led dome lights

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Matthew Sermini

Matthew Sermini

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hey everyone so i tried looking this up but was unable to come up with anything. so my dome light currently works great but i was hoping to get something a little bit brighter. so i then got an led bulb. when i plug it in it wont turn off, even with the doors shut unlike with the normal bulb. is it possible i need a different bulb, or is this a common issue? its not. big deal if there is no simple solution, I just was to find some ways to ease the strain on my unaltered wiring harness throughout my 76 duster. thanks.
 
What is the "equivalent lamp" number on the LED? It should have TWO "hot" contacts on the bottom, and no connection to the shell. Are you sure you have the headlight switch turned "some to the right" to shut off the dome?

I don't know what a 76 Duster uses I have no manual for that. The "older" cars used a 1004 lamp Looks like this

1004_logo__14157.1379456463.jpg
 
As 67dart said... Also remember that LEDs don’t have the power draw that old school bulbs do, so some times you’ll run into problems when converting a system over. Just ran into this issue working on a friends 66 Cheb 2...
 
Scody21 said:
As 67dart said... Also remember that LEDs don’t have the power draw that old school bulbs do, so some times you’ll run into problems when converting a system over. Just ran into this issue working on a friends 66 Cheb 2...
Click to expand...

thats why i was hoping to switch to LEDs in the dome light and headlights eventually. honestly if it causes issues or is too difficult i will probably just leave it alone. I am just hoping to find a few easy ways to help out the electrical system in my car. honestly it might be that i just bought the wrong led bulb and need to switch to something else.
 
Matthew Sermini said:
it uses the 1004 lamp. the bulb i bought is here:

https://www.bulbconnection.com/prod...YLVANIA-7528-White-LED-Bulb--Contains-2-Bulbs
Click to expand...
If this is the bulb you bought, it's the wrong one. You need 2 contacts on the bottom, and the pins on the sides of the socket need to be even. The bulb you bought shows the pins to be off-set. The package you show says it is 1156 compatible but that makes no sense.....It looks like it would be 1157 compatible (2 filament, off set tabs used in brake/taillight systems).
 
The '76 wiriing system is not like the earlier ones. Current paths are divided up on the engine side of the firewall. So if your car is stock - no electric pumps or fans, no electric winches or anything like that, the only issues may be those related to aging. Those will depend on environment.
Offhand, I don't know if the headlight wiring was beefed up from the years which used 16 and 18 gage. Regardless its a long path and that circuit that can be improved with a relay system.

One thing to be aware of with LED lamps. Often they have a more concentrated pool of light. With something like a dome light, where its desireable to diffuse the light over a wide area, it may or may not do what you want. May have to try a few to decide. One with the correct design to work with the reflector and diffuser.

How the dome lights work:
Power is connected to the socket at all times.
The return side consists of multiple wires. Each one is connected to a switch to chassis ground. Closing any one of those switches completes the circuit.

So if your LED is in any way touching ground, it will not turn off.
 
67Dart273 said:
What is the "equivalent lamp" number on the LED? It should have TWO "hot" contacts on the bottom, and no connection to the shell. Are you sure you have the headlight switch turned "some to the right" to shut off the dome?

I don't know what a 76 Duster uses I have no manual for that. The "older" cars used a 1004 lamp Looks like this

1004_logo__14157.1379456463.jpg
Click to expand...
2X AUXITO 1157 Amber yellow LED Turn Signal Parking Light Bulb Error Free EOA | eBay
4x 6000K Super White 1157 BAY15D 50-SMD LED Tail Stop Brake Light Bulbs 7528 12V 645312087952 | eBay
 
it
CFD244 said:
If this is the bulb you bought, it's the wrong one. You need 2 contacts on the bottom, and the pins on the sides of the socket need to be even. The bulb you bought shows the pins to be off-set. The package you show says it is 1156 compatible but that makes no sense.....It looks like it would be 1157 compatible (2 filament, off set tabs used in brake/taillight systems).
Click to expand...
it looks identical to the 1004. the contacts on the bottom are just bigger. it fits in the dome light fine, it just constantly stays on unlike the regular 1004 bulb.
 
