Is There An Honest Auto/Body/Painter In SoCal?

[Bodyperson]

It does sound like maybe you've run into some bad luck and I am sorry for that, but you touch on something I want to bring up and see how everyone feels about it. And before I get goin here, this is nothing personal, so don't take it that way.

I am sure there are reputable shops in your area. Not saying you're not reputable......I don't know another way to put this, but how many honest customers are there out there? I mean, everybody wants a show quality paint job, tune up, engine, transmission or "whatever" kind of job on their car, but no one wants to pay the going rate. EVER.

Every single day at work I get "is that the best you can do?" And I mean on everything from a can of paint to a reman engine. No one in this hobby or business wants to pay the going rate. No one. It's as if everyone thinks mechanics, body guys and parts people should "take one for the team" simply because they think "that's how it should be". It's no wonder automotive businesses are going out left and right.

Do you have any idea how much money in materials it takes to do even a good quality driver job? I know you said you have money in paint. How much was it a gallon? 300 bucks? More? I've seen it as high as 1200 a gallon and more. Plus, prep materials aren't cheap. Not to mention paid labor and all the overhead involved with running a shop. How much do you think the electric bill is at a moderately sized body shop? 100 bucks a month?

Then, there's all of the taxes and fees they have to pay to the money grubbing local government entities and all of the fake EPA crap. Now, I'm not bein a smartass here, really. Honestly, how do you expect a body shop or any other automotive operation to stay in business just because you "want a good deal"? Or, do you even care about that?

It pisses me off to no end to hear people asking for a "good discount" and then see them drive away in their Escalade. Nobody seems to care about what happens to business. Just that they get a good deal. Let me pose this question. When you go grocery shopping, when you get to the checkout, can you negotiate the "best price"? Then why is it that everyone under the sun always, always expects people in the automotive industry......no matter WHAT part of the spectrum to drop prices or do the same quality work for a lesser price? I've never understood that.

Like I said, I'm not bein a smartass, just pointing out a fact that I've seen all my life and I think others will agree.

Exactly where I was headed with my first post RRR. I was a little passive aggressive though and failed to pull off what you just took the time to say. I fell sorry for ocdart and just couldn't say it the way you can. My feeling usually involves a lot of XXXXX so I bite my tongue. You forgot to mention liability insurance. Million dollar umbrella is not cheap either.

 

[RustyRatRod]

Exactly where I was headed with my first post RRR. I was a little passive aggressive though and failed to pull off what you just took the time to say. I fell sorry for ocdart and just couldn't say it the way you can. My feeling usually involves a lot of XXXXX so I bite my tongue. You forgot to mention liability insurance. Million dollar umbrella is not cheap either.

I was includin all that in "overhead" but I am glad you singled it out.

 

[Johnny Dart]

I don't know what it is about car painters, but they are some of the most unreliable, bullshitting,sheisters I have ever met.
Hard to take any of them on their word. Must be the fumes.
On dumb luck I met the guy who painted my 70 Dart, and he did a fantastic job. Turns out he was a ****** addict, and passed away a couple years after painting it.

 

[flingdingo]

Every single day at work I get "is that the best you can do?" And I mean on everything from a can of paint to a reman engine. No one in this hobby or business wants to pay the going rate.

This is very true. Not to turn the OP's post into a rant, but during my short time running my own hot rod/custom shop, my first three customers, when presented with an estimate, responded with "What can you do for me?"

Well, I can do the job to the best of my ability, in the shortest amount of time possible. What can you do for me in return? Pay the f'in bill and don't ***** about it...

I didn't spend much time self-employed...

 

[Bodyperson]

I was includin all that in "overhead" but I am glad you singled it out.

I realized that soon after I posted. It's a huge expense that the cut throat shops do not provide and one of the reasons that bargain seekers choose them. They are not playing by the same rules.

 

[pishta]

Oh oh better get Maaco...

My insurance farmed out the paint to Maaco on my LS400 when it got its hood and a fender rippled from a back up bump. I was amazed at the work they did. Im no body man but the paint on the 2 panels was a perfect match and this car was 20 years old! They even did the lower silver rockers (always beat up on an older LS) for me under the original estimate. Hood repaint looked like glass. An insurance place did my SC400's rear bumper skin and valence too. Came out perfect. I think the 2 stage materials now days is either very forgiving or the guys know what they are doing.

