Early A Big Block And Motor Plate

Early A-Body Discussions

  1. RustyRatRod

    RustyRatRod Bla de blizhibliz de blatde blizi bla bla FABO Gold Member

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    Would like pictures of your big block early A body with motor plate. Thank you drive through.
     
  2. famous bob

    famous bob mopar misfit FABO Gold Member

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    IMG_0474 (1).JPG IMG_0469 (3).JPG

    Not much help , no better pic of the plate , it`s a 1/4'' thick , offset 1 3/8" , w/ fore and aft limiters on each side, of the block down low , 'stock trans mount .Don't expect this thing to ever hook up enough to need the limiters-------
     
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    • mopowers

      mopowers Well-Known Member

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      Obviously a little bit of trimming and finish work to do, but here's the front motor plate in my 66 Dart. No inner fenders, but your get the idea.

      upload_2020-1-3_6-55-56.png

      upload_2020-1-3_6-56-7.png
       
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      • pishta

        pishta I know I'm right....

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        stock B headers will hit early A idler arm if motor is placed in stock location. 67's and up seemed to move the suspension forward 2-3 inches as that is what it would have taken to get the Pro-parts passenger side to drop in unmolested. IF you could, see if moving motor forward 2-3 is an option for future header use if that is in your plans. You may want to build in a passenger side -1 bias off centerline for the obvious driver side steering shaft issues. Will have to move trans mount the same to keep parallelism. Or go with 3 U-joints and get steering shaft around the driver side manifold, probably easiest to engineer with least impact on everything else as those seem to fit well with that one steering shaft issue.
         
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        • pishta

          pishta I know I'm right....

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          SMR makes a 1/4" B to 904 adapter plate that would allow you to use the physically smaller 904 on your B. Its really only 2 pieces: a 1/4 dual pattern drilled mount plate and a flex plate spacer (and associated countersunk screws) This would allow the 904 to be offset slightly in the small tunnel.
           
        • RustyRatRod

          RustyRatRod Bla de blizhibliz de blatde blizi bla bla FABO Gold Member

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          I'm not really looking at it from an exhaust perspective. I'm not sure I would gain an inch of room eliminating the stock mounts. It's more of a necessity thing. The 400 block I have has 2 mount lugs knocked off the driver's side. Not to mention the Schumacher mounts are expensive for one and unavailable for the foreseeable future for two, so I would kill two birds with one stone.

          At some point, I wouldn't mind getting some measurements from you as to "where" the engine sits in the engine bay using the crank center line as a reference. That would help me locate the engine properly.
           
        • RustyRatRod

          RustyRatRod Bla de blizhibliz de blatde blizi bla bla FABO Gold Member

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          Goin three speed baby. A230 all the way.
           
        • pishta

          pishta I know I'm right....

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          Ah... I cut my teeth on an A230 in Moms 71 Duster 225. Reverse N pattern? I remember sitting between them on that slick black pleather bench (no seat belt!) and shifting for them when they drove. I think I must have been 5...They drove that thing back from Texas in the summer with no A/C and 3 kids.
           
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          • famous bob

            famous bob mopar misfit FABO Gold Member

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            I WOULD USE A 1 PIECE PLATE OVER A 2 PIECE SET OF ELEPHANT EARS TOO.---JMO
             
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            • mopowers

              mopowers Well-Known Member

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              Hey Rusty, just curious - What are you planning on running for exhaust?

              I can take some measurements on the engine offset in my 66 if you want.
               
            • RustyRatRod

              RustyRatRod Bla de blizhibliz de blatde blizi bla bla FABO Gold Member

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              That would be a huge help! On the exhaust, I'm not sure yet. I am either going to make some factory C body manifolds work, or my friend Matt says he can make headers for anything. I've already seen his work and it's very good. He's a Chevy guy though, which has no bearing on his talent, I just don't think he knows "how little" room he has to work with. He assures me though he can do it. We'll see. It's a long ways off yet, but I am trying to get all the hard parts done NOW, because the cost is just going to keep getting worse over time.
               
            • mopowers

              mopowers Well-Known Member

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              Sure - I'll take some measurements tomorrow. If I recall coorectly, I think I followed the TTI measurements for the later A-body big block cars (http://www.ttiexhaust.com/MoparClassics-Headers/400IB-218/TTi400IB_Install.pdf). I'll double check tomorrow. I do know I mocked everything up and aligned the crank centerline/trans output shaft with the pinion yoke on the rearend before I locked everything down.

              upload_2020-1-4_21-34-19.png

              This may help too: early a body big block engine mounts

              I've heard angle milling some manifolds may work. I've also seen a couple guys swap sides and run manifolds out the front and under the k-member on the way back. A guy - Ron Thomas "Chassisman" over on Moparts has an early valiant with that configuration - https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/1990015/1.html. I'll see if I can find photos.

              Either way, it sounds like you're well on your way to the BB early A club. Can't wait to see the progress.
               