Mattax said:
The '76 wiriing system is not like the earlier ones. Current paths are divided up on the engine side of the firewall. So if your car is stock - no electric pumps or fans, no electric winches or anything like that, the only issues may be those related to aging. Those will depend on environment.
Offhand, I don't know if the headlight wiring was beefed up from the years which used 16 and 18 gage. Regardless its a long path and that circuit that can be improved with a relay system.

One thing to be aware of with LED lamps. Often they have a more concentrated pool of light. With something like a dome light, where its desireable to diffuse the light over a wide area, it may or may not do what you want. May have to try a few to decide. One with the correct design to work with the reflector and diffuser.

How the dome lights work:
Power is connected to the socket at all times.
The return side consists of multiple wires. Each one is connected to a switch to chassis ground. Closing any one of those switches completes the circuit.

So if your LED is in any way touching ground, it will not turn off.
Click to expand...
everything is all stock and untouched. i did a v8 swap, but all of the wiring is all the same. the only changes i made was adding a tachometer and oil pressure gauge. i appreciate the info, i will definitely take a look, and the beauty of also having a 75 duster is i can compare the two headlight wiring systems. i'll write my findings.
 
Matthew Sermini said:
everything is all stock and untouched. i did a v8 swap, but all of the wiring is all the same. the only changes i made was adding a tachometer and oil pressure gauge. i appreciate the info, i will definitely take a look, and the beauty of also having a 75 duster is i can compare the two headlight wiring systems. i'll write my findings.
Click to expand...
I suspect the only difference in headlight wiring may be an increase in the wire sizes to the headlights.
Even though Chrysler adopted the higher draw 6014 headlamps around 1973, for whatever reasons, the A-bodies continued along with 18 ga wires from hi/lo switch to the lamps. (The headlight circuit breaker is 15 amp). I'd like to think at some point this was finally changed but I dont think it was. When new, and for the first 5 or 6 years they were adequate. I had a '75 we bought used. It was a dark night on the interstate coming home from school when the headlights blinked out. That was around 1985.

Re: 1976 Main circuits.
This is a work in progress. Its based on the factroy wiring diagram and photos people have posted. Unfortunately the people who are posted had damaged harnesses and/or gave up. That makes it difficult to verify. For example it would be helpfu lto know if the main junctions are splices or at terminals. (In the illustration they are shown as splices but that may not be correct)

I beleive the shunt is just a known length of certain diameter wire.

upload_2021-4-7_11-16-2.png
 
Mattax said:
I suspect the only difference in headlight wiring may be an increase in the wire sizes to the headlights.
Even though Chrysler adopted the higher draw 6014 headlamps around 1973, for whatever reasons, the A-bodies continued along with 18 ga wires from hi/lo switch to the lamps. (The headlight circuit breaker is 15 amp). I'd like to think at some point this was finally changed but I dont think it was. When new, and for the first 5 or 6 years they were adequate. I had a '75 we bought used. It was a dark night on the interstate coming home from school when the headlights blinked out. That was around 1985.

Re: 1976 Main circuits.
This is a work in progress. Its based on the factroy wiring diagram and photos people have posted. Unfortunately the people who are posted had damaged harnesses and/or gave up. That makes it difficult to verify. For example it would be helpfu lto know if the main junctions are splices or at terminals. (In the illustration they are shown as splices but that may not be correct)

I beleive the shunt is just a known length of certain diameter wire.

View attachment 1715719748
Click to expand...
now i know these pictures are supposed to be simple, i just don't understand them though lol. I can send some photos of my engine bay if this helps the situation at all.
 
Matthew Sermini said:
it

it looks identical to the 1004. the contacts on the bottom are just bigger. it fits in the dome light fine, it just constantly stays on unlike the regular 1004 bulb.
Click to expand...
B-6 Bulb with single filament and two contacts.
Wagner Lighting catalog 2008.
upload_2021-4-7_11-32-13.png


upload_2021-4-7_11-35-35.png
upload_2021-4-7_11-43-23.png


was there a suggestion to use an 1157? Surely that can't be right.
That's an S-8 dual filament bulb with an indexed base
upload_2021-4-7_11-40-26.png

upload_2021-4-7_11-37-59.png
upload_2021-4-7_11-42-51.png
 
Mattax said:
B-6 Bulb with single filament and two contacts.
Wagner Lighting catalog 2008.
View attachment 1715719753

View attachment 1715719755 View attachment 1715719759

was there a suggestion to use an 1157? Surely that can't be right.
That's an S-8 dual filament bulb with an indexed base
View attachment 1715719757
View attachment 1715719756 View attachment 1715719758
Click to expand...
not at all. i went to the autoparts store and bought it because it was cheap and looks identical pretty much identical to the regular 1004.

