Is a pistol grip shifter a good choice for power shifting/drag racing?

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dibbons

dibbons

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I had a couple of questions regarding the terrifying (for me) process of full throttle power shifting:
1) Is the mopar factory-style pistol grip recommended for power shifts?
2) During a properly executed power shift, do engine rpms increase momentarily during those micro-seconds that the clutch is disengaged, or is there not enough time during that moment for the motor to accelerate?

Fell free to include any other tips, advice, experience, or no-no's on shifting. Thank you.
 
It's time for the way back machine.In the dark ages(yea, I'm old) when the pistol grip first came out,, they were the first thing to go in the trash. In went a Hurst Ram Rod or the tried and true Competition Plus. For some reason everybody had a hard time with them.Now I'm talking 45 years ago, maybe it was just a mind set,maybe it's like the way we think of China made parts,,,It's different so it can't be any good.It's all in what is comfortable for you.Hell, I knew guys that hated the hurst "T" handle and said that they would never miss a shift with the good old ball.....Just a thought.

Oh yea, when it came to power shifting my mentor said,"I can drink 2 cups of coffee faster than you can power shift."
Meaning I was Too slow yankin' the handle.. That was 1974 and sticks with me to this day !!

One more thing that was said back then,,,,"No one can shift faster than a well programed automatic"
Thanks for the memories..
 
Darter6 said:
It's time for the way back machine.In the dark ages(yea, I'm old) when the pistol grip first came out,, they were the first thing to go in the trash. In went a Hurst Ram Rod or the tried and true Competition Plus. For some reason everybody had a hard time with them.Now I'm talking 45 years ago, maybe it was just a mind set,maybe it's like the way we think of China made parts,,,It's different so it can't be any good.It's all in what is comfortable for you.Hell, I knew guys that hated the hurst "T" handle and said that they would never miss a shift with the good old ball.....Just a thought.
Click to expand...
The pistol grip is just the handle, the shifter itself WAS a competition plus.....
 
I agree,Yes they were. Again just the mind set . I do know they were way better than the GM Muncie shifters back then.
 
the shorter the shifter arm the shorter the throw between gears. i had a 70's toyota corolla that someone had cut the shift arm way down and i could shift that sucker flat to the floor and so fast you couldn't hardly feel the gear change. i drove a fox body mustang once that had an after market short throw shifter in it and same thing. it was a very short throw and could shift it pretty damn fast. the old pistol grip shifters were long and you had to throw the shifter what seemed like a mile.
 
Id say no, but I never shifted one either. Physics will prove a shorter lever is faster, and that pistol grip would make a better E-brake handle than a shifter. The old ball is great, 360 degree access and a smooth handle . I had a T handle on 4 speed once and found I used the shaft more than the handle to shift with quickly, especially pulling it towards me.
 
I installed a V-gate in my car,once. It was horrible, anywhere but banging through the gears one way; up-shifting. Period. Ran it on the street for a bit. That was a dark time for me.
-T-handles were forever coming loose. And when they did on the 2-3 shift, your knuckles would be sore for a week.
-Pistol-grips look pretty cool.Look cool.The handles are usually too long for aggressive shifting, but whats worse is how they work in the shift motion. They rock your wrist and lift your elbow.
-Hands down the best shift handle is a ball, on a very short stick.You can shift it in so many ways; over the top, underneath,around the outside, open fist, closed fist, 2-fingers under, 2-fingers over,yeah any old way. And if you build a custom bracket and rods,mount it very high and way back. So your forearm is parallel to the floor, and elbow is a couple of inches forward from your shoulder. Now you can shift it with your back in the bucket, and put some serious shoulder into it. That 2-3 shift is always the tricky one. Not any more. Anyway thats what I did, and it worked for me.
-You gotta have a ball.
-Power shifting a stock A-833, after 5000rpm gets a bit dicey. You better have a rev limiter. And yes the engine rpms will flare.And you better have your clutch set up right.And it better be a premium piece.And your shifter better not hang up. And if youre side stepping it,be sure to get your leg out of the way. But when everything works just right, its pretty cool.Sounds like a really really big dirtbike.
 
An E body/71+ B body is the way to go with a pistol grip.
 

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I never had a problem with my Pistol Grip.
(Besides hot as heck to touch in the summers heat and stupid cold in winter.)
28 years and counting.
Learn the thing. The handle is what your comfortable with.
 
well Darter6 will understand ...

