Oregon Cam #346 - questions

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csheehy

^Yup, that's me
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For those using the Oregon Cam Grinders #346...
1. Are you happy with it?
2. What other engine mods have you done?
3. What RPM do you feel the power (street, not racing or WOT)
4. What's your stall RPM?

Here's my baseline: a long-rod engine using factory 198 rods, Wiseco PTS536A45 pistons, 1.70&1.45-inch valves, 9.5 compression, OCG cam #346 (see spec sheet two posts below), Elgin double-roller timing set, 8.25 rear with 3:21 gears, 24" height tires (215/60R14 X4), induction is a Holley 390 vac-secondary 4bbl through an Offy intake - optimized for velocity, power should be in the range of 210-230HP&TQ, '68 Barracuda that tips in around 2,900 lbs., 904 tranny with TransGo TF1 kit, rebuild will follow Tom Hand's as outlined in his book - pg.204 (overview>> DISKS: BorgWarner[BW] or Raybestos[Ray]- smooth rear, waffle grooves front, FT CLUTCH CLEARANCE: .015-.020 per-fiction-disk, KICKDOWN LEVER: 3.8, KICKDOWN BAND: cast - wider if avail with BW or Ray std linings, OVERRUNNING CLUTCH: stock, LOW-REVERSE BAND: stock, REAR CLUTCH CLEARANCE: .030-.050", SERVOS: front/stock rear/billet, STEELS: stock-type, LUBE: synthetic). The pistons, lifters, valves, and spring assemblies are all lighter than stock. Valve spring pressure is in the range of 280-300#. (all theoretical, somewhat). Most of my driving is twisty and hilly back roads at about 40 to 50 mph The other 40% of my travels are highway 65-70.
So, what should my stall be?
My engine is at the machine shop, just doing my due-diligence, so I'm ready in the spring time.
 
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Sorry @Bewy & @RustyRatRod , I hadn't considered non-346-owners would respond - all are welcome in the pool, though! This is all black-magic to me, so thank you.

The 346 is the last on this list... full page is HERE if you want a better view.

upload_2021-2-28_9-3-51.png
 
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The 346 shows more int duration than exh, the only cam in the chart that has that. Is it a typo?
 
The 346 shows more int duration than exh, the only cam in the chart that has that. Is it a typo?

No. It's a slant six thing. Or rather a Doug Dutra thing. He's come up with several reverse duration and total reverse grinds for the slant six. He ultimately found though that there was little to no benefit, IF I remember right. Erson picked up on one of the grinds and I think this 346 is one Ken decided to include in their list for the slant guys.

It's a decent enough grind. I like the low lift. Will take a single spring like the Comp 901 with no head machining. Will be nice and reliable with very low stress on the valve train. But with that 106 LSA and those pretty big duration @ .050 numbers, it's gonna have a pretty good lumpy idle. Might be what you want, so go for it.
 
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I like the cam for all the reasons you do @RustyRatRod but what do you think a good stall would be for a torque converter?

**** if I know. What's all this goin in? What gear? What else are you using on the engine? Everything. intake, exhaust, compression and so forth.
 
You'll need more gear, IMO. More like 3.5 at least but 3.91 preferred. Also, I don't see cylinder head mods mentioned. Your power estimate is VERY ambitious without a ported head and larger valves, IMO. The head flow just "ain't there". Now that doesn't mean it won't be peppy as all heck.
 
The thing to do with a slant six is "don't worry" what the power will be. Build it according to your plan, make all the part match to the plan. Just as you would any other build. Build the slant six because you love it and love being different.

I like the combo. As long as you're not afraid to gear it, it'll run strong. I think "I" would go for a custom converter that will flash to 3500-3800. Modern custom converters will run around town tight as a stock converter and only flash to their stall speed when you launch hard. That's what I would put in it. With a 3.91 gear.
 
@RustyRatRod valve info is in my original post :)
1.7 & 1.4 from a Ford 260/289 with smaller stems. The runner into the port will be gasket matched but only in the direction of airflow. Both will be smoothed, but not highly finished to yield a high air velocity while keeping things in suspense. Intake seat will be radius back, and the ball will get a hog cut, a basic street port. Hoping to fit a set of canonical or beehive springs. The 346 calls for 300 foot pounds, but if I go with either tapered setup, I can probably come in around 280. Just a little extra info to exercise your noggin. Thank you so much for your input!
 
@RustyRatRod valve info is in my original post :)
1.7 & 1.4 from a Ford 260/289 with smaller stems. The runner into the port will be gasket matched but only in the direction of airflow. Both will be smoothed, but not highly finished to yield a high air velocity while keeping things in suspense. Intake seat will be radius back, and the ball will get a hog cut, a basic street port. Hoping to fit a set of canonical or beehive springs. The 346 calls for 300 foot pounds, but if I go with either tapered setup, I can probably come in around 280. Just a little extra info to exercise your noggin. Thank you so much for your input!

Well I reckon I'm just blind. lol So you do you plan on blending the bowls? That's good. That's where the biggest benefits really are. Like I said, the more gear you can stand, the better it'll run!
 
For those using the Oregon Cam Grinders #346...
1. Are you happy with it?
2. What other engine mods have you done?
3. What RPM do you feel the power (street, not racing or WOT)
4. What's your stall RPM?

