360 hydraulic lifter failure

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Swinger 340 said:
I would think you would need to factor in the cup depth. I would measure with the push rod in it.
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Yeah the truth on the pushrod length will be known when I drop them in and try adjusting the rockers. I'm still disgusted but might be over it enough to work on it tomorrow. :)

I backed the adjustment on the #1E (problem) lifter off 3/4 turn. Should be at 0 preload. Then I primed it and checked the lifter about 10 minutes later It was already bleeding off so I'm unconvinced the preload has anything to do with it.
 
Uncle Bob said:
Yeah the truth on the pushrod length will be known when I drop them in and try adjusting the rockers. I'm still disgusted but might be over it enough to work on it tomorrow. :)

I backed the adjustment on the #1E (problem) lifter off 3/4 turn. Should be at 0 preload. Then I primed it and checked the lifter about 10 minutes later It was already bleeding off so I'm unconvinced the preload has anything to do with it.
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Preload has nothing to do with bleed rate. That’s manufactured in to the tolerances.
 
TT5.9mag said:
Preload has nothing to do with bleed rate. That’s manufactured in to the tolerances.
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Designed in indeed, what that means is open to interpretation of course LOL I had bought a set of those very low priced eBay mystery roller lifters for my Magnum engine.. had a ticky one...took adding some more preload to shut it up, about .030 more, Weird.
 
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It's quieter with the new lifters. Still overheats but I didn't expect that to change. That's a whole 'nother can of worms. It's only good for about 10 miles at a shot.

Flowkooler pump, cold case radiator, spring in the lower hose, shroud. Started with a 7-blade in a shroud, but that turned out to be a /6 fan (200) so only 1/2" pitch, next I tried the fans from my roadrunner (was a racecar) but those don't cover the lower 1/3rd of the rad and didn't fix it, next I've got a 216 fan (18.5", 2-1/2" pitch) that I picked up here to try as soon as I get a short clutch for it. The engine is brand new. Maybe it's still breaking in? Hellifino.
 
When does it overheat? On the highway at speed? Slow in traffic? Idling? Just steady rise in temp no matter what?
 
Uncle Bob said:
It's quieter with the new lifters. Still overheats but I didn't expect that to change. That's a whole 'nother can of worms. It's only good for about 10 miles at a shot.

Flowkooler pump, cold case radiator, spring in the lower hose, shroud. Started with a 7-blade in a shroud, but that turned out to be a /6 fan (200) so only 1/2" pitch, next I tried the fans from my roadrunner (was a racecar) but those don't cover the lower 1/3rd of the rad and didn't fix it, next I've got a 216 fan (18.5", 2-1/2" pitch) that I picked up here to try as soon as I get a short clutch for it. The engine is brand new. Maybe it's still breaking in? Hellifino.
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Where is the timing?
 
cudamark said:
When does it overheat? On the highway at speed? Slow in traffic? Idling? Just steady rise in temp no matter what?
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No particular place, it just keeps going and going. I haven't had it on the interstate or anything but basically it never comes down unless I park it and wait.

TT5.9mag said:
Where is the timing?
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15 initial, 33 total, and the vac advance isn't connected.
 
You need to figure out if it's an air flow or water flow issue. If you cruise at 50MPH and it overheats, it's not a fan or shroud problem, and probably not even an air flow problem at all, unless something up front is blocking the air. Water flow can be a bit more tricky. It needs to flow at a certain rate. Too slow and the block/heads can't cool down fast enough, Too fast and the coolant doesn't stay in the radiator long enough to transfer the heat before it's back inside the engine again. Make sure you have the correct water pump, water pump and crank pulley, and are running a 180 thermostat.
 
Oh, and I'd run the vacuum advance on the street, even if you need to back off the initial advance to 10 BTDC to keep it from pinging. You may want to verify that the timing mark is correct on the balancer too. Use a piston stop to make sure it's accurate.
 
