MOPAROFFICIAL
Oogliboogli
Unless you're talking 302 heads they suck
Disappointed with my engine
- Thread starter Retroboy
- Start date
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K.O. SWINGER
Meeting in the alley since 1976
I don't see what your fantasies have to do with any of this LOL
T56MaxTorq
Well-Known Member
Welcome to hot rodding! Track time and carb tuning, ignition timing changes, practice! After that blend in 2” valves into the heads, shave heads & increase compression to match pistons with dome quench, higher octane fuel, port and polish, convert to mechanical secondaries.
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harrisonm
Well-Known Member
I think it is 90% with your heads. With those internal parts, you should be well over 300HP.
Imagine this. Let's say you have a 500+HP 383. It runs great and you are happy with it. It has good Edelbrock heads that have been ported. So what would happen if you pulled those heads and put on the crappiest 383 heads there are; something out of a 383 2 barrel station wagon with small valves and crappy breathing. How do you think it would run? I could be wrong, but "crappy" small valve J heads are not helping.
Imagine this. Let's say you have a 500+HP 383. It runs great and you are happy with it. It has good Edelbrock heads that have been ported. So what would happen if you pulled those heads and put on the crappiest 383 heads there are; something out of a 383 2 barrel station wagon with small valves and crappy breathing. How do you think it would run? I could be wrong, but "crappy" small valve J heads are not helping.
Rat Bastid
Dunamis Metron
The OP was given plenty of reasons why his car is slow, and then he explained why we are all wrong. He’s on his own.
Small block Mopar heads were pretty much better than anything other manufacturers had at the time for stock passenger car heads. The fact is, they "ain't too bad".
Yes, I agree. It tires me so when people argue after asking for help. I have an "off" switch and am learning more and more how to use it.
MOPAROFFICIAL
Oogliboogli
Whenever you change valves or do any port work...you really should flow test the heads to see what you did, good or bad. If you did have numbers on these heads, and they were good, then you can easily move to something else in the tune or camshaft/induction area.
With a 1.94 intake valve in some j's or 974's blended/ported you can expect to see 260's cfm by .500- .550 with 225-230@.400 and 190-197@.300 etc... in other words.. they should perform well. If the heads are just simply cut for 1.94s...then they would be a hindrance. When you know what the heads do.. you'll know what the motor can do if right.
Retroboy
Well-Known Member
Well Mate it's called discussion, I listen to you and then I respond. I did ask for further info on your thinking about the vents becoming pressurized causing the fuel to be forced through the carb but no reply. If there had been I would have taken it on board especially considering ny past experience putting both together and replied. I don't think any one individual is right about everything.
Retroboy
Well-Known Member
Yes seat time is a big issue. My local track is now closed so it's a 5 hour trip each way to my closest track. Travelling up Friday, accomadation friday night, run Saturday, accommodation Saturday night, tow home Sunday, severely limits the number of times I can run each year.
Retroboy
Well-Known Member
Okay Mr Rusty RR what was your input?
Was it you that said Mopar heads were the pick of the bunch way back when ? Ha ha ha what a joke. Have you ever looked at a Ford Cleveland from 1971 - 86. I don't think you guys had 302 C in the US did you? Maybe you should have said that they have a higher exhaust port than a Chev which would have made them the pick of a bad bunch It was inferred by myself in my origional post the heads were the issue.
The other thing you suggested was overall car set up. I'm 64 mate and first went down a racetrack in a FED more than 40 years ago. I can promise you this, there is Zero, did you get that, Zero, similarity between a door car set-up and a 1400 lbs slingshot. None.
I welcome your and anybody else's input but keep it real.
Retroboy
Well-Known Member
Someone on here told me he had some W2's on the shelf a couple of years back, when I tried to follow up to buy 'em it all went quite.
Yep we had a lot of Boss 302 Mustangs made right here in Cleveland about 30 miles from me. Also boss 351 mustangs here is a picture of my friends that I did the motor on. This was about 25 years ago, Yes that is my AAR sitting next to it.