 

[Bodyperson]

I don't know what it is about car painters, but they are some of the most unreliable, bullshitting,sheisters I have ever met.
Hard to take any of them on their word. Must be the fumes.
On dumb luck I met the guy who painted my 70 Dart, and he did a fantastic job. Turns out he was a ****** addict, and passed away a couple years after painting it.

A professional car painter breaths less fumes than you do Johnny. You can't just lump them all into one category. I will concur the painters that bargain hunters seek can be less than professional and that mentality can occur in any profession.

 

[Bodyperson]

My insurance farmed out the paint to Maaco on my LS400 when it got its hood and a fender rippled from a back up bump. I was amazed at the work they did. Im no body man but the paint on the 2 panels was a perfect match and this car was 20 years old! They even did the lower silver rockers (always beat up on an older LS) for me under the original estimate. Hood repaint looked like glass. An insurance place did my SC400's rear bumper skin and valence too. Came out perfect. I think the 2 stage materials now days is either very forgiving or the guys know what they are doing.
View attachment 1715276288

Like I have said before, painting is easy. Durability of repairs requires skill and knowledge. I'm not saying Maaco can't pull that off but just like your photo suggests, we all put the emphasis on the shiny end product that may fall off in 6 months if the proper procedures are not followed. The staffing and procedures to pull off an insurance job is staggering too. I am digressing. Glad you are happy with your repairs pishta.

 

[MoparLeo]

The problem with our cars is that no shop unless it is a custom shop will touch a car over 20 years old. They don't do body work only panel replacements. It is like you guys say, unless you can find that small 1-2 man body shop with years of experience doing older cars, the overhead, insurance, permits, medical, benefits etc... are very high, so they won't do it or will charge the going rate. Remember that the busy shops have plenty of work, lots of bad drivers out there and their customers are interested in price, not quality as their cars are usually just transportation to them and their insurance pays the bill. Just like medical insurance. Good insurance, PPO doctor. Cheaper insurance, HMO doctor. Same thing. Forums like this, with like minded members, and word of mouth recommendations are about the only way our hobby is going to survive. So yeah, help a member/friend out. You don't need to do it for nothing but we can try to cut each other a little slack. Just good karma. Golden rule guys.

 

[James Clews]

My son and I own a panel shop in Sydney and yes we only do smash work. We do 50 cars a week so cannot afford to have cars laying around. At the moment it is 40 degrees C here in sydney and friday is expected to be 45C (125F) so we have to get in early before the heat sets in. Tradesmen are starting at 5 oclock in the morning and on friday they might even start earlier before the heat. Gee I went in at six oclock and it was 26c then (About 85f)and by about ten oclock I was sweating my arse off.Well I suppose it is better than freezing my arse off at chrismas holiday time!

 

[Bodyperson]

My son and I own a panel shop in Sydney and yes we only do smash work. We do 50 cars a week so cannot afford to have cars laying around. At the moment it is 40 degrees C here in sydney and friday is expected to be 45C (125F) so we have to get in early before the heat sets in. Tradesmen are starting at 5 oclock in the morning and on friday they might even start earlier before the heat. Gee I went in at six oclock and it was 26c then (About 85f)and by about ten oclock I was sweating my arse off.Well I suppose it is better than freezing my arse off at chrismas holiday time!

I'll take the cold any day Mate. LOL

 

[James Clews]

NO! If my toes get cold I cannot get warm ever! Besides who wants to be snowed in in christmas time when you want to go to the beach, sun and surf and have fun. besides its is easy to cool down with a dozen or so ales.

 

[Bodyperson]

NO! If my toes get cold I cannot get warm ever! Besides who wants to be snowed in in christmas time when you want to go to the beach, sun and surf and have fun. besides its is easy to cool down with a dozen or so ales.

Gotta learn how to keep your toes warm for sure. We have fun and sun but the surf needs to be about 3 inches solid to have the winter fun. Hooking into a big Rainbow Trout through the ice is addicting. Fire ball and whiskey makes a good warmer.

