66' Barracuda and 273 with headers

Early A-Body Discussions

  1. Syleng1

    Syleng1 Karma is real and Life is short... FABO Gold Member

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    So I decided on having the 273 for my 66 Barracuda re-worked at a good machine shop where money flows like water just to get them to talk to you. LOL!
    Honestly, Larry's Auto Machine in Groton, CT is a amazing shop for custom machine work on the East Coast. Gary the owner has been racing Mopars since we were kids.

    They want me to use headers in my prized beauty. UGH! let the opinions fly here.
    So I said "SURE." why not. I'm down to 2 headers in my research. I've read all the posts in the search bucket. I'm down to the Doug's 1-5/8" DGHD450 just over $1k
    and the TTI 1-5/8" step headers TTI 636A273-C5 at just over $1000

    I've had both brands in 67-76 A bodies in the past and very happy with both.
    This 273 needs some breathing over the stock iron straws. I have a mini starter already.
    I have a TTI "X" 2.5" exhaust already with FI tech fuel injection.

    I like the idea of the Doug's with 1-5/8" tubes the whole way. This 273 will not be pushing a lot of flow (small CI) so scavenging exhaust makes sense. But I'm told you need manual steering only.

    The TTI are stepped headers 1-5/8 to 1-3/4" a tad bit bigger and supposedly works with PS and my 904 with center console shifter. They are supposed to be above the center link position. All pluses.

    WHO HERE: has a 273 early A with 904 trans and either header?
    I need to chat with you if possible about your choice. Waiting 6-8 weeks or more for headers at over $1000 per set is too much for me to make a "trial by error" judgement call after the fact.
    Thank you,
    Joe
     
  2. Professor Fate

    Professor Fate Push the button, Max...

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    • 66fs

      66fs FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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      I would not bother with headers, let alone spend that amount of coin. 273's flow plenty of air it is just at a higher rpm. I never could bother with the hassle. What do you want to turn your car into?
       
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      • toolmanmike

        toolmanmike Moderator Staff Member FABO Gold Member

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        Unless you have a real hot rod 273 engine, headers won't get you more than 10-15 HP. 340 manifolds would be close if you must have performance. Most of the guys with 273's don't have headers. The ones that do run headers are running a 340/360/stroker.
         
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        • BillGrissom

          BillGrissom Well-Known Member

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          Perhaps use the factory as guidance. Did they ever ship a car w/ headers, even as a 273 race car? The HiPo exhaust was special, but still 1-tube. I read that they tested a dual-exhaust and found it gave slightly less max power than a single, or perhaps a worse torque curve. Good they talked to you. They would likely shun a slant-six, as the bad-teeth guy diss'ed one on a cable show (Horsepower Nation or such), though a youtube shows one running a 9.09 sec 1/4-mile after a turbocharger and other mods. For sure upgrade the points ignition. A 1985-95 Chevy 8-pin HEI module would be good, especially if your FI Tech can command spark advance (old Holley Commander 950 controller can) so no fooling with advance weights and such.
           
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          • searcher1990

            searcher1990 Well-Known Member

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            i have 66 barracuda and have tried headers with total and complete failure. I do have power steering but even without the hoses I don't see how headers fit and I know some do as I have seen them but they all have cuts in them where they were altered to get them in. Be prepared to cut and weld and probably pull motor every time car needs tune up. I am happy with the stock manifolds. FYI- I don't weld so probably why I failed.
             
          • Syleng1

            Syleng1 Karma is real and Life is short... FABO Gold Member

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            Thanks Mike,
            That's the trouble- I am not "most guys" and the machine shop is trying to get me near the 400hp with a high revving 273.
            Like we've talked about in a previous conversation a while back. "273 take money to build." I really don't want
            a stock 273, but my heart is on a 273 for that car. So she needs to run.

            To start with: Let just say they are having custom pistons made with a ring spread further apart than stock and the ring pressure is 1/2 of stock.
            Most guy would just drop in a 360 and spend $5gs and be happy... Not me. :thumbsup:
            What I am doing is crazy - I get it.
            But we only live once!
             
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            • Syleng1

              Syleng1 Karma is real and Life is short... FABO Gold Member

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              I want to turn it into a 71' Hemi Cuda BUUUT that isn't happening.
              Honestly my car - the silver with red striped 66 in my pictures is a period correct modified car.
              I only went fuel injection because this new fuel with how little I drive her gums up carbs.
              I want turn key and go. The current 318 in there now sucks. Going back to the Commando 273.

              I could drop an turbo LS motor in there with a turbo 350 if you like LOL!
               
            • toolmanmike

              toolmanmike Moderator Staff Member FABO Gold Member

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              Good luck.
              Keep us posted on that 400 horse. That's almost a 1 1/2 hp/cube. Nascar engines make 2hp/cu.in so the engine shop has a lot of work cut out for them. It might be a push to be street able. Just say'in.
               
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              • Syleng1

                Syleng1 Karma is real and Life is short... FABO Gold Member

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                Yes I know. They are squaring up the block so every bore is exactly square to the crank, line boring this and cam boring that. Balancing everything to the smallest amount. Heads are getting treatment with a CNC machine program from some MoPar engine builder in the mid-west. It is quite the process when you physically see how out of square these blocks really are. Friction is a very dirty word. I'm excited to see this thing on the dyno!
                It will be like a lawnmower on steroids! I've always built my own engines with machine shop help. This is the first time I've walked in laid down cash and said, " This is what I want, can you make it happen?" They Said "YES!"
                Anything north of 300-325 hp I am ticked pink.
                 
