Budget 318 build
- Thread starter dartfreak75
- Start date
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As said, Mathematically challenged in the morning.
And once again in the voice of Elvis,
“Thank you thank you very much.”
No worries, will coffees on the way!
And once again in the voice of Elvis,
“Thank you thank you very much.”
No worries, will coffees on the way!
I guess my take on any of this old car stuff is , what do you get for every $ you spend? Be it paint, interior, engine, etc? What are your goals and what do you want or have to spend to get there. I have read this thread a little off and on, but here at this point we are talking spending $500 to mill the heads, maybe spare the block and gain maybe 15 hp?
dartfreak75
Restore it, Dont part it!
After alot of thinking and consideration I'm sticking to the original plan. 500 would be a heck of a head start on my 360 down the road I can always pop the heads off and do a port job later down the road or even start porting the 360 heads now and get them milled a little and swap them out down the road. I have so much other stuff to do as far as suspension breaks rear end body paint interior etc to be worring about a 3% gain lol I have alot of work to do to get this thing back on the road performance can be obtained later down the road sometimes I'm bad about jumping around and getting a head of myself lol but im really enjoying this thread learning so much thanks you guys
Wyrmrider
Well-Known Member
dartfreak
that same old chevy duplicate is available from several sources- here is one on an 109 lobe center
get the dynamic compression guys to pick an intake close point and you can nail your cam
441 276/288 (54) 218/228 0 38 53 -5 109 LCA 109 ICL 119 excl Elgin 1223P
441 276/288 218/288 114LCA 1,800-5500 Summit 6901
and a crane put in for comparison at the same seat duration- which I do not know is even close to being right for any of them
480 276 220 136 61 Crane .903 H3 H-220/320
Big Fury is looking at a Sig Erson TQ 20 chevy clone for his project
.449/.449 292/292 38 74 82 30 (68) 214/214 -1 35 43 -9 112LCA 108icl 1800-4800 Erson TQ20H
about the same low lift, even longer seat duration and less at .050-- what's not to like
that same old chevy duplicate is available from several sources- here is one on an 109 lobe center
get the dynamic compression guys to pick an intake close point and you can nail your cam
441 276/288 (54) 218/228 0 38 53 -5 109 LCA 109 ICL 119 excl Elgin 1223P
441 276/288 218/288 114LCA 1,800-5500 Summit 6901
and a crane put in for comparison at the same seat duration- which I do not know is even close to being right for any of them
480 276 220 136 61 Crane .903 H3 H-220/320
Big Fury is looking at a Sig Erson TQ 20 chevy clone for his project
.449/.449 292/292 38 74 82 30 (68) 214/214 -1 35 43 -9 112LCA 108icl 1800-4800 Erson TQ20H
about the same low lift, even longer seat duration and less at .050-- what's not to like
Sorry, what cam do you have now?
So many pages.....
I actually like the Crane version best.
To each there own.
dartfreak75
Restore it, Dont part it!
I have the sum 6900
dartfreak75
Restore it, Dont part it!
dartfreak75
Restore it, Dont part it!
Ok some good news I found a rear end and picked it up today so the 2.76 are gone!! That is gonna be a huge help! The rear end I got is a Ford 8.8 with limited slip 3.73! So I was doing some more number crunching.. Does any one know how much to is gained from a porting job on these 302 318 heads? I figured up if I used my felpro gaskets that I already have they are around. 054 the factory gaskets are .028 I will loose .5 cr which will be approximately 3.45 hp that is me not having to spend a dime on gaskets etc and doing home port job myself. Now granted I can spend 60 bucks and get a Mr gaskets. 027 and get it back but for budgets sake let's say I don't. I'm loosing 4 hp! Will I gain this hp and more back by porting or is it just gonna even itself out?
Wyrmrider
Well-Known Member
Check the Stan Weiss site for some flow comparisons
Back in the Day Crane bought Wolverine and a Big Detroit Camgrinder- which I think may have been in financial trouble
So Crane claimed that the ground all their cams "in house" ( that meant our in house Detroit not in house Florida) they were the supplier of the Summit cams and many others
we still need to get that dynamic compression analysis
summit 6900 closes the intake about 72 ABDC @.004 vs 6901 somewhere around 10 degrees later
so you better have lots of compression and still end up with not much lift or area under the curve
Back in the Day Crane bought Wolverine and a Big Detroit Camgrinder- which I think may have been in financial trouble
So Crane claimed that the ground all their cams "in house" ( that meant our in house Detroit not in house Florida) they were the supplier of the Summit cams and many others
we still need to get that dynamic compression analysis
summit 6900 closes the intake about 72 ABDC @.004 vs 6901 somewhere around 10 degrees later
so you better have lots of compression and still end up with not much lift or area under the curve
dartfreak75
Restore it, Dont part it!
More compression for the 6901 ?? Or the 6900? Cause I have the 6900 I was just curious about the 6901.