 

[pishta]

Like I have said before, painting is easy. Durability of repairs requires skill and knowledge. I'm not saying Maaco can't pull that off but just like your photo suggests, we all put the emphasis on the shiny end product that may fall off in 6 months if the proper procedures are not followed. ..

Yes, I agree with you there too. I had a small shop (owned the tow truck that backed into me..in my drive way!) patch a dent in the trunk of my Breeze and 9 months later the bondo was pealing up and looked like a dry lake bed. I had my 65 painted by One-Day (just a cut above Earl Sheib) and heck, after 18 years its still pretty nice considering its been in the garage for 14 of those. Its a little thin on the rear rockers but for $400, I am very satisfied....slight orange peal was a wet sand away after 6 months. Much better than the rattle can copper someone threw on it.

 

[ocdart]

Shop #4 won’t tell you who this guy is?

That’s a red flag!

Shop #4 gave me a first name only - said that's all he knows him by - and said he wants to introduce him to me. But I've asked several times starting last Friday for a phone number and haven't received any info yet.

 

[ocdart]

It does sound like maybe you've run into some bad luck and I am sorry for that, but you touch on something I want to bring up and see how everyone feels about it. And before I get goin here, this is nothing personal, so don't take it that way.

I am sure there are reputable shops in your area. Not saying you're not reputable......I don't know another way to put this, but how many honest customers are there out there? I mean, everybody wants a show quality paint job, tune up, engine, transmission or "whatever" kind of job on their car, but no one wants to pay the going rate. EVER.

Every single day at work I get "is that the best you can do?" And I mean on everything from a can of paint to a reman engine. No one in this hobby or business wants to pay the going rate. No one. It's as if everyone thinks mechanics, body guys and parts people should "take one for the team" simply because they think "that's how it should be". It's no wonder automotive businesses are going out left and right.

Do you have any idea how much money in materials it takes to do even a good quality driver job? I know you said you have money in paint. How much was it a gallon? 300 bucks? More? I've seen it as high as 1200 a gallon and more. Plus, prep materials aren't cheap. Not to mention paid labor and all the overhead involved with running a shop. How much do you think the electric bill is at a moderately sized body shop? 100 bucks a month?

Then, there's all of the taxes and fees they have to pay to the money grubbing local government entities and all of the fake EPA crap. Now, I'm not bein a smartass here, really. Honestly, how do you expect a body shop or any other automotive operation to stay in business just because you "want a good deal"? Or, do you even care about that?

It pisses me off to no end to hear people asking for a "good discount" and then see them drive away in their Escalade. Nobody seems to care about what happens to business. Just that they get a good deal. Let me pose this question. When you go grocery shopping, when you get to the checkout, can you negotiate the "best price"? Then why is it that everyone under the sun always, always expects people in the automotive industry......no matter WHAT part of the spectrum to drop prices or do the same quality work for a lesser price? I've never understood that.

Like I said, I'm not bein a smartass, just pointing out a fact that I've seen all my life and I think others will agree.

I agree with you 100% RRR.
In all of my dealings with any of the paint shops I never asked for a discount. I've checked out their work, asked about the brand of paint materials they plan to use, their estimate on how long the job will take, and then asked for their price. Also, I've never quibbled about their quote.

 

[seabee]

My Hispanic neighbor told me I have a couple of options:

1. Take it to a local shop and pay $10k for Mexicans to paint your car half-assed.
2. Take it to Mexico and pay $2k for Mexicans to paint your car real nice.

 

[barbee6043]

I have found thru the ages:
There are bodymen, and there are panel hangers.

Unless you are in VERY rural America ( I doubt that ever includes anything n the left coast?)..Seldom to never will you find a shop to do insurance work AND old car work.. unless there is something wrong with their business.

Us car guys can be the cheapest arsholes in the world.

The more $$$ a man has, the cheapest he usually is..

Everyone wants a perfect , and I mean absolute perfect job, with the most asanine costing materials, and ALL for really pretty little considering..

Then you have the do it your selfer......so I am still learning after restoring (relative term) my first car over 30 years ago. So I build what I want a driver,.... no rust, no perfection, and NO $5000-15000 paint!

