360-1 Indy intake

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pittsburghracer

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Well it’s starting to shape up and flows over 300 cfm on my Edelbrock heads. Not totally satisfied yet so back on the porting bench for a little more work.
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Looking good John, enjoy being able to see your work and the thoughts behind it!
 
Was this intake tested on the head you are moving the pushrod over with offset rocker arms?


Yes it is. Overall I’m totally disappointed in the heads performance for the work involved. I love my local machine shop and they have been great to me over the years but they really dropped the ball on this one and it makes me sick to even looking at these heads. Don’t ask my why but when I dropped a brand new set of heads off to be opened up and do a valve job for 2.08 valves they did a radius on the valve job. That is like one of the biggest no no’s you can do on the intake side. I redid it by hand but I can only correct it so much. They honestly need new seats and redone but I’m not forcing the issue and I’m not spending the money to correct this right now. I’ll take another look at them today or tomorrow to see if I can remove more of the radius. The heads max out now at 322cfm so for the work involved like I said I’m disappointed. Not bad for a head that started out in the 240’s but it a road I’ll never travel again. If I buy my buddies valve seat machine and spend 1000.00 for upgrades they may get new seats but they will be going on my engine soon for the 2021 race season.
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Excuse my ignorance but what is a radius on the valve job consist of? Is that the farthest exterior cut that seems to go on the outer edge of the seat and I assume goes around the outside of the valve head itself
 
Excuse my ignorance but what is a radius on the valve job consist of? Is that the farthest exterior cut that seems to go on the outer edge of the seat and I assume goes around the outside of the valve head itself


Airflow likes sharp angles on the intake side of approximately 15 degrees. Example 70-60-45-30-15 not shaped rounded like let’s say an orange. On a radius cut the 45 degree seat cut is the only one with a sharp angle and it’s even hard to see.
 
I'm assuming that a poor valve job would affect low lift flow the most. What have you found to be the difference between a good valve job and a bad one?
 
I'm assuming that a poor valve job would affect low lift flow the most. What have you found to be the difference between a good valve job and a bad one?


Low lift numbers and the port is jumpier from one lift to the next. The dog gone set of Speedmaster heads that I did for my son flow better at .300 than these heads do. They struggled to hit my required 200cfm by .300 lift.
 
Wow, I can see that once you explained the seat angles. That definitely hurts the wallet.

ya they only charge me 8.00-10.00 per seat to open for larger valves and do a valve job on the 8 intakes if I have them stripped and cleaned ready to go. Valves jobs I can do but with lack of proper tooling it’s hard for me to go from 2.02 valves to 2.08 valves. I have no idea what it would cost me to have new seats in and start over but I’m not spending the money to do that. I used a three angle Neyway cutter to try to cut some angles and it didn’t change much so I’m going to sink the valve some and use my individual 60-45-30-15 Neyway cutters and see what that does.
 
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Could you go to a 2.10 valve to get a better seat location?


Nope not spending another 175.00 at this point. These heads are so space limited anything over a 2.05 valve is pissing in the wind for the small valve upsizing results. I’m already probably hurting my flow numbers using a 4.015 sized head adapter on my flowbench. And I’m not wasting the money to upgrade that. Lol. This engine should still run low 6’s in the 1/8 and 9.50’s-9.60’s in the 1/4.
 
Yes it is. Overall I’m totally disappointed in the heads performance for the work involved. I love my local machine shop and they have been great to me over the years but they really dropped the ball on this one and it makes me sick to even looking at these heads. Don’t ask my why but when I dropped a brand new set of heads off to be opened up and do a valve job for 2.08 valves they did a radius on the valve job. That is like one of the biggest no no’s you can do on the intake side. I redid it by hand but I can only correct it so much. They honestly need new seats and redone but I’m not forcing the issue and I’m not spending the money to correct this right now. I’ll take another look at them today or tomorrow to see if I can remove more of the radius. The heads max out now at 322cfm so for the work involved like I said I’m disappointed. Not bad for a head that started out in the 240’s but it a road I’ll never travel again. If I buy my buddies valve seat machine and spend 1000.00 for upgrades they may get new seats but they will be going on my engine soon for the 2021 race season. View attachment 1715716985View attachment 1715716986


I would use a 50 degree seat to get rid of the radius. But that’s just me. And yes, NEVER a radius on the intake seat. Ever.
 
I would use a 50 degree seat to get rid of the radius. But that’s just me. And yes, NEVER a radius on the intake seat. Ever.


Again I don’t have access to 50 degree cutters and I’m not using stones as my stone holder and grinder are about shot.
 
My unsolicited.02 is.......

By the looks of it, there is essentially no top cut with the current seat profile.
There is plenty of meat left to be able to cut a multi angle seat onto the seat ring.

Would that flow more?
Only one way to know for sure.

What I’m seeing is the thin shiny line is the top angle(maybe about .015-.020 wide) and the dark area outside of that is the untouched top of the seat ring, which is 0 degrees.

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My unsolicited.02 is.......

By the looks of it, there is essentially no top cut with the current seat profile.
There is plenty of meat left to be able to cut a multi angle seat onto the seat ring.

Would that flow more?
Only one way to know for sure.

What I’m seeing is the thin shiny line is the top angle(maybe about .015-.020 wide) and dark area outside of that is the untouched top of the seat ring, which is 0 degrees.

View attachment 1715717026

I think that picture was before I hit it with my three angle cutter and 15 degree top cut but the 3D cutter didn’t do much. Like I said I have individual cutters that let me set the angles a little deeper so after some running today I may try that later. Everything is still mounted on my flowbench so I may play a little more. I widened the short side about as much as humanly possible on these heads leaving the height almost untouched. Airspeed is in the 400fps area so if I lay it down some I can do a little more reshaping.
 
I’m just saying, as it was in the pic, there was plenty left to recut and end up with 75/60/45......along with ending up with a “proper” top cut(30 or 35) that had a little length to it.

On this one, the top cut uses up the full diameter of the seat ring....... although you don’t always end up with it like that.

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Grocery shopping, bill paying, and my sister had some heart issues in Florida and had two stents put in today so not much shop time. I took out my three angle cutter and put in a deeper 60, cut a nice 45 and 30 and topped it off with a nice wide 15. Hard to get nice pictures of valve jobs when you go past 3 angles but now with the radius it actually looks like a 75,70,60,45,30,15. Crazy snow in Pa today and a cold azz wind so I didn’t take my river walk today. Went almost 1.5 miles yesterday so that’s pretty good after the effects of coronavirus.
 
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These new lightweight valves should let me really rev up this engine. The flow numbers are spectacular
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Nice heads PB-racer!

I thought I read somewhere that the RADIUSED seats are BEST for flow, but BAD for fuel Vaporisation?

Swings and roundabouts but still, anything in the 300cfm's is COOLIO!!!:):(

Seen those valves before with TINY trapdoors on the lower edge!
Lets stuff through and not back again...:thankyou:
 
I kinda had a target of 330 after hitting 318 on my previous best set without moving the pushrod. Without have a mill it’s a road I will never travel again
 
They always say ''its not all about FLOW''?

Who are these peeps lol...
318 to 330 is fine but I think 340 sounds much better.

Me I'm going for 360 with my Brodix heads lol...:poke:
 
Sick kitty cat kept me out of the shop today. I lucked out and the Vet got me in at 12:30 today. Bloodwork, X-rays, injections, two prescriptions and 455.00 later we were on our way home. He’s been sleeping all day so I hope he beats whatever got him down.
 
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