Couple issues on my new to me 65 dart…

Shaun65dart · Apr 3, 2022

So, I’ve been having a rough idle on my 225 slant 6. I did a compression test and each cylinder was 120-130 pounds. How does this sound? Plugs looks old so going to replace those. The cap and rotor also look corroded pretty bad. The carburetor fuel inlet brass fitting is stripped. The ID threads on the carb are what is actually stripped so not quite sure what to do here besides get a donor carb for the parts, or buy a new carb if they are still being reproduced?

for some reason, none of my guages work. Speedometer, alternator, temperature, gas gauge, do not work. The lights work, turn signal lights work, but that’s it. I have no clue where to start with this…

while looking under the dash I noticed the bottom of the cowl has rust and an actual hole in it. What is the best way to fix this? Cut the cowl from the top side and repair the bottom side or?

thanks for your help everyone it is appreciated !

RustyRatRod · Apr 4, 2022

You seem to have a handle on the cowl repair. Pretty much, remove windshield, grind all the spot welds out of the bottom part of the pinch weld, and cut the outer cowl off and remove it. Not for the faint if heart, but plenty of people on here have done it and posted up how to do it. If you do a search, it might come up. I've never had any luck with the search feature though, no matter how much the mods brag about it. I think it blows.

Aside from that, WHERE is the tune up on it? Have you checked the point dwell? The timing? Put a vacuum gauge on it? Those compression numbers say you have a pretty healthy engine.

Shaun65dart · Apr 4, 2022

RustyRatRod said:
You seem to have a handle on the cowl repair. Pretty much, remove windshield, grind all the spot welds out of the bottom part of the pinch weld, and cut the outer cowl off and remove it. Not for the faint if heart, but plenty of people on here have done it and posted up how to do it. If you do a search, it might come up. I've never had any luck with the search feature though, no matter how much the mods brag about it. I think it blows.

Aside from that, WHERE is the tune up on it? Have you checked the point dwell? The timing? Put a vacuum gauge on it? Those compression numbers say you have a pretty healthy engine.

Sorry forgot to say it does have Petronix electronic ignition

RustyRatRod · Apr 4, 2022

Shaun65dart said:
Sorry forgot to say it does have Petronix electronic ignition

Ok. What about the rest of the tune up? Timing? Vacuum signal? Also, remove the air cleaner. Grab the carburetor from the sides with both hands and twist it. Kinda like you're trying to unscrew it, but back and forth. If you can wiggle it, then you need to tighten up the screws that hold the top plate on and the two mounting nuts. Over the years, the gaskets shrink and the fasteners will loosen up and cause vacuum leaks. Sometimes all you need to do is tighten everything up, rather than doing brain surgery to rebuild the carburetor. On the timing, I would pull in about 10 degrees initial and drive it. It might like 12.

RustyRatRod · Apr 4, 2022

Here's a thread where you can get a pretty good idea of how involved cowl repair is. Don't say I didn't warn you.

65 Dart Fresh Air Vent Area Rust

RustyRatRod · Apr 4, 2022

Here is some more on another coal repair.
Project "Chihuahua" '65 Formula S Restoration "Estilo Mexicano"

65TerrorCuda · Apr 4, 2022

You say the cap n rotor are corroded, maybe an advance spring broke or the mechanism is crusty. Give the rotor a gentle twist in both directions and make sure it moves freely. It should move easily in one direction and snap back, don't force it

Oldmanmopar · Apr 4, 2022

adjust the valves they are solid lifters . after a while the exhaust valve sink and cause them to tighten the lash up. The exhaust valves are probably tight. If they are it will pop out of the exhaust at an idle. Valves on the loose side are better then tight. Big power gain,

Rust, Put POR15 paste on the rust hole let it harden and then plug the cowl drains. Mix a gallon of POR15 with reducer to get more quantity and pore the cowl full. Jack the car on one side as high as you can and then the other to spread it. Then drain the cowl. Remove the carpet incase you have more then one hole. If you do have another hole putty it and refill the cowl. easiest and most effective way that I could think of. Removing the cowl is a major job . windshield , fenders , hood lay the dash back and a bunch of spot weld drilling

I did them in the past . never again. When they are rusted that bad I strip the car for parts. Getting to old for all that work.

Mattax · Apr 4, 2022

Shaun65dart said:
none of my guages work. Speedometer, alternator, temperature, gas gauge, do not work. The lights work, turn signal lights work,

On this, take a look here (FABO) for some examples of the '65 wiring.*
Speedometer is mechanical. There should be a cable from the transmission through the firewall to the back of the speedometer.
Alternator. The Alternator gage is actually an ammeter in the battery line. Why Chrysler called it an alternator gage I don't know, but if it indicates discharge, then the battey is discharging and the alternator is not working. When the engine is running it should show charge or be centered (not charging or discharging).
Temperature, and Fuel level are powered through their own instrument voltage regulator (IVR).

Unlike a house or business electrical system, the fuse box is NOT the central point of power distribution.
On a '65 there was a welded splice behind the instrument panel where the alternator output line and the battery line are joined with the power feeds to other stuff. These wires are always hot because they are all connected to the battery positive.

1965 Main wiring

Turn signal flasher is powered off the accessory splice and not fused.

*examples
65 dart alternator guage

Bulkhead Connector Stripped Threads?

