly has no idea how to tune a carburetor.


BINGO
 
I had the airgap and while it did give me improvement over the ld4b it replaced. I was even more impressed with the Victor 340 intake which is a single plane intake. Gained power everywhere. However, not E85 fuel.
 
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