1. Ww58_bandit

    Ww58_bandit Well-Known Member

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    Hi all

    I currently run a 440 on weiand tunnel ram with twin holley 600 vac secondarys. Ignition is controlled by msd 6al box and msd pro billet distributor with 3.75 final drive.

    Engine is currently stock. Im looking at changing the heads, rockers cam and torque converter. What would people recommend.

    I do also have a set of holley 660 centre squirters would these suit the set up better then vac secondarys
     
  2. Garrett Ellison

    Garrett Ellison Amateur driver on public roadway, do not imitate.. FABO Gold Member

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    What year of 440 & how much compression? What is the vehicle weight and rear tire diameter?
     
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2019
  3. Cope

    Cope Fusing with fire

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    I think the 660s are way more suited to a high performance build/race car. I have a set for my new build and they dont seem to friendly for street use. They are all 8 at once. Im currently running twin 4160 450CFM non vacuum on my high compression 360. (Non progressive)

    The 660s are for my 6-71 build so i haven't tested them yet.

    If youyou comfortable tuning them i would certainly try them out but be aware that they are not designed for part throttle or MPG. They are strictly for wide open applications, ie boats and race cars.

    Are they better for your application, i cant say. I will be running them on the street but im aware of the compromise that they require.

    I say try em out!

    If you dont like them im sure you could sell the 660s, they are still worth a lot of money.
     
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    • Ww58_bandit

      Ww58_bandit Well-Known Member

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      Vehicle weight is less then 2200 lb (fiber glass 41 willys body) Dont know engine year or compression.

      Is there a way to work out engine year.
       
    • Garrett Ellison

      Garrett Ellison Amateur driver on public roadway, do not imitate.. FABO Gold Member

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      Give us the letters and numbers on the ID pad on the block above the water pump on the left side of the block in front of the valley pan. Also look for Diamonds, Maltese crosses and other non alpha-numerical markings.
       
    • Dave 74 Dart

      Dave 74 Dart Well-Known Member

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      We would LOVE to see picts of your bad boy!! My personal favourite's are 33 and 41 willy's.
       
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      • Garrett Ellison

        Garrett Ellison Amateur driver on public roadway, do not imitate.. FABO Gold Member

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        I forgot the most important question, is it street only, drag car, or both?
         
      • Ww58_bandit

        Ww58_bandit Well-Known Member

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        Engine id is in pic below it will be used for both eventally at min it is only being used on track. Rear tyres are 245/60D15.

        20190819_211733.jpg
         
      • Ww58_bandit

        Ww58_bandit Well-Known Member

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        Its not pretty but we love it. Build by me and wife learning as we go. Both race it here in UK

        IMG-20190819-WA0001.jpg
         
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        • Dave 74 Dart

          Dave 74 Dart Well-Known Member

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          THANKS!! Very cool car! Lots of knowledgeable guys on here that will help you out .
           
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          • Ww58_bandit

            Ww58_bandit Well-Known Member

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            Thanks
             
          • Cope

            Cope Fusing with fire

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            Definitely try the 660s on that, vacuum secondarys have no place on that!!

            Cant help with the rest as i dont know who makes good stuff in the UK for converter.

            Throw a high stall quality converter, good heads and away you go!
             
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            • Ww58_bandit

              Ww58_bandit Well-Known Member

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              The simple answee to whi make desent stuff in uk is noone we import 90% parts from US as uk suppliers import an way.

              With 660s can you get diffrent size centre squirters or is it just jet sizes you can change
               
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              • mycuda

                mycuda FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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                Very cool car love it.
                Mechanical secondary as mentioned.
                Straight advance if compression is good
                 
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                • Ww58_bandit

                  Ww58_bandit Well-Known Member

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                  Advance is controlled by the msd
                   
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                  • Garrett Ellison

                    Garrett Ellison Amateur driver on public roadway, do not imitate.. FABO Gold Member

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                    79 block with cast crank and probably 8.2: 1 or so compression. The good thing is I don’t see any diamonds indicating oversized lifters. Cylinder heads will basically be in the category of whatever you can afford. Are you budgeting for aftermarket or for original iron? If it is all stock, it should have 452s. Those heads can make decent power with porting and 2.14/1.81s, but if you can swing it, a set of Trick Flow Power Port 240s will really step things up. This is all provided the bottom end is in good shape with no cylinder ridge, taper, or egg shaped bores. Also, how is the oil pressure at idle and under power. A short block with significant wear is usually living on borrowed time if you add more cylinder pressure. Have you taken any compression and vacuum readings yet? Some 440s had near zero deck factory flat tops but are usually stamped HP or P.
                     