I have had good collectable cars that MY bodyman decades ago, back then, did with the best materials and flawless work, and I would add it all up, and never did that car ever really make me a profit. Not really. Yes that was 15-20 years ago but... the project cost was less, the parts and materials were less, machine work was less, etc.. Everybody wants perfect for near nothing, and will accept NO less, as they intend to take the car to the local "dog and pony" car show to try to win the prize!!

I am always dragging home some old Mopar project. Saving another one. Gives something to do, makes me keep moving. Just cars that are cheap and never will be worth a big $$ as I will not spend the $$ on such car. I can buy it right sell it for a little profit. Or get it running and sell it for just a little more profit.
I can repair all the rust, take pics, seal that with epoxy primer, OR step 2, continue with the filler work needed. Then the potential buyer, looks and all you hear is " I don't know what is under that". So I say, you need a project that needs everything and take it to a real shop for the work!!! lol

Good luck!!

 

[Mtn Thunder]

I agree with you 100% RRR.
In all of my dealings with any of the paint shops I never asked for a discount. I've checked out their work, asked about the brand of paint materials they plan to use, their estimate on how long the job will take, and then asked for their price. Also, I've never quibbled about their quote.

Ken, if you don't mind a haul to Bakersfield I have a very trustworthy shop I can recommend. They did the wife's Dart in six weeks as promised. PM me if interested.

 

[Johnny Dart]

A professional car painter breaths less fumes than you do Johnny. You can't just lump them all into one category. I will concur the painters that bargain hunters seek can be less than professional and that mentality can occur in any profession.

True, I can't lump them all into one category. But I can speak from my experience, and others that I have met. Flakey bunch indeed.
In regards to fumes...Not even close bud. These guys are around deadly chemicals all day, me not so much. Not even close.

 

[Unconventional]

My Hispanic neighbor told me I have a couple of options:

1. Take it to a local shop and pay $10k for Mexicans to paint your car half-assed.
2. Take it to Mexico and pay $2k for Mexicans to paint your car real nice.

I was thinkin' Tijuana last night when I looked in on this post

 

[Bodyperson]

True, I can't lump them all into one category. But I can speak from my experience, and others that I have met. Flakey bunch indeed.
In regards to fumes...Not even close bud. These guys are around deadly chemicals all day, me not so much. Not even close.

I may have over exaggerated the fumes part but they protect themselves pretty good. Enough to not effect their mental stability. I have to agree with you though. I'm not sure what part of that job attracts those kinds of people. I have to say drywallers are the same way.

 

[RustyRatRod]

I agree with you 100% RRR.
In all of my dealings with any of the paint shops I never asked for a discount. I've checked out their work, asked about the brand of paint materials they plan to use, their estimate on how long the job will take, and then asked for their price. Also, I've never quibbled about their quote.

I was sorta thinkin you weren't "like that". Thing is, it's SO RARE to actually find people who appreciate the service they're getting........."AS LONG" as it's fair and honest. I would venture to say over 75% of the customers that come into our store "don't give a rat's butt" about our jobs or profession. "ALL" they want is the "best deal". Makes me wanna puke. Good luck man. I know you'll find somebody. There are two GOOD places here, but that doesn't do you any good "THERE".

 

[RustyRatRod]

True, I can't lump them all into one category. But I can speak from my experience, and others that I have met. Flakey bunch indeed.
In regards to fumes...Not even close bud. These guys are around deadly chemicals all day, me not so much. Not even close.

We had one like that that just went out of business in Gray. You could look at the guy and tell he was a meth head. Everybody knew it. The city council, all the commissioners, because he was trying to get a license to haul cars for the city. "They KNEW" what they were dealin with and never put him on "the list". I never saw a job that came out of that shop that wasn't crappy looking. Now he's gone to Milledgeville and is just towing cars. He'll mess that up if he doesn't get help.

 

[Dennis H]

Ken, if you don't mind a haul to Bakersfield I have a very trustworthy shop I can recommend. They did the wife's Dart in six weeks as promised. PM me if interested.

How about a shop name for us. Nothing beats this kind of referral. What was done?