416 stroker temp?

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northeastmopar

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My 416 stroker has been done and driven now for about 2 years to cruise nights and shows. Today, about 70 degrees now, I took her out for a cruise. She usually runs at about 190 degrees. Sometimes creeps up to 200. But today it starter to go over the 200 up to about 210-215? Very strange. I have a griffin aluminum radiator with the two offset electric fans. I am running evans coolant. I got home and thought maybe the coolant was low. Checked that and the level hot was above the fins about halfway up the top tank. I topped it off with evans and took it for a ride to see if it was that? No change. Next I checked the oil level My pressure on the guage was idling at 25 and goes right to 50, and I am using Mobile 1 5w30 synthetic. It was down one quart, so I topped it off. Going to take her out again when she cools. I checked to be sure both fans were running. So now I am stumped? I have a mopar high flow water pump and I checked the belt that drives it. It seemed good and tight. Now I am thinking that the 160 thermostat which was new maybe is not opening all the way due to not driving it every day? I did have the motor dyno tuned last year. I am assuming that was all good. But I wonder about the distributor maybe moving a little to the lean side causing heat?? Also, my guage is an autometer which has the probe in the front of the edlebrock manifold? Could the guage all of a sudden go bad? As I said. The car has been running fine for 2 years and it actually ran fine the last time it was out about a month ago?? Any ideas on how to approach the solving of this issue?? Thanks...
 
You would think if the gauge or sending unit went bad you'd get really inaccurate readings. Too lean in the carb could cause it, and yes timing as well. Have you looked at the plugs? It the idle erratic or fine?

Two small electric fans have a reputation of being inadequate. Many have solved their overheating issue by removing them and using a mechanical fan. But in your case I would look into that last.
 
You would think if the gauge or sending unit went bad you'd get really inaccurate readings. Too lean in the carb could cause it, and yes timing as well. Have you looked at the plugs? It the idle erratic or fine?

Two small electric fans have a reputation of being inadequate. Many have solved their overheating issue by removing them and using a mechanical fan. But in your case I would look into that last.

Ya, We rejetted to holley 770 when we dynotuned the car. It has been running fine for 2 years. I was even wondering if these autometer water temp gauges are all that accurate? But non the less, the guage ran a consistant 190-195 for the past 2 years. For it now creep up to 210-215 when it is only 70 degrees here is strange. Can't imagine what would happen now on a 90 degree day. I will pull a plug or two and see what they look like. Regarding the electric fans, they have worked fine even on 90 degree days. I thought one maybe stopped working but they are both going solid. Lots of air coming through them. As far as idle is concerned, it seems the same as it always has been. Has a little lump to it due to the cam but smooths right out when I hit the throttle. I like the idea of checking those plugs. Thanks....
 
One thing to check, are the radiator hoses collapsing? I've never had this happen but have heard of it happening.
 
I always try and use Sunoco 93 octane. I might have put some super in at another staion but I always use super.
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One thing to check, are the radiator hoses collapsing? I've never had this happen but have heard of it happening.
No, both hoses are good and brand new. I actually installed the lower hose using aluminum hose connectors to make that 90 degree bend to prevent a hose collapse or leaks.
 


That is dead rich and who can tell if the plug is too hot with the black shell.

As for your heating issue...there is no way if the system is capable of cooling the engine that you should be anywhere near 200 ever if you are using a 160 thermostat. You have issues. Why those issues are cropping up now I can't say.

My bet is you are turning the water pump way too slow. It should be overdriven by ~10% at least. There is no reason to have that much differential between thermostat opening and operating temperature.
 
Not sure how your trans cooler lines are hooked up but maybe an issue with the trans making more heat if the lines run to the rad
 
That is dead rich and who can tell if the plug is too hot with the black shell.

As for your heating issue...there is no way if the system is capable of cooling the engine that you should be anywhere near 200 ever if you are using a 160 thermostat. You have issues. Why those issues are cropping up now I can't say.

My bet is you are turning the water pump way too slow. It should be overdriven by ~10% at least. There is no reason to have that much differential between thermostat opening and operating temperature.
Hi, just checked my slips and I originally bought a 160 degree, but returned it for a 180 degree thermostat. So I have a 180 degree thermostat in the car. My mistake. 6 years ago...
 
Not sure how your trans cooler lines are hooked up but maybe an issue with the trans making more heat if the lines run to the rad
I am seeming to have real quick shift points from 1 to 2 to 3? I have been playing with the shift cable to get the adjustment there for better shifts. I have a built torque converter which my tranny guy said he ordered a stall speed of about 2800RPM. Speed shop said to be careful on the stroker motor for the street not to have the torque converter slipping all the time and making excess heat, but the car has run fine for 2 years. This issue just started yesterday??
 
Hi, just checked my slips and I originally bought a 160 degree, but returned it for a 180 degree thermostat. So I have a 180 degree thermostat in the car. My mistake. 6 years ago...


That's still a pretty big split. IMO, 10 degrees over thermostat temp is an issue.

And as I said, you are dead rich.
 
That's still a pretty big split. IMO, 10 degrees over thermostat temp is an issue.