"back in the old days" when i first got my "almost new" 68 340 4sp fastback formula s, it still had the factory inland shifter. the car had 3:91 gears and i did a lot of street racing with the car. i was on the high school wrestling team at the time and worked out a lot. as such, my 6k power shifts were pretty violent matters. i had only had the car for about a month and one friday night i lined up against a 396 chevelle and when i hit second gear, i broke the inland shifter off even though it had the OEM black inland knob. i drove the car home shortly afterward in second gear which took some time given the 3:91 gears. the next weekend i bought and installed a hurst competition plus with the "optional" "reverse lock-out" handle. the reverse lock-out was suppose to help in the 1-2 shifts. it did seem to help. i also put a hurst tee handle on the shifter. i probably power shifted that hurst 1000 times over the next couple of years before i sold the car. bear in mind, that was 1969-1970 and these parts were original american made hurst parts. most all car parts then were probably 10-20% heavier and over-engineered over what you can buy now. hurst did come out with their "Super-shifter" at that time and this shifter has a verticle straight handle with shorter shift throws. i never cared for the way that shifter felt.

properly set up, adjusted and lubricated, i don't think you can beat a 60s-70s competition plus with a tee handle. if you tighten up the lock nut under the tee the handle will not move under a hard 3rd gear shift. i've always "clocked" the tee at about the 10 a.m. position which seems a natural position for hard 2nd and 4th gear shifts. i've also found that positioning the tee like this allows for me to hit 3rd essentially with a hard pushing motion from my hand. wrapping my fingers around the tee i have never missed a 2nd or 4th gear shift.

that's my opinion. but it's true what rumblefish says, it's what ever is comfortable to you. as to the old pistol grip shifters. most guys i knew swapped them out for the after market hurst comp. plus. i have compared the "Plymouth factory OEM" hurst shifters to the original after market hurst produced ones and the ones from hurst are heavier and work better.

i never did the "side-stepping" thing - just lifted my left leg up quickly. one thing i would suggest about power shifting is that if you're going to do it, do it like you mean it. i found the more "violent" i tried to shift the more sure the shift was. you literally need to act like you're trying to tear the shifter out of the car. if you try a "timid" power shift, i guarantee you're going to miss the shift.

one other thing.... it was said .. "back in the old days" that ronnie sox could shift a 4 speed faster than an automatic would shift. he certainly beat a lot of automatic cars....
 
Bought my 69 Super Bee new in Nov 68 and hit the streets for some serious street racing. After I hit the drag strip it didn't take me long to know that the stock shifter was a piece of crap. Bought a Hurst Ram-Rod inline shifter "for race only" haha, and never looked back. At that time it was the best shifter I ever used and worked great on the Strip and the street. IF I were to get back into drag racing with a 4-speed, I'd be hunting all over for another Ram-Rod shifter{with the T-handle} :)
 
I run the pistol grip in my E-body with an aftermarket comp plus mechanism
and while I spend more time on the street, when I do go to the track I find myself
not holding the shifter like a pistol but holding my hand on top of the shifter.
I had recently rebuilt the mechanism, realigned the rods and it shifts pretty darn good,
but I'm surprised to hear the negative feedback on the Vertigate - that's what I had heard was the hot ticket, but again what you hear and what someone will tell you from experience tend to be two different things.
 
Years ago, I used to drive a Street Race Hemi Challenger for a guy who was smart enough to not want to drive it. Way too much motor and no chassis at all. Had a Pistol Grip that turned out to be the only stable item inside the car I could hold onto when it would start getting stupid about a hundred feet out.
After a bit, I had the handle wrapped with double sided tape and I would wear a leather glove on my right hand that we sprayed down with glue, and I was good to go!
Power shifting? Tell ya what. Even at my advanced age and generally mellower demeanor, I will still out shift any man or machine to be found on the face of this planet. Pull or push on that shifter with effort just short of snapping the forks off...push or pull with your mind focused on the place you want your hand to end up with the intent to follow through past that point (I've broken my thumb once and a knuckle once going for third in different cars) and FAN the clutch pedal with your foot. Hit the clutch with your foot on an angle and push off diagonally, letting your foot slide off the left side of the pedal about 3/4's the way to the floor. You only have to interrupt the flow of power through the drivetrain for an instant if you've got the shifter properly preloaded.
And practice practice practice. Go through all the motions of powershifting (everything but having your foot to the floor) every time you drive the car, everywhere you drive it.
 
And one last tidbit....

The shift pattern is not a true H

When grabbing 2nd...pull to your hip
3rd.....push to the right front of the car
4th....pull towards the right rear.

The ball always worked best for me.... be careful not to get too short of a tower. It is nice to have a little leverage.
 
I run the Hurst Vertigate in my Duster. Love it, now. Hated it at first. They take some time to fine tune and learn their quirks. Some people say they suck on the street, but set up properly they are no different than any any other shifter. If you want fast powershifts, V-Gate is the way to go in my opinion. People have told me my car sounds like an automatic when I'm really hammerin on it.
 
pistol grip shifters are killer on the 1-2 shift. when you go for the 2-3 shift in a race wot situation it feels like you just broke your wrist lol. Pistol grip shifters were in my opinion a marketing gimmick. they look cool as hell and i like the hell out of them. That said if I wanted to seriously race a 4 speed car I would simply get a new hurst comp plus box and regular old white shifter ball.
 
I had a car with a 4 spd in it long ago and for the life of me dont remember what was on the shifter but ergonomically speaking....I would go with the ball.
 
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