Here's my baseline: a long-rod engine using factory 198 rods, Wiseco PTS536A45 pistons, 1.70&1.45-inch valves, 9.5 compression, OCG cam #346 (see spec sheet two posts below), Elgin double-roller timing set, 8.25 rear with 3:21 gears, 24" height tires (215/60R14 X4), induction is a Holley 390 vac-secondary 4bbl through an Offy intake - optimized for velocity, power should be in the range of 210-230HP&TQ, '68 Barracuda that tips in around 2,900 lbs., 904 tranny with TransGo TF1 kit, rebuild will follow Tom Hand's as outlined in his book - pg.204 (overview>> DISKS: BorgWarner[BW] or Raybestos[Ray]- smooth rear, waffle grooves front, FT CLUTCH CLEARANCE: .015-.020 per-fiction-disk, KICKDOWN LEVER: 3.8, KICKDOWN BAND: cast - wider if avail with BW or Ray std linings, OVERRUNNING CLUTCH: stock, LOW-REVERSE BAND: stock, REAR CLUTCH CLEARANCE: .030-.050", SERVOS: front/stock rear/billet, STEELS: stock-type, LUBE: synthetic). The pistons, lifters, valves, and spring assemblies are all lighter than stock. Valve spring pressure is in the range of 280-300#. (all theoretical, somewhat). Most of my driving is twisty and hilly back roads at about 40 to 50 mph The other 40% of my travels are highway 65-70.
So, what should my stall be?
My engine is at the machine shop, just doing my due-diligence, so I'm ready in the spring time.


PM me, I got my simulation back up and running and I can show you what those cams look like in comparison to others. The long duration is going to really roll off the torque in the normal driving range that seems like you are taking about.

example.
Slant six builders...Lets talk Cams

Which is interesting that the 817 cam is almost what Doug and I came up with... I wanted a bit more exhaust duration which helped a little with the higher RPM but other than that I am intrigued by that one... The 2016 I have has a lift in the 0.441 range and that is still even to much for the /6 heads (including adding the larger valves) based on the flow numbers Doug had that I use in the model. The benefits of lift for a stock NA head maxed out around 0.420"-0.430" or so. Unfortunately it looks like the ramp profiles they use may keep the lift down below 0.400" for that duration... Doug was researching the ramp profile to use when the fires occurred last year.
 
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FYI my 225 is similar, decked block for about 8.8:1; larger valves; Dutra Duals; dual single barrel Offy intake; OGC 2106; It pulls like a tractor and dies off above 4000RPM which is fine because I never come close to 4000 RPM 99.999% of the time.
 
Seems like alot of people like that#2106.;
I see alot of guys talking about that one.
Hey can I get a favor? A cam sim on oregon's #819
CR will be high 8s, (9.0 max) hogged out stock slant exhaust manifold, super 6 setup,ported head, either SI oversized valves or 318 valves, in a truck with a 727 and 3.21's, 235/75 15 rubber.
That's the combo that I am working on. Oh yeah, (don't know if it will ask but I'll tell anyway) fresh build with 0.020" over.stock style silvolite pistons
 
Also like @RustyRatRod said 210HP out of the /6 is not easy. You saw in my models these class cams that I am talking about are in the 125HP range but the torque is up there. To push that 200HP boundary you need air flow and a cam that breaths at high RPM. With the bigger valves you maybe able to get there but look at those graphs. If you extend the RPM range and get those big HP number look how fast the low end torque comes down when you do that. You need to choose do you what HP at 5500 RPM or Torque at 2500 RPM. You can't really have both (you can but it becomes a "there is no replacement for displacement" argument).
 
Seems like alot of people like that#2106.;
I see alot of guys talking about that one.
Hey can I get a favor? A cam sim on oregon's #819
CR will be high 8s, (9.0 max) hogged out stock slant exhaust manifold, super 6 setup,ported head, either SI oversized valves or 318 valves, in a truck with a 727 and 3.21's, 235/75 15 rubber.
That's the combo that I am working on. Oh yeah, (don't know if it will ask but I'll tell anyway) fresh build with 0.020" over.stock style silvolite pistons

PM me so I remember :)
 
Also like @RustyRatRod said 210HP out of the /6 is not easy. You saw in my models these class cams that I am talking about are in the 125HP range but the torque is up there. To push that 200HP boundary you need air flow and a cam that breaths at high RPM. With the bigger valves you maybe able to get there but look at those graphs. If you extend the RPM range and get those big HP number look how fast the low end torque comes down when you do that. You need to choose do you what HP at 5500 RPM or Torque at 2500 RPM. You can't really have both (you can but it becomes a "there is no replacement for displacement" argument).
This engine will never see 5500 rpm, I doubt it'll see 4000 very often or for very long if it did
 
Also like @RustyRatRod said 210HP out of the /6 is not easy. You saw in my models these class cams that I am talking about are in the 125HP range but the torque is up there. To push that 200HP boundary you need air flow and a cam that breaths at high RPM. With the bigger valves you maybe able to get there but look at those graphs. If you extend the RPM range and get those big HP number look how fast the low end torque comes down when you do that. You need to choose do you what HP at 5500 RPM or Torque at 2500 RPM. You can't really have both (you can but it becomes a "there is no replacement for displacement" argument).

Exactly! People get too caught up in horse power. With the 4.125" stroke, the 225's shining spot is the torque is was made to produce. If you concentrate on that, everything else will fall in place.
 
PM me so I remember :)

Also I can give you what I think it will be about (ran so many experiments I can see dyno curves in my head when I look at specs for the 225)....

The 110 LCA will push the power band out in RPM and the 220 degree duration is a good mid RPM power band number. Torque will be way down in the 2500RPM range but it will likely make 175 HP and good torque around 4000RPM and hang in there for a good while past there. I can run it tonight.. only take a few minutes
 
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