MSD ignition installed, now I'm thinking transmission time?

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hellfirechrome

hellfirechrome

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So I went to JEGS and bought the MSD 6AL box/coil kit, with BOSCH platinum plugs and new silicone wires, etc. I can honestly say, this is the most striking change I have ever seen in the performance of a slant six! (have had 3). It idles smooth, warms up quick, has even and reliable acceleration, and even has a louder and deepr exhaust note! I have had no cold-morning issues this week (40 degrees?), and it warms up riiiiight to its running temp and stays there. WOW. Anyone wanting a quick way to smooth out your motor's running attributes, THIS is the way! Oh, and $300. Installed. NICE!

Another thing is, I have been leaning toward ridding myself of the stock 904 and moving up to a later transmission with OD from a later slant six car/van. What are my options, as far as trans swaps that will bolt-up to a slant six? I really need better freeway economy (of course carb/headers will help too, that'll happen by June). I'd like to know if there's an AOD that will fit my slant without too much trouble. None of that tailshaft-bolt-on crap for $2700. That's twice what I paid for the car :) Any ideas?

-Hunter
 
Ethhier way, it'll need a driveshaft to be shortened. The 904 has a overdrive unit brother called the A-500 and theres a manual 4spd with overdrive.
 
I'm also interested to hear about this. I'm getting ahead of myself but I'm sure in the future I will want a four speed or overdrive.

How much would the MSD stuff be if you installed it yourself? And let us know when you get an idea of the effect on gas mileage.

I really want to squeeze all the economy I can out of my slant.
 
An HEI upgrade with the other things he did is about 100 or less. Just FYI.
833OD manual trans is a good upgrade. The A500 will need a custom bell housing and some body work. Contact (Lou Dart 270) over at slantsix.org as he has done this swap. The only autos that can bolt right up to a slant 6 are the 904 and 727 and ONLY those that were built for it.
Frank
 
The MSD ignition boxs;

6A-6200 http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MSD-6200/ $166
Blaster http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MSD-5900/ $155
Street Fire http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MSD-5520/ $130

Coil, universal use coils;

Cheapest http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MSD-8202/ $36
High vibration http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MSD-8222/ $46
Chrome http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MSD-8200/ $42

Wires;

Do it yourselfers; http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MSD-31179/ $76

I didn't find /6 wires, so, a call to Summit or MSD direct would probably help. Otherwise, I'm not sure if small block wires will fit in there length, but I'm sure big block wires would and you would have 2 extra wires. There only $36 assembled.

This comes to $288 on the high end, $208 on the low end.
 
I installed the HEI module with a 12v epoxy coil and had roughly the same results, nice smooth idle, improved acceleration, easier starts hot and cold. (now if i could just get the choke working )
The a833-OD is probably the easiest for a straight swap, I did mine in a weekend. I had it all laid out on the garage floor prior to the install and swapped in the pedal assembly a couple of weeks before actually pulling the 904.
With the OD 4-speed it runs about 2250RPM at 70MPH and gets about 24mpg last time I checked.
Another thing that helped the ol' slant was to get rid of the stock solid fan setup and switch to an electric fan. The solid setup just put too much drag on the engine, and without the fan running during warm up, it gets up to temp within a mile of driving
 
hellfirechrome said:
So I went to JEGS and bought the MSD 6AL box/coil kit, with BOSCH platinum plugs and new silicone wires, etc. I can honestly say, this is the most striking change I have ever seen in the performance of a slant six! (have had 3). It idles smooth, warms up quick, has even and reliable acceleration, and even has a louder and deepr exhaust note! I have had no cold-morning issues this week (40 degrees?), and it warms up riiiiight to its running temp and stays there. WOW. Anyone wanting a quick way to smooth out your motor's running attributes, THIS is the way! Oh, and $300. Installed. NICE!

Another thing is, I have been leaning toward ridding myself of the stock 904 and moving up to a later transmission with OD from a later slant six car/van. What are my options, as far as trans swaps that will bolt-up to a slant six? I really need better freeway economy (of course carb/headers will help too, that'll happen by June). I'd like to know if there's an AOD that will fit my slant without too much trouble. None of that tailshaft-bolt-on crap for $2700. That's twice what I paid for the car :) Any ideas?

-Hunter
Click to expand...
I have a 74 Scamp with a / - header -4 barrel carb I'm using the 833OD and love it.Piece of advice if your using a header you need to get the ones that have the two seperate collectors in the engine bay.The Z bar will not fit on the single low collector header
 
Well I want to stick with an automatic transmission, so Rumble I suppose that A-500 would be the one for me. Was it ever built to bolt up to a Slant 6? I thought (coulda sworn) I had seen AOD /6 cars before.... I do plan on installing power disc brakes, headers and carb but I don't think I'll have issues with fitment on an AOD transmission. Electric fan is also on the list.... Jegs and Summit have soem good cheap 16" kits that I have played with in the past. With summer coming, that's probably a necessity :)
 
hellfirechrome said:
Well I want to stick with an automatic transmission, so Rumble I suppose that A-500 would be the one for me. Was it ever built to bolt up to a Slant 6? I thought (coulda sworn) I had seen AOD /6 cars before....
Click to expand...

