ELECTRICAL QUESTION

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CFD244

CFD244

"I LOST MY ID IN A FLOOD"
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Hi Folks

What you are looking at is the bulb socket for my console lighting on a '71 Demon. What I find odd, is that the orange lead appears to be the ground lead, and the black lead is the power lead. To me, that would be wired in reverse polarity. Tracing the black lead, it is definitely body grounded, and the orange wire is a dim-able 12v feed. :wtf:

Thanks.

IMG_1982.JPG
 
Yeah orange "usually " is lighting. You're saying that the black is power? If I read right are you contradicting yourself??:poke:
CFD244 said:
Hi Folks

What you are looking at is the bulb socket for my console lighting on a '71 Demon. What I find odd, is that the orange lead appears to be the ground lead, and the black lead is the power lead. To me, that would be wired in reverse polarity. Tracing the black lead, it is definitely body grounded, and the orange wire is a dim-able 12v feed. :wtf:

Thanks.

View attachment 1715879456
Click to expand...
 
Without the ability to see a circuit diagram, I suggest that the lamp comes on when the door opens....therefore, this lamp operates the same as the ceiling light. The orange goes to other lamps, and eventually the switch is the ground point.
 
Check your door switches - they may be corroded or have a bad contact via the threads - remove, clean and reposition.
 
No courtesy activated lamps would have that color codes. That would be a dimmer controlled lamp, likely shift quadrant or console accessory,don't if console ash tray had them.

"Polarity" really doesn't matter if the socket is insulated, but I cannot tell from that photo

Closest thing I found was for Dart in the 71 body wiring available over at MyMopar

gearshift.jpg
 
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When you look at the socket in my hand, you can see the black wire in the center of the socket (for light bulb contact). The other end of that wire gets body grounded. On the left side of the socket, you can see the brass tang that contacts the light bulb brass base (orange wire). The other end of the orange wire gets tied into the orange dim-able circuit.

It would seem to me that the orange wire (power) should go to the center of the socket, and the black should be the one that contacts the side of the bub base for ground.

This light is to illuminate the shifter window in my console.
 
I see what you mean now. Maybe cuz the light is in series they put the ground wire as the bigger and "reliable"??
Orange wire goes to the side of bulb?
 
67Dart273 said:
No courtesy activated lamps would have that color codes. That would be a dimmer controlled lamp, likely shift quadrant or console accessory,don't if console ash tray had them.

"Polarity" really doesn't matter if the socket is insulated, but I cannot tell from that photo

Closest thing I found was for Dart in the 71 body wiring available over at MyMopar

View attachment 1715879467
Click to expand...
Yup, that's the pic in my manual. I just question as to why the current flows though the bulb base first, through the filament, out the bulb tip to ground. Everything I've ever worked with has the power going into the bulb tip first, and the brass socket is grounded. I guess it will always be a mystery.
 
You're going to have to go "dig up" (probably actually and literally) a Chrysler design engineer and ask them. "No idea."
 
CFD244 said:
Yup, that's the pic in my manual. I just question as to why the current flows though the bulb base first, through the filament, out the bulb tip to ground. Everything I've ever worked with has the power going into the bulb tip first, and the brass socket is grounded. I guess it will always be a mystery.
Click to expand...
I think (not totally sure, but I think) the dome light is always HOT and comes on when the door is opened, allowing the door jamb plunger to release and create the ground.

The electric path goes to the dome light first, then to the door jamb switch. If it went to the door jamb switch, then sent power to the dome light when the door was open, I think your wires would be reversed in the dome socket.

I might be way off though.
 
half the dash harness is black hot then it turns red after the ammeter.
 
CFD244 said:
. Tracing the black lead, it is definitely body grounded, and the orange wire is a dim-able 12v feed
Click to expand...
Would you post some more photos of the side and back of the connector.

There is a possibility that the contacts and wire terminations we're "repaired" at some point.

Also your "black" wire seems to be brown about where your fingers are holding the wires.
Just to confirm... You traced out the "black" wire all the way to a body ground?


Also I agree that the power side of a fixture should NOT be attached to the base of a fixture, in your case if the bulb holder popped out and contacted body ground it would short.

I would get a replacement socket and rewire it properly.
 
jonn6464 said:
I think (not totally sure, but I think) the dome light is always HOT and comes on when the door is opened, allowing the door jamb plunger to release and create the ground.

The electric path goes to the dome light first, then to the door jamb switch. If it went to the door jamb switch, then sent power to the dome light when the door was open, I think your wires would be reversed in the dome socket.

I might be way off though.
Click to expand...
It's isn't the dome circuit. It's on the same circuit as the dash lights.
 