Retroboy
Well-Known Member
.018 hot. Yes I have tried to launch in 2nd gear when I had 31" tyre. No advantage
Rat Bastid
Dunamis Metron
First off, your headers are just junk. I don’t know how many times that needs to be repeated, but that’s all they are. If you have no grasp of how overlap works, and how in a wedge headed engine how hard it is to get, and get it right, then me explaining it won’t do you any good. You have killed ANY overlap you may have had with that header, and yes you need overlap. You can claim you’ve tried real headers and that they made nothing over a set of zoomies, but I’ve tested it many more times than you, and not once, not even once was a zoomie anywhere near a correctly sized, tuned header with a collector. Until you fix that, the rest of it doesn’t matter.
As for that little scoop, in dirty air (its way too low) you don’t have near enough volume over the carb. When there is essentially no plenum over the carb, the air speed goes up through the carb, the boosters pull too much fuel and you pressurize the vents/bowls and it blows even more fuel through the boosters.
That’s an explanation of two obvious things I see. There is no argument your headers are worthless. That’s just a fact, even if you fail to recognize it. Zoomie headers are for power adders (specifically a roots blower, maybe a Pro Charger) and sometimes they work with nitrous. Other than that they are wall hangers.
Retroboy
Well-Known Member
Like I said Mate it's called a discussion. I'm not talking fancy dyno results I'm talking real world outcomes and as I said there is zero similarity between a 14 or 1500 lb FED and your door car. The scoop isn't sealed so it doesn't offer anything or very little on the way of ram air.
You come across as a smart arse know it all incapable of discussion.
Rat Bastid
Dunamis Metron
No, you are incapable of a discussion. I didn’t just test headers on a dyno. It’s also done at the track. The issue is you are so consumed with the thought that your car is so different from any other car on here you can’t see the forest for the trees. I’ll say it again. You are killing all your power at just below peak torque all the way to peak power with your headers. It’s that simple. You may not like that, but that’s what it is. The physics that make your RED run and move don’t change from a door car. To continue on that path just reinforces your inherent biases and cause you to strain at a camel to swallow a gnat. There isn’t a NA engine I know of that benefits from a zoomie header. And if it is, it’s a hemi and I doubt that. You can’t kill the overlap cycle and make power, and the hemi head has by far the best overlap cycle out there. You don’t have a hemi, or a canted valve wedge. You have an inline wedge head which the has the worst overlap flow going. Again, your headers are killing power. The chassis they are in makes no difference. If you are swapping out the zoomies and not gaining power, it’s likely your cam timing is as funky as your thinking on headers, overlap flow and overall air flow through an engine. Cam timing and header design go hand in hand. As for the “ram” air effect, that’s not what I’m talking about. Did you even bother to consider what I said about volume above the carb? It matters. Unless the unsealed part of the scoop has the same area as the opening does, it will still pressurize the VENTS and cause the engine to go dead rich at speed. You can’t put pressure on the vents of a carb unless you are doing it for a reason, like a blow through application. If you want to have a reasonable discussion with me, you have to get off your preconceived (and ill conceived) notions that dyno’s are “fancy” and don’t relate to the unicorn you happen to ride. When you do that, we can have a proper discussion. Until then, continue on as you’ve been doing. Your success is magnificent.
joemish
Member
Way too much carb. I have a 670 on my 383 Road Runner. works great.
Martin Koiryohann
Well-Known Member
Martin Koiryohann
Well-Known Member
the cam part # have changed or been deleated but tye specs r still te same . this is from a old mopsr performance racing bok i have
Martin Koiryohann
Well-Known Member
part 3 now what compression r u useing ? & what heads
Martin Koiryohann
Well-Known Member
list of stock oem heads & casting numbers
Martin Koiryohann
Well-Known Member
that should help it sounds like what u have isent bsd . how fast do nu want tyo go?
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