No, re-read above.
 
hellfirechrome said:
Well I want to stick with an automatic transmission, so Rumble I suppose that A-500 would be the one for me. Was it ever built to bolt up to a Slant 6? I thought (coulda sworn) I had seen AOD /6 cars before....
Click to expand...

To use an A-500, you will have to fabricate a crossmember and likely do some cutting/rebuilding of the transmission tunnel. Not to mention finding the (rare) bellhousing adapter to convert to the V-8 bolt pattern and getting your driveshaft shortened. This is not an easy, "bolt-in" conversion.
 
At this point I think this project can wait! Guess it's time to start shopping for intake/headers/carb and s front disc conversion. That is of course, if I don't buy this bulletnose studebaker I am looking at! LOL I have too many cars already.
 
Wait awhile to do the auto OD conversion. Quick time is in the process of making slant six SFI bellhousing adapters. The first one will be for a T-5 trans, which should be available in about 4-6 weeks. The next will be for the Mopar 3, 4 and 4OD manual trans. I was told they will have a belhousing available to bolt a GM 4sp auto OD trans to the slant six. At this time I don't know which trans. The GM trans should be a better fit in the "A" body trans tunnel, then the A-500 trans. Eventually, since their bellhousings are "modular", you should be able to put almost ANY trans behind a slant, including a T-56, Lenco, Jerico, etc.
 
hellfirechrome said:
So I went to JEGS and bought the MSD 6AL box/coil kit, with BOSCH platinum plugs and new silicone wires, etc. I can honestly say, this is the most striking change I have ever seen in the performance of a slant six! (have had 3). It idles smooth, warms up quick, has even and reliable acceleration, and even has a louder and deepr exhaust note! I have had no cold-morning issues this week (40 degrees?), and it warms up riiiiight to its running temp and stays there. WOW. Anyone wanting a quick way to smooth out your motor's running attributes, THIS is the way! Oh, and $300. Installed. NICE!

Another thing is, I have been leaning toward ridding myself of the stock 904 and moving up to a later transmission with OD from a later slant six car/van. What are my options, as far as trans swaps that will bolt-up to a slant six? I really need better freeway economy (of course carb/headers will help too, that'll happen by June). I'd like to know if there's an AOD that will fit my slant without too much trouble. None of that tailshaft-bolt-on crap for $2700. That's twice what I paid for the car :) Any ideas?

-Hunter
Click to expand...

I just installed a MSD 6a and have actually been battling some overheating issues. I'm wondering if my timing might be off. When you switched to the MSD did you have to retard timing at all? Where are you sitting with timing at idle without vacuum?

Thanks in advance!
 
Justin Looney said:
I just installed a MSD 6a and have actually been battling some overheating issues. I'm wondering if my timing might be off. When you switched to the MSD did you have to retard timing at all? Where are you sitting with timing at idle without vacuum?

Thanks in advance!
Click to expand...
Holy back from the dead thread Batman! Did you notice that the thread replied to was 10 years old,,,

Since you have timing issues,,,
It is not uncommon for the rubber ring in the damper to disintegrate with time and allow the timing ring where the marker is to slip. Do you know how to use a piston stop tool to determine if the indicated TDC is correct?
 
my68barracuda said:
Holy back from the dead thread Batman! Did you notice that the thread replied to was 10 years old,,,

Since you have timing issues,,,
It is not uncommon for the rubber ring in the damper to disintegrate with time and allow the timing ring where the marker is to slip. Do you know how to use a piston stop tool to determine if the indicated TDC is correct?
Click to expand...

Yup I did know that lol

Trying to find people who have hands on experience with MSD on a slant. Yeah I'm aware on how to find TDC, I'm trying to find out what others have set their initial timing to to have a jumping off point.
 
my68barracuda said:
I have a MSD 6 box on my slant, There is nothing tricky about that combo.
Click to expand...
For the initial timing 5 to 10 degrees advanced with no vacuum or mechanical would be a safe place to start and may easily be where you end up.
If you have a cam with a large overlap that results in a lot of egr going back into the cylinders at idle try running the vacuum advance on manifold vacuum. That will add ignition advance at idle and can help to improve the idle quality. Most stock builds will run the vacuum advance on ported vacuum.
 
my68barracuda said:
For the initial timing 5 to 10 degrees advanced with no vacuum or mechanical would be a safe place to start and may easily be where you end up.
If you have a cam with a large overlap that results in a lot of egr going back into the cylinders at idle try running the vacuum advance on manifold vacuum. That will add ignition advance at idle and can help to improve the idle quality. Most stock builds will run the vacuum advance on ported vacuum.
Click to expand...

