hey crackedback i have never seen them before...in fact, i was seriously considering buying these heads in the next couple of months as bare castings since they are a great design for a wicked price, but like i said i have never seen any numbers put out and thats what im waiting for...depending on how much work they need for certain goals, they are obviously not for everyone (as is everythign) and im just trying to figure that out right now...i have my opinions like anybody else, but when facts are laid out in results with these heads then i think everyone's opinions will start to change for whatever reason