            • RustyRatRod

              RustyRatRod Bla de blizhibliz de blatde blizi bla bla FABO Gold Member

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              Once I have all the hard parts, the mock up will be pretty quick. Sometime this year, I am sure. But I am still going to put the slant back in it and even make the swap to the long rod engine I am working on, so it will be a while before I do the finished swap. It's also important that I do not change any of the car to the point that I cannot put it back, since it does have the original drive train. "That kinda thing" is pretty important to me, even though the car isn't what I would call "special". I do have my Ford 9" housing narrowed now and I will get the perches welded on it soon, so I have "that" going on. It's all baby steps. The one thing that everybody is telling me to just throw in the trash is the 3 on the tree column. That's a deal breaker for me. The car has to retain that throughout "whatever" manifestation it becomes. That's what makes the whole car so cool. You don't see it much anymore.
               
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              • mopowers

                mopowers Well-Known Member

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                So I was wrong. I ended up putting mine in closer to center than I thought. Here are the measurements TTI recommends for small block early A's:

                upload_2020-1-5_14-55-8.png

                Here's where mine landed. Passenger side to crank center: 13-1/2". Driver's side to crank center: 14-5/8". Difference is 1-1/8", or 9/16" off center obviously.

                upload_2020-1-5_14-46-52.png

                upload_2020-1-5_14-47-6.png
                 
              • RustyRatRod

                RustyRatRod Bla de blizhibliz de blatde blizi bla bla FABO Gold Member

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                Thank you. That helps a LOT! Mine may not end up in the same place, but I have a great illustration of how to find "where it will go". I assume you located the transmission mount in the cross member, "and then" squared it up "from there"?
                 
              • mopowers

                mopowers Well-Known Member

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                Yep. We bolted up the trans mount and dropped plumb bobs from the output shaft center, and crankshaft center. We moved the engine side to side until both plumb lines were in-line with the pinion centerline on the rearend. The pinion offset is in the stock location per Dr Diff's instruction. That's where we locked in the engine location. Not sure if that's the proper way to do it, but that's how my dad and I did it. I'm sure it'll be fine though.

                I can't recall how we determined the height. This is when we were locating the engine:

                upload_2020-1-5_19-22-15.png
                 
              • RustyRatRod

                RustyRatRod Bla de blizhibliz de blatde blizi bla bla FABO Gold Member

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                That's a great way to do it. Thanks! You've been more help than you know. I do appreciate it. I love the plumb bob thing. That's how I narrowed my Ford 9" housing.....and also why I did not do a how to......I know too many people will make fun of it, but it came out perfect.

                So, do you have this beast running yet? What's the latest progress pictures? Would love to see the rest of the cage, too.
                 
              • mopowers

                mopowers Well-Known Member

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                You got it - no problem! Plumb bobs work great. My dad's a semi-retired carpenter and taught me the basic old way of doing stuff like that.

                When I bought my house a while back, my priorities shifted and life got in the way. Luckily I've been able to get back on the 66 Dart in the last year. I'm in the process of building a 727 TF for it now. Still gotta plumb the brakes, fuel lines and do the electrical, then it'll road worthy. I've got a 400 stocker in it now to work out the bugs before finishing the 512 for it. It'll still need interior and paint/body, but that stuff can wait. At least all of the metal work and fabrication's done. I had a build thread a long time ago, but it was too much effort keeping it updated. I'm sure you could understand that.
                 
              • RustyRatRod

                RustyRatRod Bla de blizhibliz de blatde blizi bla bla FABO Gold Member

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                Ha! I understand probably better than you know. Between all of BOTH of our health issues here, cats to take care of, my new job, church, the men's chorus and "whatever else" is left over, I can relate.
                 
              • moper

                moper FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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                Not a motor plate - I made mounts after modifying the K frame. You can see it's "down" and "back" from a factory placement, and a little to the passenger side to avoid the steering shaft. Pictured is a 440 with tall covers. I modified the passenger inner fender and shock mount, and I'm making small primary headers for it, and I modified the trans tunnel and mount to fit a B727 in there (trans is attached and sitting on it's modified crossmember in this pic).

                IMG_3242.JPG

                IMG_3240.JPG

                IMG_3241.JPG
                 
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                • AbodyTim

                  AbodyTim Well-Known Member

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                  I thought you were a dyed-in-the-wool slantie man forever. :D Just decided to skip a SB and go for the throat, huh? :thumbsup:
                  AbodyJoe had a slick black Valiant w/ a 440 (you may have seen it already) but I don't remember how he mounted it.
                   
                • RustyRatRod

                  RustyRatRod Bla de blizhibliz de blatde blizi bla bla FABO Gold Member

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                  I actually am. The slant continues. This is going to be probably a few years down the road at least. Although, the 170 will come out this year for big block mock up but then go back in so I can keep driving the little car. It's really a happy little car to drive. I love the thing. That reminds me I do need to update my build thread. I have done a couple of small things. lol
                   
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