And as I said, you are dead rich.
I see the rich plugs. They were light brown when I pulled them a year ago? Would a blown power valve cause this? How would you proceed to get things in order. Do you think the distributor might have turned a little when I got on it? I did buy a vacuum guage to plug on the carb to see where the idle vacuum is? Have not hooked it yet, because the car was running fine? I did go out there tonight while it was running hot. Guage was reading almost 225. I put my digital temp reader on the sending unit and was bouncing in the 195 area. I put it on the aluminum gooseneck and was reading right about 198. But the guage was reading 225?? Maybe sending unit is bad or guage is bad coupled with a little carb and timing adjustments??
 
Would too rich (as in what we see here on the plugs) cause overheating? I thought too lean caused overheating possibly both if too far in one direction?
 
I see the rich plugs. They were light brown when I pulled them a year ago? Would a blown power valve cause this? How would you proceed to get things in order. Do you think the distributor might have turned a little when I got on it? I did buy a vacuum guage to plug on the carb to see where the idle vacuum is? Have not hooked it yet, because the car was running fine? I did go out there tonight while it was running hot. Guage was reading almost 225. I put my digital temp reader on the sending unit and was bouncing in the 195 area. I put it on the aluminum gooseneck and was reading right about 198. But the guage was reading 225?? Maybe sending unit is bad or guage is bad coupled with a little carb and timing adjustments??


Pretty rare to have a PV leak anymore. Of it hot starts fine, it's not a blown PV.

Brown is too rich as well.

You need to read through the thread in the fuel and air systems with a title about power valve opening or something. 12many started it. Read it all. It has some really good pictures at the end.

You set your cruise A/F ratio by the main jet, and WOT with the holes behind the power valve.

All of that and more is in the other thread.

Did you make sure your water pump pulley is smaller that the crank pulley???
 
Pretty rare to have a PV leak anymore. Of it hot starts fine, it's not a blown PV.

Brown is too rich as well.

You need to read through the thread in the fuel and air systems with a title about power valve opening or something. 12many started it. Read it all. It has some really good pictures at the end.

You set your cruise A/F ratio by the main jet, and WOT with the holes behind the power valve.

All of that and more is in the other thread.

Did you make sure your water pump pulley is smaller that the crank pulley???

Well, IT IS ALL FIXED. Friggin 180 degree thermostat was stuck and only partially open. Almost no flow through the radiator. I did a thermal check and top hose read 160 while the bottom hose read 90 degrees. Drained some fluid, pulled the gooseneck, removed that piece of made in china or mexico crap, installed a new gasket with NO thermostat, looked in the radiator and there she blows. Lots of flow. Running at 180 now. Thanks for all the help guys. Just wanted to update you. I did pull and checked my dyno sheet. Air to fuel rarion was at about 12.8 from idle all the way to 5300 RPM which is where she is making peak horsepower. She is running a little rich. Holley said it may be just a need to change the power valve from the 6.5 that the carb came with to maybe a 5.0. He said it may just be loading up at idle because it runs the balls on the highway. I did install and check my vacuum at idle and it was a steady 10.2 inches of vacuum. Holley said the power valve should be at about half that number.
 
Well, IT IS ALL FIXED. Friggin 180 degree thermostat was stuck and only partially open. Almost no flow through the radiator. I did a thermal check and top hose read 160 while the bottom hose read 90 degrees. Drained some fluid, pulled the gooseneck, removed that piece of made in china or mexico crap, installed a new gasket with NO thermostat, looked in the radiator and there she blows. Lots of flow. Running at 180 now. Thanks for all the help guys. Just wanted to update you. I did pull and checked my dyno sheet. Air to fuel rarion was at about 12.8 from idle all the way to 5300 RPM which is where she is making peak horsepower. She is running a little rich. Holley said it may be just a need to change the power valve from the 6.5 that the carb came with to maybe a 5.0. He said it may just be loading up at idle because it runs the balls on the highway. I did install and check my vacuum at idle and it was a steady 10.2 inches of vacuum. Holley said the power valve should be at about half that number.


Before you change the power valve, and go the wrong way, go to the fuel and air systems forum and read the thread about power valve timing. It's worth it. I'll even go bump it to the top.

Your phone call to Holley was a colossal waste of time if he actually told you to make the power valve open later. That tells me the idiot doesn't even understand how that carb works.

The short of it is this: you set your cruise A/F ratio with the main jets. You set your WOT A/F ratio with the size of the holes in the metering block behind the power valve. Don't know what carb you have, but most have a fixed hole. You can drill and tap that hole and use 6/32 brass set screws to adjust the size of the hole.

The dude at Holley is wrong. You set your power valve opening 2, maybe 3 numbers under CRUISE vacuum. For example, my engine has 15 inches of vacuum at cruise. I have a 10.5 power valve. I'd love to have a 12.5 power valve but I can't find one.

FYI, my idle vacuum is 9 inches.

Go read that thread. As I said, you are an rich. Ha said, you can be dead inch and still have an acceptable A/F ratio. Let the plugs be your guide.
 
Forgot to mention I'm glad you found the issue. You should see way less temperature differential between rated thermostat opening and what the gauge says.
 
Maybe I'm not understanding you correctly, but are you saying that without a thermostat the engine temperature is 180 degrees?
 
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