1972 Upper Control arm question..

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Woodie

Take-off EH!
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Could someone please post a picture of a "Small balljoint" style control arm with the Upper Bushings removed. I removed the bushings from a set today to replace them with the offset style. Does one side have a longer sleeve on each arm?
 
I can do this for you tomorrow. From what I remember, the holes where the bushings press in are similar but there is a separate sleeve that Chrysler added to one of them- can't remember front or back- that makes the mounting look different.
I also remember discussion on this forum where the installation instructions for Moog offset bushings are wrong and yield less caster. You might do some searching here to make sure you install them correctly.
 
Could someone please post a picture of a "Small balljoint" style control arm with the Upper Bushings removed. I removed the bushings from a set today to replace them with the offset style. Does one side have a longer sleeve on each arm?
The inner sleeve fits on the rear bushing on cars with 10" brakes only.
 
The inner sleeve fits on the rear bushing on cars with 10" brakes only.
Ok.. But its "Not" part of the control arm, correct?

Had a good go with the tools to remove the old bushings. Once they broke free from the bore, I noticed the "Extra" sleeve on each arm. Thing is there was corrosion on both ends wich indicates to me that it was not part of the arm. Or it broke free many years ago... Just trying to understand this odd setup. Car has KH 4 piston discs.

Woodie
 
My KHers did not have the stabilizer sleeve, on any of the three I have had, from 69 to 70. Nor did I install one. The last set of KHers have been on my car since 1999.
The offset-bushings go into the arm such that after they are in, the Upper BJ is as far rearwards as possible.
 
My KHers did not have the stabilizer sleeve, on any of the three I have had, from 69 to 70. Nor did I install one. The last set of KHers have been on my car since 1999.
The offset-bushings go into the arm such that after they are in, the Upper BJ is as far rearwards as possible.
Thank you AJ. It cought me off gaurd a bit, as I have done a few sets in the past.. These were the originals in the arms from 72. They looked like Hubba-Bubba on the sidewalk. As for the Balljoint... I assume thats for stabiltiy. Ie Caster.

Woodie
 
I ran into the same question when I disassembled mine about a month ago and that collar came falling out when I removed the bushing. Here is a pic that shows the collar on the rear arm of passenger side arm - I kept it on the cam bolt so I could remember it. I haven't taken my drivers side off yet so will be interesting to see if it has one also. Somewhere I jotted some info on some research I did on what cars had the collar, If I find it I will chime back. My Cuda is a 318 ac car.
 
I ran into the same question when I disassembled mine about a month ago and that collar came falling out when I removed the bushing. Here is a pic that shows the collar on the rear arm of passenger side arm - I kept it on the cam bolt so I could remember it. I haven't taken my drivers side off yet so will be interesting to see if it has one also. Somewhere I jotted some info on some research I did on what cars had the collar, If I find it I will chime back. My Cuda is a 318 ac car.
View attachment 1715045183
Yes there is a collar on both sides. I did not put them back on. I appreciate everyone chiming in on this post.

Woodie

20170507_103027.jpg
 
That's not a collar. That is a spacer.
The collars I have seen encircle the bushing preventing I don't know what, bushing walk I suppose.
The spacer is used , also IDK for what. But be advised that sometimes when you assemble these parts on the car and then tighten the cam-bolts, you may find that there is not enough thread up the shanks to put a proper squeeze on the goods to prevent the alignment from changing. My solution was to put thick hardened washers on, one under the head of the bolt; first item onto the bolt, and another on the other end on the outboard side of the cam. This puts the securing nut about 1/4 inch further down the shank into the threaded area. Now the squeeze will keep it in place.
If your spacer was under the bolt head, then that is what it was there for. I would like to use something wider there like a hardened washer, to spread the clamp-load. Your spacer could work, but I imagine it would bang out over time.
Well, I guess that spacer could just as easily be at the nut end.
And I should mention that this is only a problem with new cam-bolts. The factory cam-bolts did have sufficient threading up the shank. That may be why you find some bolts with the spacer and some without; the OEM bolts don't need the doctoring. If I am not making sense to you, just lay all your bolts side by side and measure down from the head to where the threading starts. If you find some that are not threaded as close to the heads as others; those are gonna be the trouble-makers, so they get the spacers.
 