Dana67Dart said:
Would you post some more photos of the side and back of the connector.

There is a possibility that the contacts and wire terminations we're "repaired" at some point.

Also your "black" wire seems to be brown about where your fingers are holding the wires.
Just to confirm... You traced out the "black" wire all the way to a body ground?


Also I agree that the power side of a fixture should NOT be attached to the base of a fixture, in your case if the bulb holder popped out and contacted body ground it would short.

I would get a replacement socket and rewire it properly.
Click to expand...
The socket is molded plastic, and the wires are molded into that, so not hacked. The harness is 3 or 4 feet long....The orange wire plugs into the dash harness, and the black wire has has a terminal the gets screwed to the body. That's why I am confused. I'll get another pic out tomorrow. Thanks.
 
67 Barracuda is the same.
67Dart273 said:
No courtesy activated lamps would have that color codes. That would be a dimmer controlled lamp, likely shift quadrant or console accessory,don't if console ash tray had them.

"Polarity" really doesn't matter if the socket is insulated, but I cannot tell from that photo

Closest thing I found was for Dart in the 71 body wiring available over at MyMopar

View attachment 1715879467
Click to expand...

CFD244 said:
Yup, that's the pic in my manual. I just question as to why the current flows though the bulb base first, through the filament, out the bulb tip to ground. Everything I've ever worked with has the power going into the bulb tip first, and the brass socket is grounded. I guess it will always be a mystery.
Click to expand...

20220228_234550.jpg
 
Orange is the dash light circuit. Orange is hot, black is ground. Becomes hot when you turn on dash lights.
 
Dana67Dart said:
I'm most familiar with 67 dart, but a molded plastic bulb socket seems a bit modern.
Click to expand...

Moulded plastic socket is designed to snap in a hole in the console plate , Allows it to stay positioned below the gear indicator to light it up at night.
 
CFD244 said:
When you look at the socket in my hand, you can see the black wire in the center of the socket (for light bulb contact). The other end of that wire gets body grounded. On the left side of the socket, you can see the brass tang that contacts the light bulb brass base (orange wire). The other end of the orange wire gets tied into the orange dim-able circuit.
It would seem to me that the orange wire (power) should go to the center of the socket, and the black should be the one that contacts the side of the bub base for ground.
This light is to illuminate the shifter window in my console.
Click to expand...

Conventional incandescent bulbs are not polarity specific. Current can go through them either direction. What the engineers did in the case is ensure this socket isn't chassis grounded through the console and is recognized to be different from all others. The console wouldn't be a proper ground path anyway.
 
RedFish said:
Conventional incandescent bulbs are not polarity specific. Current can go through them either direction. What the engineers did in the case is ensure this socket isn't chassis grounded through the console and is recognized to be different from all others. The console wouldn't be a proper ground path anyway.
Click to expand...
I definitely get that. The socket is grounded back at the cowl. I understand that current can flow in either direction. I just don't get why the socket is not wired conventionally. (power applied to the bulb tip)
 
CFD244 said:
I definitely get that. The socket is grounded back at the cowl. I understand that current can flow in either direction. I just don't get why the socket is not wired conventionally. (power applied to the bulb tip)
Click to expand...
Because at some point someone would attempt to replace it with conventional socket type. So pretty much the same reason all the harness connectors are different. Less edumaction required.
 
CFD244 said:
I definitely get that. The socket is grounded back at the cowl. I understand that current can flow in either direction. I just don't get why the socket is not wired conventionally. (power applied to the bulb tip)
Click to expand...

I think as Redfish said, the socket is not wired as other sockets are. Usually the outer part of the housing on the bulb is metal and contacts the outer part of the socket that then contacts the metal body of the car. In this case the plastic socket is designed to fit into a hole in the console plate thats not grounded to the body anywhere. It actually grounds to the body on the passenger side cowel as the previously posted wiring diagram shows.
 
Last post.......

The socket of this harness is insulated. It has 2 wires leading to it. One (orange) is connected to the dash dimming circuit and the other (black) is grounded directly to the cowl. I am trying to understand (I am inquisitive) as to why (in this case) the bulb base is energized and not the tip?

IMG_1983.JPG
 
CFD244 said:
Last post.......

The socket of this harness is insulated. It has 2 wires leading to it. One (orange) is connected to the dash dimming circuit and the other (black) is grounded directly to the cowl. I am trying to understand (I am inquisitive) as to why (in this case) the bulb base is energized and not the tip?

View attachment 1715879676
Click to expand...

I have my old harness from my 68 cuda with console(car used to be automatic) so Ill check the console wiring and see if it is the same and post later today unless someone beats me to it.
 
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