Shaun65dart · Apr 4, 2022

Oldmanmopar said:
adjust the valves they are solid lifters . after a while the exhaust valve sink and cause them to tighten the lash up. The exhaust valves are probably tight. If they are it will pop out of the exhaust at an idle. Valves on the loose side are better then tight. Big power gain,

Rust, Put POR15 paste on the rust hole let it harden and then plug the cowl drains. Mix a gallon of POR15 with reducer to get more quantity and pore the cowl full. Jack the car on one side as high as you can and then the other to spread it. Then drain the cowl. Remove the carpet incase you have more then one hole. If you do have another hole putty it and refill the cowl. easiest and most effective way that I could think of. Removing the cowl is a major job . windshield , fenders , hood lay the dash back and a bunch of spot weld drilling

I did them in the past . never again. When they are rusted that bad I strip the car for parts. Getting to old for all that work.

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So on my 65 would you say it is rusted too bad in that area to even mess with the car?

dano · Apr 4, 2022

Shaun65dart said:
So on my 65 would you say it is rusted too bad in that area to even mess with the car?

Probably not but I think he's prepping you for the amount of work to repair it. If you start to find more and more then that decision is yours to make. Anything can be brought back to new condition, it just takes time and money. The suggestion of a thinned POR-15 would encapsulate any rust in the cowl area.

You could pull the vent assembly and just see how bad that area is.

Mattax · Apr 4, 2022

Ill add that my experience with por-15 in a blind crevice (rear quarters) was that it didn't stop the rust. Prep the metal first; remove all loose rust, get it dry dry dry and use the POR-15 recommended rusty metal prep. Then finish with the encapsulator.

Shaun65dart · Apr 5, 2022

Did a few things yesterday. Put in new ngk plugs and removed the washer. Old plugs were autolite 66 with the washers on. New cap and rotor. Pulled distributor and moved the hold down plate to give more adjustment to the timing. It was at 2 degrees atdc and now it’s at 10 btdc. Runs really well now, much more power and starts right up. Only issue now is when it’s cold, it runs rough. Once warmed it’s very smooth

crvtec90 · Apr 5, 2022

Fixing the cowl rust is a big big big job. Not for the timid. That small rust spot is most likely much worse on the inside of the cowl. Its just what happens to these cars.

I would highly recommend keeping it out of the rain as much as you can . Dont allow any more water into the cowl .

You could pull that fresh air box from the inside of the cabin and just cover up the rust hole with fiberglass or whatever magical compound available , but its just gonna keep rusting inside the cowl until the metal is all gone.

Por -15 dries hard as a rock and is extremely difficult to remove. So if you put a bunch in there and then decide later that you want a re-do it will be a bunch more work for you to strip it and start over.

65TerrorCuda · Apr 5, 2022

Shaun65dart said:
Did a few things yesterday. Put in new ngk plugs and removed the washer. Old plugs were autolite 66 with the washers on. New cap and rotor. Pulled distributor and moved the hold down plate to give more adjustment to the timing. It was at 2 degrees atdc and now it’s at 10 btdc. Runs really well now, much more power and starts right up. Only issue now is when it’s cold, it runs rough. Once warmed it’s very smooth

Sounds like it needs more choke. This has the choke mounted in the intake with a rod connected to the carb right?

edit: I just noticed teflon tape on the fuel inlet. That can wreak havoc on your fuel system by clogging jets and sticking to fuel pump valves. Don't do silicone either, that's supposed to be a compression fitting as I recall.

"The carburetor fuel inlet brass fitting is stripped. The ID threads on the carb are what is actually stripped so not quite sure what to do here"
Replace if possible, having fuel all over your engine is going to make your cowl problems seem small if it catches fire

Mopar Tim · Apr 5, 2022

Having replaced a rusted out cowl in my 66 and replacing rusted out rear quarter. Cowl is much easier. Find a donor car. Only trick part is the leaded fill at window piller...

Mopar Tim · Apr 5, 2022

Mattax said:
Ill add that my experience with por-15 in a blind crevice (rear quarters) was that it didn't stop the rust. Prep the metal first; remove all loose rust, get it dry dry dry and use the POR-15 recommended rusty metal prep. Then finish with the encapsulator.

Saved my 66. Was real tough to remove. Por 15

BillGrissom · Apr 12, 2022

Your carb is a Carter BBS. You can find a manual linked here. Search SlantSixDan's posts. RRR is right that search engine here is poor. I search FABO from google. I prefer BBS to the Holley 1920.

Your cowl rust-thru is near the left hole, so may be able to reach in to it. Also use the access in engine bay. I would leave a rag soaked in EvapoRust on it a few days, covered w/ plastic sheet. Wash and repeat w/ phosphoric acid (Concrete Etch at Home Depot). Prime then coner w fiberglass cloth or Bondo Glass. Keep the side drains clear and a screen or magnet cover to keep out leaves.

Duggie · Apr 12, 2022

I had rust issues in my cowl too. Both fresh air openings into the car were rotted out and holes in the cowl in the engine compartment. I don't have the skills to take the air box apart, so I did the best I could looking for holes with a light and grinding / sanding as much rust as I could reach. All my holes were on the outside ends of the cowl box, so I could clean them up pretty good by hand. I used POR15 with the fiberglass mesh and the POR hole filling paste to repair the holes. A buddy with welding skills welded in new tubes that the interior fresh air boxes attach to. Then I taped off the cowl's intake grill and interior openings and flooded the dog crap out of the cowl box with Eastwood Interior Frame Coating (fogger). I put so much of that stuff inside the cowl, it was flowing out the outside corner water drain holes and puddling on the garage floor. I checked coverage inside the cowl with a bore camera and l QC'd my hole patching with a light. People with a more advanced skill set would have done better, but this is the best I could do with what I've got. And it doesn't leak for now...