337B6E9B-651E-44BF-9526-8AAB6A0A8613.jpeg
 
Matthew Sermini said:
now i know these pictures are supposed to be simple, i just don't understand them though lol. I can send some photos of my engine bay if this helps the situation at all.
Click to expand...
:lol:

It's only simple compared to the full wiring diagram!

In this diagram we're only looking at the main circuits plus the alternator regulator and some of the ignition.
We can remove the regulator and ignition wires.

To understand what is going on, when current is flowing to more than one location it can divide like a river that branches.

upload_2021-4-7_11-56-11.png



Lets start simple.
Key off, turn on the hazzards.
Current will flow from the battery positive using the pink wire A3.
upload_2021-4-7_11-59-14.png


Next; Engine Running.
Alternator able to provide power at 14 Volts.
Current flows from alternator to key switch through wire J1
upload_2021-4-7_12-7-26.png



If the battery needed charging, the alternator would provide additional current if it can.
That additional current splits off at the junction where the three fusible links meet.
upload_2021-4-7_12-17-12.png

Remote shunt ammeters only require a tiny tiny amount of current. So small I didn't even show it.
You could remove the ammeter and functionally nothing would change.

Hope that helps explain it.
The big advantage of the '76 design is when the battery is charging, the headlights and wipers are on, etc, the current gets divided before the bulkhead connector. The current for the battery recharging doesn't even go through the firewall in this design.
The disadvantage is a slightly more complex system and 4 fusible links.
 
Mattax said:
:lol:

It's only simple compared to the full wiring diagram!

In this diagram we're only looking at the main circuits plus the alternator regulator and some of the ignition.
We can remove the regulator and ignition wires.

To understand what is going on, when current is flowing to more than one location it can divide like a river that branches.

View attachment 1715719761


Lets start simple.
Key off, turn on the hazzards.
Current will flow from the battery positive using the pink wire A3.
View attachment 1715719762

Next; Engine Running.
Alternator able to provide power at 14 Volts.
Current flows from alternator to key switch through wire J1
View attachment 1715719765


If the battery needed charging, the alternator would provide additional current if it can.
That additional current splits off at the junction where the three fusible links meet.
View attachment 1715719766
Remote shunt ammeters only require a tiny tiny amount of current. So small I didn't even show it.
You could remove the ammeter and functionally nothing would change.

Hope that helps explain it.
The big advantage of the '76 design is when the battery is charging, the headlights and wipers are on, etc, the current gets divided before the bulkhead connector. The current for the battery recharging doesn't even go through the firewall in this design.
The disadvantage is a slightly more complex system and 4 fusible links.
Click to expand...

so with this design in 76, is there as much strain on the headlights when in use as in previous years? i was thinking about using the crackedback headlight relay kit, but if it is not necessary, i could just convert to LED headlights using an adapter instead which would draw less electricity through this part of the system.
 
Mattax said:
B-6 Bulb with single filament and two contacts.
Wagner Lighting catalog 2008.
View attachment 1715719753

View attachment 1715719755 View attachment 1715719759

was there a suggestion to use an 1157? Surely that can't be right.
That's an S-8 dual filament bulb with an indexed base
View attachment 1715719757
View attachment 1715719756 View attachment 1715719758
Click to expand...
so i was unable to find an led version of the 1004 at my local auto parts store, but i did find the 1157 leds which are the turn signals. i but them in and they dont turn on until the lights are on. but then they dont blink and stay fully lit. i've heard this can be a common problem but is there a solution?
 
Matthew Sermini said:
so i was unable to find an led version of the 1004 at my local auto parts store, but i did find the 1157 leds which are the turn signals. i but them in and they dont turn on until the lights are on. but then they dont blink and stay fully lit. i've heard this can be a common problem but is there a solution?
Click to expand...