                  • Garrett Ellison

                    Garrett Ellison Amateur driver on public roadway, do not imitate.. FABO Gold Member

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                    But those late (76-79) 440s had some significant improvements in the block, they usually are good for up to 600 hp. It wouldn’t be a bad idea to do a tear down to check the bolts out and do a partial fill on the water jackets. But let me back up here. Before going there, what is your present e.t. and mph and how much faster do you want to go?
                     
                  • Ww58_bandit

                    Ww58_bandit Well-Known Member

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                    Current best e.t is 16.1 @ 84mph

                    Half issue with high e.t is a very low stall rate on the standard troque converter as wont stop bogging till half track.
                     
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                    • Ww58_bandit

                      Ww58_bandit Well-Known Member

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                      Budgetting for set of aftermarket heads was looking at either trick flows or 440 source stealth heads. Not dont a strip down on engine yet need car for show in couple weeks then looking into stripping doen.

                      Oil pressure at idle off top of my head is between 40-60 psi. Done vaccum reading from carbs to work out power vavle size these both came out at 17 mark (16.5 and 17 i think). Been while since done compression test on spark plug ports but when we did the reading where all within 1psi of each other if i rember correctly.

                      Cant find my ckmpression tester at min but borrowing one so will have all the figures later on. Going to do compression teat and vaccum test to get correct figurers.
                       
                      Last edited: Aug 20, 2019
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                      • Garrett Ellison

                        Garrett Ellison Amateur driver on public roadway, do not imitate.. FABO Gold Member

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                        Vacuum reading looks good, indicative of a stock or near stock cam. PSI readings that close together look really good as does the oil pressure. Those center squirters should take care of some of the bog, the timing curve may be a little quick for the combination too. What is the maximum speed your car can run before the rules require you to upgrade your chassis? You want to plan your build to on that unless planning on upgrading chassis specs, too. The torque converter is going to need to be a custom affair, are you running a 727 torqueflite? At 2200 pound race weight, a powerglide with lower rear gears is quicker by virtue of being lighter and only absorbing 18 hp as opposed to thirty to forty some odd horsepower for a torqueflite. How many rpm are you shifting at?
                         
                      • Garrett Ellison

                        Garrett Ellison Amateur driver on public roadway, do not imitate.. FABO Gold Member

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                        We will need to see cranking PSI numbers. Getting compression up enough to match the other hardware with a stock bottom end is probably going to be the hardest part of this build. What fuel are you running?
                         
                      • Ww58_bandit

                        Ww58_bandit Well-Known Member

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                        The rpm shif im not sure as still learning car so only ran it in drive, yes running 728 torque flight box.

                        The chassie and cage is goinh to be modified go will be tagged to 10 secs unsure what speed that will allow me to run
                         
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                        • Ww58_bandit

                          Ww58_bandit Well-Known Member

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                          We running 99 ron pump gas currently. Just got in so will post cranking psi up for all 8 cylinders shortly
                           
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                          • Garrett Ellison

                            Garrett Ellison Amateur driver on public roadway, do not imitate.. FABO Gold Member

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                            Okay, that’s the equivalent of our 93 octane so 11:1-11.5-1max with aluminum heads with good chamber design. But when we see the pistons and see how far they measure below deck we’ll know how much can be built in, I don’t think you’ll get close to that without different pistons or super small chambered. One head worthy of mention is the B1-BS, 65 cc chambers and decent flow. Big flow numbers when ported, but will flow more than enough OOTB to get you in the 10 second zone. That is a good looking race car, love the stance. That would be a lott of fun with a crashbox four speed.
                             
                            Last edited: Aug 20, 2019
                          • Ww58_bandit

                            Ww58_bandit Well-Known Member

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                            Compression reading on spark plug ports are
                            Cyl- Reading (psi)
                            1- 135
                            2- 145
                            3- 140
                            4- 140
                            5- 130
                            6- 140
                            7- 140
                            8- 145

                            Vaccum readings
                            Front carb -16in.hg
                            Rear carb- 16.8 in.hg

                            Running 85 power valves.
                            Jet size 68
                            Accelerator pump cam Brown
                            Accelerator pump discharge nozzel 35

                            Timing initial timing 18°
                            Advance timing 25° (silver stop bush)
                            Running both light silver springs

                            Oil pressure
                            Idel 35psi
                             
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