Uncle Bob said:
No particular place, it just keeps going and going. I haven't had it on the interstate or anything but basically it never comes down unless I park it and wait.


15 initial, 33 total, and the vac advance isn't connected.
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Seems the timing isn’t the main culprit of the overheating. I’d look at pulley ratio next since youve tried different fan setups already.
 
cudamark said:
You need to figure out if it's an air flow or water flow issue. If you cruise at 50MPH and it overheats, it's not a fan or shroud problem, and probably not even an air flow problem at all, unless something up front is blocking the air. Water flow can be a bit more tricky. It needs to flow at a certain rate. Too slow and the block/heads can't cool down fast enough, Too fast and the coolant doesn't stay in the radiator long enough to transfer the heat before it's back inside the engine again. Make sure you have the correct water pump, water pump and crank pulley, and are running a 180 thermostat.
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No, the coolant needs to move as fast as it can through the radiator.

This isn’t a flat head Ford.
 
I've run across other makes and models that would overheat if the thermostat was removed. The flow was just too fast without one. Add a small water pump pulley and large crank pulley with an non-A/C water pump and you can get cavitation and way too much flow.
 
cudamark said:
I've run across other makes and models that would overheat if the thermostat was removed. The flow was just too fast without one. Add a small water pump pulley and large crank pulley with an non-A/C water pump and you can get cavitation and way too much flow.
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That’s not true. I’m not saying your stuff didn’t over heat, but it wasn’t because the coolant didn’t spend enough time in the radiator.

That defies the physics of how these cooling systems work.

Stewart Components and Flowkooler both have excellent tech pages that cover this.
 
Well, installing a thermostat and doing nothing else cured them, so, that's the only thing I can conclude. This happened to 4 different vehicles that came to my repair shop years ago.
 
I have seen some cavitation problems with mismatched cooling components also. Cavitation can cause overheating too.
 
Newbomb Turk said:
That’s not true. I’m not saying your stuff didn’t over heat, but it wasn’t because the coolant didn’t spend enough time in the radiator.

That defies the physics of how these cooling systems work.

Stewart Components and Flowkooler both have excellent tech pages that cover this.
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I beg the differ. Years ago, I had a Chevy (C30) work truck and the pressure would build up and piss out of the cap, yes, I changed the cap first, then I removed the thermostat, and the motor would overheat a little, then I removed the guts from the thermostat, problem solved. I just had to slow down the water flow a little. We all talked about this topic several times, but this is my experience.
 
Swinger 340 said:
I beg the differ. Years ago, I had a Chevy (C30) work truck and the pressure would build up and piss out of the cap, yes, I changed the cap first, then I removed the thermostat, and the motor would overheat a little, then I removed the guts from the thermostat, problem solved. I just had to slow down the water flow a little. We all talked about this topic several times, but this is my experience.
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You can differ all you want. The science and physics says you are wrong.

Tech Tip #3: Thermostats & Restrictors - Stewart Components
Tech Tip #1: Water Pumps & Pulleys - Stewart Components
Tech Tip #5: Radiators & External Plumbing - Stewart Components
Doesn't coolant need more time in the radiator to cool?

Here are just a few of the resources out there that expose this coolant flow lie.

Your anecdotal experience doesnt add up. The fact is you need to coolant out of the radiator because the longer it’s in the radiator the longer it’s in the block building heat.

Read it for yourself. This isn’t me talking out of my ***. It’s industry leaders in automotive engine cooling giving you the facts.

It’s 2025. We aren’t dealing with flat head Fords.
 
I'm not saying it's common. Like I said, I only ran across it 4 times. The first time was a head scratcher for sure as I didn't think it was possible either. The next 3 with same symptoms were easier to diagnose. It must have been the perfect storm of components that just wouldn't work right without a thermostat.
 
Sooooo, I see 'cavitation' being mentioned as the cause of o'heating....
Since you cannot see inside the pump when it is operating, how would you know if it is 'cavitating'?
 
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