'65 904 Torqueflite: No Start in "N", no forward or reverse.

The '65 Formula S had a transmission "rebuild" here in Mexico during the recent body restoration. After re-installing the engine/transmission, the vehicle sat for a few months. I could roll it in and out of the garage by placing the console shifter in "N" (neutral). When I installed the transmission, I pre-filled the torque convertor with one quart of Quaker State AFT 3.

More recently, I charged the battery. Then I filled the crankcase with oil (5 quarts) and added 7 more quarts of ATF. I noticed after having added the ATF, the vehicle would not move anymore in neutral. I went through all the gears a few times and after rocking the vehicle a little, it finally rolled. Weird.

I fired up the motor (without coolant) and let it run about 5 minutes. At first, I tried to start the motor in neutral, but the starter would not engage while the cable operated floor shift was in "N" (just nothing-like a dead battery). When I selected "P" (park) the starter motor and ignition switch worked fine.

The next day or so, I fired up the motor again and put the transmission in both reverse and forward gears. I felt no indication of any gears engaging, and neither would the vehicle move in any direction under its own power. And again, the starter will not crank when selecting "N".

Today I checked the terminal on the solenoid that serves as the neutral safety switch. With the ignition "off" or in the "run/on" position, no power. When the key is turned to "start", we have power.

The first questions I have are: Why won't the starter motor crank with gearshift in neutral? Why won't the vehicle move in "reverse" or "drive" or "2" or "1"? Thank you.

Photo is before restoration.

bypass neutral safety switch. I bet the comb is not hooked to the push/pull cable properly. There is an adjustment procedure built into that cable trans at the enterance. hit the start circuit and hold it while moving the shifter slowly and see if it catches.
Mopar Push-button transmission tech tips

"GEAR SELECTOR CABLE ADJUSTMENT

The gear selector cable is attached to the selector lever in much the same manner as with a push button box, with a cable eye over a pin, secured by a flat washer and spring clip.

The removal and installation procedures for the gear selector cable at the transmission are the same as those followed with push button cables, but the adjustment procedure is different. To make this adjustment, proceed as follows:
1. Have an assistant hold the selector lever firmly in the "1" (Low) position.
2. Hold the control cable centered in its bore in the transmission case, and pull outward on the cable with about two pounds of force to bottom the manual lever in the "Low" detent.
3. While maintaining this pull on the cable, rotate the adjustment wheel clockwise until it just contacts the case squarely. 4. Turn the wheel counterclockwise just enough to make the nearest hole in the wheel line up with the screw hole in the case.
5. Counting this hole as number one, continue turning the wheel counterclockwise until the fifth hole lines up with the screw hole in the case.
6. Push the cable in toward the transmission until the adjustment wheel is tight against the case and install the lock screw, tightening to 75 inch-pounds torque."

You ran it for 5 min without any coolant ? Why ? The combustion chambers get real hot real quick without coolant. I hope you didn't hurt the motor, but it probably did.

If there is only 7-8 quarts of trans fluid it's probably not enough that's why it wont move.
The push button trans have a rear pump and when you are pushing it you are turning the pump and probably making pressure that will make it hard to push. Is there fluid on the dipstick.

The trans dipstick shows overfilled with the motor not running.

I ran a continuity test at the neutral safety switch at the transmission. I first disconnected the wire at the solenoid.

I searched for the "beep" sound with my multimeter and found touching the safety switch at the transmission with one lead and grounding the other lead:
In park: Beep
In neutral: No Beep
This is assuming I performed the procedure correctly (kind of hard and uncomfortable without having jacked up the vehicle first).

Get it HOT and check ATF fluid in Neutral for one thing.
All trans that run off a cable, hate my guts!!! that being those PB jobs!

Performed some more continuity testing this AM and made some progress. I found "N" is found when the gear shift is moved slightly rearward while in reverse. In that spot the tester "beeped" and when I turned the ignition key, the starter motor engaged. So without a doubt the shift cable needs adjustment. The detent on the gear shift and the detent inside the transmission must be at odds with one another.