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That's not a collar. That is a spacer.
The collars I have seen encircle the bushing preventing I don't know what, bushing walk I suppose.
The spacer is used , also IDK for what. But be advised that sometimes when you assemble these parts on the car and then tighten the cam-bolts
 
This is the "Spacer" or "Stiffnier" there were 2 of them. To rusty for my liking to be putting back on... And for what?? Lol

20170507_111148.jpg


In my original post.. I thought maybe I broke UCA... Thanks again AJ.

Woodie
 
Yeah,now those are the collars!

And what I took to be a spacer is nothing more than a spring washer on which I cannot see the parting line nor the hooks, I get it now.
Lol you are a good man. :)
 
I don't recall those being on my GTS when I did the front end, but that was 31 years ago...
 
I messed up on my previous post's pics but below are the ones I intended to post. Actually in the 68 Plymouth Factory Service Manual they call it a "support sleeve" and discuss it only being on police and taxi vehicles in the Belvederes and Satellites. In an old FABO thread concerning these sleeves someone said they were used on older A bodies then discontinued: Help! What is this part?


IMG_0880 - Copyresize.jpg
After I pressed my bushing out this "sleeve" fell off and I wondered what the heck that was for! You can see it on the left arm - I put it back on the bolts so I remember to reinstall it when I put the new bushings in.

IMG_0790 - Copyresize.jpg
Close up of the sleeve. I would be curious to what type of engineering analysis went into deciding they needed this sleeve on certain cars!
 
I messed up on my previous post's pics but below are the ones I intended to post. Actually in the 68 Plymouth Factory Service Manual they call it a "support sleeve" and discuss it only being on police and taxi vehicles in the Belvederes and Satellites. In an old FABO thread concerning these sleeves someone said they were used on older A bodies then discontinued: Help! What is this part?


View attachment 1715045301 After I pressed my bushing out this "sleeve" fell off and I wondered what the heck that was for! You can see it on the left arm - I put it back on the bolts so I remember to reinstall it when I put the new bushings in.

View attachment 1715045302 Close up of the sleeve. I would be curious to what type of engineering analysis went into deciding they needed this sleeve on certain cars!
I too was like... What the *#@! Is this thing that just fell off. At least we know now. Thanks for helping. This is why this site kicks ***.
 
You sometimes find those "Sleeves" on the rear bushings, on the Slant 6, A body, line of cars.
Why, who knows anymore?
50 years ago, some engineer with Ma Mopar, must have thought it a good idea, for some reason, to justify his salary, with the company, or keep his job.
In all the foregoing years, they didn't do a damm thing anyway.
That's why it's hit or miss finding them on other cars, wether taxis, or high performance police, or B & E body automobiles.
In my rebuilding of UCA's and LCA's and brake parts, i never reinstalled them in my career of working on cars.
I have a box full of them.
You can see i have taken lots of them off.

UCA Sleeves 001 (Small).JPG
 
You sometimes find those "Sleeves" on the rear bushings, on the Slant 6, A body, line of cars.
Why, who knows anymore?
50 years ago, some engineer with Ma Mopar, must have thought it a good idea, for some reason, to justify his salary, with the company, or keep his job.
In all the foregoing years, they didn't do a damm thing anyway.
That's why it's hit or miss finding them on other cars, wether taxis, or high performance police, or B & E body automobiles.
In my rebuilding of UCA's and LCA's and brake parts, i never reinstalled them in my career of working on cars.
I have a box full of them.
You can see i have taken lots of them off.

View attachment 1715045369
That is ridiculous!!
 
... The fact you kept them all this time :)

Whew, Ok.
I thought for a minute, that i was going to get into a big internet pissing contest with you, over the reply that i made, about a Mopar engineer.
JV.
 
Whew, Ok.
I thought for a minute, that i was going to get into a big internet pissing contest with you, over the reply that i made, about a Mopar engineer.
JV.
Not this guy. Always happy, and I try stay dumb.

Woodie
 
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