              • 273

                273 Well-Known Member

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                That's an apples to oranges comparison, the smaller displacement is gonna need a lot less of head flow to accomplish a certain hp per cid, a stock magnum head can do 400 hp. Nothing too exotic to handle and make 400 hp, the trickiest part is the 7000 ish rpms needed. Streetable would depend on ones definition it probably be better than most would think but probably just this side of the edge of a full race engine.
                 
              • 273

                273 Well-Known Member

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                What head and work done to it and cam you planning on?

                300-325 hp should be pretty easy depending on build.
                 
              • stroker402

                stroker402 1968 dart GTS convertible

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                I thought the 66 D-Dart came with the dougs headers in the trunk from the factory.
                 
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                • stroker402

                  stroker402 1968 dart GTS convertible

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                  what about oil mods to the 273 ? to spin 7000 rpms.
                   
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                  • FISHYPETE

                    FISHYPETE Well-Known Member

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                    I’m no expert, but many hrs ago you could only get fender well headers. I put 360 exhaust manifolds with dual exhaust. Put it all back to stock when I restored the car
                     
                  • stroker402

                    stroker402 1968 dart GTS convertible

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                    I have had theses 3 brands of headers ... hooker super comps chassis , hedman fender well and dougs chassis for early abody cars I owned . I like the fender wells the best... hassle free .
                     
                    Last edited: Feb 2, 2021
                  • JDMopar

                    JDMopar Well-Known Member

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                    Joe....if you want the Dougs, keep an eye on Autozone for their 20% off code deal. I bought a set of Dougs D450's for my 65 Barracuda for $700ish to the door. I wish I could tell you how they fit, but they are still laying shiny and new in the box. The only thing I've seen about them that I don't like, and it may be unfounded fears....is a few of the tubes are flanged in the middle, and will have gaskets in them. I'd say they will probably be fine and I'm just overly paranoid! My 273 for my 65 is working it's way into the machine shop also right now. I'll be happy if I end up between 230 to 250 HP. I just want mine to get out of its own way, sound good, and get decent MPG. If you do get 400 HP from it, and it's a 4 speed.....you're gonna need a bigger clutch! :eek: :D
                     
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                    • 66fs

                      66fs FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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                      7,000 rpm is doable with stock stuff and a 273, especially with light balanced internals. Mine was a 4 speed with 340 bell and flywheel. Not sure what it would be like with a 904 auto. I ran J heads, 340 cam intake, 340 TQ, and stock exhaust manifolds, pretty sure not even close 400 hp. But was very quick. That motor would do anything I wanted depending on gearing. Rear tires will be the trick. I'm with you on the 318. Are you porting the original 66 heads? What cam?
                       
                      Last edited: Feb 3, 2021
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                      • 66fs

                        66fs FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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                        No, I would not put a Chevy drive train in anything. I rebuilt too many of them back in the day. That would be another thread.
                         
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                        • stroker402

                          stroker402 1968 dart GTS convertible

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                          the 273 that was in my 65 barracuda was supposed to have been rebuilt . Well ... it did not like to be revved past 6200 where I had the limiter set for a short time. well ....the rods bearing were all starved from no oil . of course don't know who built it . but on the other hand.... I had a 65 dart charger that would rev 7K all day long , but it smoked like a banchie . it was pretty loose .
                           
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                          • pishta

                            pishta I know I'm right....

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                            Hedman will make you a set of Husslers for ~$600 now, that is like half price of some of the other headers out there. They are full fenderwells though but probably outflow anything under the chassis. There is a thread here that mentioned that price and how they are special order, no refunds. Have you considered Magnum logs? Flow well, compact and cheap. get the early 2 1/8 outlet models.
                             
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                            • stroker402

                              stroker402 1968 dart GTS convertible

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                              here's a question for you all ........Could I see any improvements in performance / horsepower on my built 273 with 1 5/8" hooker super comp chassis headers with 2.5" collectors vs hedman full fender well 1 3/4" 3" collector ? or would 1 3/4" tubes be too big ?
                              possibly might use the hedman 1 3/4" fender wells on my new 273 rebuild with 10.5 compression and big erson cam 286 dur 510 lift ...similar to the d dart engine.
                               
                            • cudajames

                              cudajames FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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                              I went with Sanderson Header DD8s (About Sanderson Headers) on my 66 Barracuda with a 273, they are block huggers. I am very happy with them and they are now on my 408. TTI also has block huggers that have a little larger tubes - these would not work for my application without modification. And Sanderson is somewhat local to me

                              Both options give you better flow and reduce some weight from the car, stock manifolds are about 50 pounds and the sanderson's are 18 pounds

                              Good luck and let the fish roar
                               
                            • toolmanmike

                              toolmanmike Moderator Staff Member FABO Gold Member

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                              Any pics?
                               
                            • 66fyssh

                              66fyssh Don't Stop Believin' FABO Gold Member

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                              I used Doug's on my 66 Barracuda with my 5.9 swap.

                              Power steering car. I just had to dent the tube next to the coupler. Might clear completely if you used a Borgeson coupler. I also had to dent the oil pan slightly. Torsion bar and steering column run through the headers on the drivers side.

                              Yes, they are 3 pieces on each side. No issue with leaks on the flanges or slip joints.

                              IMG_20191224_145057.jpg

                              Heres a couple installed pictures!
                              IMG_20200221_213720.jpg
                              IMG_20200221_213903.jpg
                               
                              Last edited: Feb 4, 2021
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