Thank you so much. I will try some adjustments tomorrow. Right now it is currently at TDC without vacuum or mechanical. Hopefully adjusting the timing a bit will help the overheating issue.

Honestly it's hard for me to tell if the timing is off at all, the AFR looks ok, about 13 at idle. Sounds about as ok as a slant can sound, ie noisy as hell. But a steady idle.

I've already replaced everything on the cooling side except for the radiator, new spark plugs, and new oil, so now starting to figure out what else could be causing heat issues.
 
And I forgot I only answered one of your initial questions, yes I did realize this was another thread, no I do not know how to use a piston stop tool.

I did buy one though, thinking I would have to look at this one day.
 
Can you help me trying to put msd 6al can't figure out which wires do I connect to power 12 volt
IMG_20201010_171140774.jpg
IMG_20201010_113905309.jpg
 
Justin Looney said:
And I forgot I only answered one of your initial questions, yes I did realize this was another thread, no I do not know how to use a piston stop tool.

I did buy one though, thinking I would have to look at this one day.
Click to expand...

to uses a piston stop tool to verify the damper marker is still accurate

1) remove all six spark plugs, that will make it easier to rotate the engine by hand
2) install the piston stop tool in the #1 cylinder spark plug bore. With a stock slant, because the pistons recession is so deep you will likely need to have the piston stop tool fully extended.
3) using hand power, rotate the engine fully clockwise till it stops by having the #1 piston being against the piston stop tool. Make a mark on the damper in line with the TDC mark on the timing tab.
4) using hand power, rotate the engine fully counter clockwise till it stops by having the #1 piston being against the piston stop tool. Make a mark on the damper in line with the TDC mark on the timing tab.
5) a line placed on the damper in the center of the marks made in steps 3 and 4 will be the true TDC. If the 'center mark' aligns within a small error ( +- 1 degree) of the damper OE timing mark, your damper is fine for engine timing purposes. If it is off by 2 degrees or more the damper ring has either slipped or is in error in other ways.

with the engine in the car it can be difficult to accurately measure the center distance of the two marks. I have used a section of bendable wire or a length of solder bent to match the damper radius then carefully sized to length as an aid in that process. Get the aid the right length and then take it to your work bench to accurately find the center. Mark the center on the aid then compare to the damper marks...
 
akavaliant1 said:
Can you help me trying to put msd 6al can't figure out which wires do I connect to power 12 volt View attachment 1715610226 View attachment 1715610228
Click to expand...

The two wires providing power in to the ballast resistor are used to switch on the MSD box. You will disconnect them from the ballast resistor, twist the two wires together, as one provides current in the key crank position and one provides power in the key run position. The ballast resistor will no longer be used.
You need a separate fused 12v power line from the battery, alternator output, or other steady 12V source to provide running power to the MSD box.
 
Last edited:
Ok some quick updates.

I wasn't having much luck withe the piston stop tool, couldn't get it extended far enough it seemed, so I used a whistle instead. Whistle stops about 5 deg BTDC mark so it might be close enough? Hard to get it exact.

Spark plug gapped to .045

Timing is set to about 11 ATDC and it looks like with vacuum line in, I have about 20 deg total timing. Although with vacuum unplugged the total timing doesn't appear to change.

My issue is that the temp still seems to slowly climb. I thought timing was my issue. If it's at 190 deg and I start the car, the temp comes down a little and then goes right back up. I turn it off around 202. Pretty sure I got all the air out, after it cools off some I'll go open up the cap and see if any more air comes out.

New oil, water pump, 180 deg thermostat, coolant, hoses. It wasn't overheating before the sniper and msd addition which is why I thought it was timing but now I don't know.

Open to suggestions here.
 
Are you verifying engine temps with a non contact thermometer?
Those are typically accurate, but it could have drifted.
Put a pot of water on the stove and bring it to a boil, put a metal spoon or something similar in the pot so a piece of the metal is out of the boiling water.
Check the temp, should be about 212 F
 
my68barracuda said:
Are you verifying engine temps with a non contact thermometer?
Those are typically accurate, but it could have drifted.
Put a pot of water on the stove and bring it to a boil, put a metal spoon or something similar in the pot so a piece of the metal is out of the boiling water.
Check the temp, should be about 212 F
Click to expand...

I was actually just going off of the temp guage on the sniper.

I do have a non contact thermometer but not sure where the most accurate place on the car to shoot it.
 
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