You need an electronic flasher unit compatible with LED lights.
LED’s don’t have enough current draw to make the old style flasher work.
Also in your quest for lowering draw with LED lighting you will run across devices to cause a higher load and make a flasher unit work.
DO NOT USE THESE, as they cause more load and ruin the whole point of using LED’s

Just so you know, my entire car is LED lit except for the headlights.
Those are on relays with 10ga wiring and GE Nighthawk bulbs.
(Night and day difference)

Remember when you use a relay kit for your headlights, not only will you take that load off your cabin wiring, but off your headlight and dimmer switches.
 
Last edited:
so then where did you place these
TrailBeast said:
You need an electronic flasher unit compatible with LED lights.
LED’s don’t have enough current draw to make the old style flasher work.
Also in your quest for lowering draw with LED lighting you will run across devices to cause a higher load and make a flasher unit work.
DO NOT USE THESE, as they cause more load and ruin the whole point of using LED’s

Just so you know, my entire car is LED lit except for the headlights.
Those are on relays with 10ga wiring and GE Nighthawk bulbs.
(Night and day difference)

Remember when you use a relay kit for your headlights, not only will you take that load off your cabin wiring, but off your headlight and dimmer switches.
Click to expand...

flashers for your car? was it just one for the front then another for the back, or are there like 4 of them one for each corner if that makes sense. also, did you have to do anything extra with the side markers? also the bulbs i bought today are grote 1157 "bulb out" resistant. i can send a pic, i'm not sure if they cause higher load or not.
 
One flasher unit covers all four, but a different flasher is used for the four way emergency lights, so you probably need 2.
On my car (73 Swinger) the signal flasher is just to left of the glove box door, and the E flasher is behind the cluster on the left of the steering column.
Probably round silver canisters on yours.
The electronic flashers work with incandescent lights also, but the main difference they make with incandescent lights is that they don’t flash slower at idle.

Side markers are gone and replaced with reflectors (no lights)
Dash cluster (speedometer)is done with strip light LED’s, and single gauges are done with one LED each.
Brake, turn, tail and emergency flashers are all a replaceable LED panels.
You can see the orange front parking and signals, and red park, signals, brake these pictures.

The centers of all 6 lenses are trimmed out and replaced with smoked Lexan except the backup lights.
Those are done with white privacy film like window tint.

1D4C329B-68C6-4B71-929E-842BDE28C5F0.png


FF4C27B5-F880-4B90-BC45-1FC4CC77F6DB.png
 
TrailBeast said:
One flasher unit covers all four, but a different flasher is used for the four way emergency lights, so you probably need 2.
On my car (73 Swinger) the signal flasher is just to left of the glove box door, and the E flasher is behind the cluster on the left of the steering column.
Probably round silver canisters on yours.
The electronic flashers work with incandescent lights also, but the main difference they make with incandescent lights is that they don’t flash slower at idle.

Side markers are gone and replaced with reflectors (no lights)
Dash cluster (speedometer)is done with strip light LED’s, and single gauges are done with one LED each.
Brake, turn, tail and emergency flashers are all a replaceable LED panels.
You can see the orange front parking and signals, and red park, signals, brake these pictures.

The centers of all 6 lenses are trimmed out and replaced with smoked Lexan except the backup lights.
Those are done with white privacy film like window tint.

View attachment 1715719976

View attachment 1715719977
Click to expand...

awesome swinger it looks gorgeous! With my car, i was thinking about just replacing the headlights, and all running lights/ backups and brakes with LEDs. when you installed the two flasher units, did you put them in place of the signal flasher and e flasher, or what did you do?
 
Matthew Sermini said:
awesome swinger it looks gorgeous! With my car, i was thinking about just replacing the headlights, and all running lights/ backups and brakes with LEDs. when you installed the two flasher units, did you put them in place of the signal flasher and e flasher, or what did you do?
Click to expand...

Yes, the electronic flasher plugs in as a direct fit replacement.
Just so you know, I basically started where you are now.
I bought, built and tried everything from bulbs that just install in place of the originals to light strips.
So far the light strips work best for the interior stuff like dash,overhead light and trunk light.
Prebuilt water proof panels worked best for the outside.

I like unique things here and there and also like contrasting colors, so I built mine with a bit more modern look to them with the smoked lexan.

Those LED panels are only 1/2 thick, so with a slight mod to the factory lens housings they fit behind stock lenses as well.
I wired them into a regular 1157 socket so the can be unplugged just like taking a bulb out.

Thanks for the compliment.
 
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