Trying to think this thing through in my mind, I am thinking the cable pull must be lengthened to allow the gear shift to move a little more back and drop into the proper "N" slot (and all the other slots should follow suit if that slot is corrected).

Update: Raised the four wheels off the ground and installed jack stands for easier access. I did not have a "helper" to hold the gear shift in "low" per the cable adjustment instructions, so I decided to use my previous continuity tester procedure.

After marking with white paint the position of the wheel that adjusts the shift cable at the transmission, I removed the 7/16" headed bolt. I spun the little wheel one full turn clockwise and checked neutral position of the shifter. The neutral safety switch was in the same position as before which was too close to reverse.

I removed the bolt again, spun the wheel back counter clockwise to where it was and then an additional turn counter clockwise. The switch was still off, but a little closer. After having spun the wheel 2 or 3 times more counter clockwise, it appeared that we could start the vehicle now in both park and neutral positions. I replaced the bolt.

I started and ran the motor for just a minute in neutral (still needs more coolant added) and checked the AT dipstick which still reads over-filled like before (of course, this is a cold check). I quickly tried the gear shift in both reverse and drive and saw the driver's side rear wheel spin. Then I shut down the engine.

The big bolt (1 3/16th inch head) that secures the 90 degree oil filter adapter is still dripping oil. To replace the little gasket and remove/tighten the bolt, I will need to remove the TTI 2 1/2" head pipe on the passenger side later today or tomorrow.

"Then I filled the crankcase with oil (5 quarts) and added 7 more quarts of ATF." I'm confused. But if your trans is running in neutral and it's overfilled (by how much; kinda important) then your trans was assembled incorrectly.

dibbons said:

Update: Raised the four wheels off the ground and installed jack stands for easier access. I did not have a "helper" to hold the gear shift in "low" per the cable adjustment instructions, so I decided to use my previous continuity tester procedure.

After marking with white paint the position of the wheel that adjusts the shift cable at the transmission, I removed the 7/16" headed bolt. I spun the little wheel one full turn clockwise and checked neutral position of the shifter. The neutral safety switch was in the same position as before which was too close to reverse.

I removed the bolt again, spun the wheel back counter clockwise to where it was and then an additional turn counter clockwise. The switch was still off, but a little closer. After having spun the wheel 2 or 3 times more counter clockwise, it appeared that we could start the vehicle now in both park and neutral positions. I replaced the bolt.

I started and ran the motor for just a minute in neutral (still needs more coolant added) and checked the AT dipstick which still reads over-filled like before (of course, this is a cold check). I quickly tried the gear shift in both reverse and drive and saw the driver's side rear wheel spin. Then I shut down the engine.

The big bolt (1 3/16th inch head) that secures the 90 degree oil filter adapter is still dripping oil. To replace the little gasket and remove/tighten the bolt, I will need to remove the TTI 2 1/2" head pipe on the passenger side later today or tomorrow.

Click to expand...

Are you wiping off the dipstick every time and rechecking it with a clean dipstick?

Yes. Added another quart ATF and now we have movement back and forth, to and fro.

dibbons said:

The trans dipstick shows overfilled with the motor not running.

Click to expand...

it always will. The converter drains back and the level is over the pan gasket when its parked, so if you get a leak when its parked you know its the gasket or the dipstick O-ring.

Your convertor will fill in N but not necessarily in P. Start it, and put it in N, allow it to idle for a few minutes, Then run it through the gears a few seconds in each gear. It should end up between C or H on the dipstick. I filled a C4 with 8 qts and 2 ran out the vent on top of the case. It was not started as recommended. Convertor never took any so it overflowed. The spool valve allows the convertor to fill. Hard to mess that up in a rebuild. Wont fill if the pump is not engaged.

A motor will still run with NO oil, but a trans needs every bit to operate. I see folks warming up their trans before topping it off, then wonder why the pump bushing spins and the converter gets burnt. I tell everybody; "If your motor is running, and you don't know for sure that it's at the full mark, SHUT IT OFF".