Wait! You’re worried about losing 4 hp on compression? I think you need your head examined. You’re splitting hairs, relax, just build the damn thing!
dartfreak75
Restore it, Dont part it!
Lol not worried just weighing out my options. I tend to over think things. I was just thinking if the gains wouldnt be enough to cover that then would it be worth pulling the heads to port them? Your right I'm splitting hairs! Keep me straight rumble!! Haha
i'll try in order....
- Going from 2.76 to 3.73 will be a huge help.... in the 1/4. Not for cruising on the highway, it will sound like your in 2nd gear.
- My average gain on "home-porting" heads is approx. 4 tenths
- Who said the factory tins are .028 thick? I'd say .018 is closer.
- Quit with your "paper" dyno. Cutting heads helps low end torque, so stop with the paper 4 hp thingy you got going on... LOL. That being said, I wouldn't cut the 302's.
dartfreak75
Restore it, Dont part it!
The purpose of my car is just a fun cruiser I'm not gonna be racing it I just want a street car that will have enough power to get me around and be fun to drive lay a black mark or two and not get out ran by a 91 Buick as someone here put it lol! Thanks for the input I'm just trying to get the best bang for my buck make it run better than stock without spending a fortune. Oh btw by cut do you mean mill? Or port? I wish I could find a new factory gasket lol
cutting the heads means milling. My opinion, I would hate 3.73's if it spends some time on the highway unless you have Overdrive. Go out and put your car in 2nd gear and go 60 mph, because that is approx. what it will sound like going from 2.76 to 3.73's.
Wyrmrider
Well-Known Member
lots sell that Summit 6900 cam
421/444 278/288 204/214 112LCA 1,200-5000 SUM 6900
421/444 (.281/.296) 278/288 (59) 204/214 -6 30 43 -9 (-15)112LCA 108 ICL 116 excl Elgin 937P SP-CS 1089R 1500-4000 .050 timing
420/443 (270/28 adv)? 204/214 112LCA 107 icl 117 excl Wolverine WG 1116 Enginetech ES1089R 108/116
420/443 278/288 27 71 76 32 204/214 5 29 44 10 112lca 107 in 117 excl Melling MTD-1 la .006 Timing
very similar to the Edelbrock except for single pattern and squeezed LCA
.420" / .420"
204° / 214°110° 106° 16" vacuum Edelbrock 318-340-360 V8
2177
Still you have a 278 @.004 seat timing cam with that Summit 6900
when you could have .461 lift at 264 degrees @.004 seat timing with a lot more area
421/444 278/288 204/214 112LCA 1,200-5000 SUM 6900
421/444 (.281/.296) 278/288 (59) 204/214 -6 30 43 -9 (-15)112LCA 108 ICL 116 excl Elgin 937P SP-CS 1089R 1500-4000 .050 timing
420/443 (270/28 adv)? 204/214 112LCA 107 icl 117 excl Wolverine WG 1116 Enginetech ES1089R 108/116
420/443 278/288 27 71 76 32 204/214 5 29 44 10 112lca 107 in 117 excl Melling MTD-1 la .006 Timing
very similar to the Edelbrock except for single pattern and squeezed LCA
.420" / .420"
Still you have a 278 @.004 seat timing cam with that Summit 6900
when you could have .461 lift at 264 degrees @.004 seat timing with a lot more area
LMAO, tons of useless information there.
How about a post nutshelling it.
I was thinking that myself. Is this thread still active? Has the OP installed a cam yet? @dartfreak75 , what's your plans? (save me the trouble of reading through 10 pages of chit chat)
You can’t make up his mind and he is splitting hairs on compression ratio. He’s not sure if .04 for loss of ratio is OK. I told him just to build it.
I gave my two cents. That’s all I can do.
I gave my two cents. That’s all I can do.
dartfreak75
Restore it, Dont part it!
@toolmanmike i have not started on the engine yet other than just tearing it down and cleaning it I have sand blasting my oil pan valve covers brackets etc. I was just talking and learning from you all knowledge. Rumble it's not that I can't make up my mind I'm just weighing out my options I'm taking everyone's advice and knowledge and trying to learn as much as I can! I for one was enjoying this thread I didn't realize it was bothering you. I appreciate everyone's responses thanks for everyone's help!
Now how in the holy frak do you freakin figure it bothers me! What kind of Convoluted day dream do you live in to figure this out? Are you on drugs?!?!?!?!
It’s obvious that you cannot make up your mind.
You state it yourself by saying “ I’m weighing out my options.”
And there is nothing wrong with that!
It’s obvious that you cannot make up your mind.
You state it yourself by saying “ I’m weighing out my options.”
And there is nothing wrong with that!
dartfreak75
Restore it, Dont part it!
No im not on drugs lol just seemed like from your response just build the damn thing!!! That you was bothered by my questions.
LMAO! Not at all!!!!!
Oh jeezzzz My sides are splitting from laughing so hard..... break time.....
Oh jeezzzz My sides are splitting from laughing so hard..... break time.....
We need closure. Lol
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