My First 318 Rebuild

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HTMLmopars

HTMLmopars

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Skagit County, WA
So if any of y'all have been following along with my "cheap" cam swap, you know that the cam went flat and put a bunch of metal thru my motor. So I'm planning on pulling the motor out this weekend and tearing it down. I have a couple of options for "while I'm there" projects because even though I'm trying to stay on a budget, I'm still gonna try and hotrod the motor if I have the opportunity. Plus if I'm spending the money to rebuild it, I'm willing to commit to this engine longer term than i was initially planning on. I will continue the camshaft thread with trying to track down the failure mode and put most information about the junk cam in that thread.
cold feet about potential bad lifters
I am trying to buy a .030 over block over marketplace (hopefully the guy hasnt sold it yet) because if I need to bore the block to clean up the walls (very likely the case) this engine is more economical, it comes with pistons. I'll keep you updated if I buy it.
Originally for the rebuild I was going to go for a roller cam conversion planning on sourcing from Hughes engines. But my coworker pointed out that if I want to, I can reuse the stock cam that I pulled (I did organize the lifters when they came out) and build the engine around the stock cam so I can get back on the road quicker and cheaper.
I guess this thread is to have open questions that I can't find answers to in rebuild books and fsm as well as asking to be pointed to any threads about oiling mods or little things to do while I have the engine fully disassembled.
Also, if anyone in western WA, hell even eastern WA or northern OR has a good 318/273 shortblock that they want to sell me for less than $1k I might be interested.
 
Murray said:
"Hotrod" and "Budget" don't go together.
Click to expand...
They can if you can do most of the work yourself and shop around, and also if you don't have to have all the big name parts. You can have a fun car without breaking your bank account. Research on what's needed to help you achieve your goal. Not everyone needs 10.5:1, and a 850 Holley and fully ported aftermarket heads.
 
68Valiant225 said:
So if any of y'all have been following along with my "cheap" cam swap, you know that the cam went flat and put a bunch of metal thru my motor. So I'm planning on pulling the motor out this weekend and tearing it down. I have a couple of options for "while I'm there" projects because even though I'm trying to stay on a budget, I'm still gonna try and hotrod the motor if I have the opportunity. Plus if I'm spending the money to rebuild it, I'm willing to commit to this engine longer term than i was initially planning on. I will continue the camshaft thread with trying to track down the failure mode and put most information about the junk cam in that thread.
cold feet about potential bad lifters
I am trying to buy a .030 over block over marketplace (hopefully the guy hasnt sold it yet) because if I need to bore the block to clean up the walls (very likely the case) this engine is more economical, it comes with pistons. I'll keep you updated if I buy it.
Originally for the rebuild I was going to go for a roller cam conversion planning on sourcing from Hughes engines. But my coworker pointed out that if I want to, I can reuse the stock cam that I pulled (I did organize the lifters when they came out) and build the engine around the stock cam so I can get back on the road quicker and cheaper.
I guess this thread is to have open questions that I can't find answers to in rebuild books and fsm as well as asking to be pointed to any threads about oiling mods or little things to do while I have the engine fully disassembled.
Also, if anyone in western WA, hell even eastern WA or northern OR has a good 318/273 shortblock that they want to sell me for less than $1k I might be interested.
Click to expand...


There are some how-to articles to help walk you through a rebuild... I have not been able to finish them, but got as far as the short block assembly...

Start with this one and go through the series:

How to Rebuild a Small Block Part 1: Block Prep
 
68Valiant225 said:
So if any of y'all have been following along with my "cheap" cam swap, you know that the cam went flat and put a bunch of metal thru my motor. So I'm planning on pulling the motor out this weekend and tearing it down. I have a couple of options for "while I'm there" projects because even though I'm trying to stay on a budget, I'm still gonna try and hotrod the motor if I have the opportunity. Plus if I'm spending the money to rebuild it, I'm willing to commit to this engine longer term than i was initially planning on. I will continue the camshaft thread with trying to track down the failure mode and put most information about the junk cam in that thread.
cold feet about potential bad lifters
I am trying to buy a .030 over block over marketplace (hopefully the guy hasnt sold it yet) because if I need to bore the block to clean up the walls (very likely the case) this engine is more economical, it comes with pistons. I'll keep you updated if I buy it.
Originally for the rebuild I was going to go for a roller cam conversion planning on sourcing from Hughes engines. But my coworker pointed out that if I want to, I can reuse the stock cam that I pulled (I did organize the lifters when they came out) and build the engine around the stock cam so I can get back on the road quicker and cheaper.
I guess this thread is to have open questions that I can't find answers to in rebuild books and fsm as well as asking to be pointed to any threads about oiling mods or little things to do while I have the engine fully disassembled.
Also, if anyone in western WA, hell even eastern WA or northern OR has a good 318/273 shortblock that they want to sell me for less than $1k I might be interested.
Click to expand...
I could build you a fully machined and assembled short block and ship it to you!
 
Slantsix64 said:
Honestly I do everything on a budget, I would suggest just grab a later magnum block, even in stock form they have better heads bigger valves better camshaft better compression roller camshaft (no break in needed, no zinc) trust me you will be way ahead of the game. Magnum Swap -your source for Mopar engine swap information.
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A budget doesn't mean ZERO budget, it just means I'm paying attention to the numbers. I got a little excited about building a higher perf motor, but you're probably right Magnum is the way to go. I have a 5.9 mag in my dad's garage that I might be able to borrow, but that means new converter, oil pan, timing cover and maybe motor mounts? The engine swap site focuses on 360s so I wasn't exactly clear on differences between LA and Mag 318s. Can I just use my current timing cover, converter and oil pan to convert a 318 mag to work? I do know that I need to address the fuel pump eccentric, as well as intake manifold.
 
A good 5.9 can be done realistically and inexpensive pretty well. Improve the breathing in and out hen select a reasonable cam to run with it’s 9.0-1 ratio. Stock heads can use the Hughes engine trick spring kit. They really do make for an excellent street/street strip engine even without a head swap.
 
IDK what happened to my reply…. But take two, perhaps a little shorter of a version

Oh! There it is.. jeeezzzeee, like a pending approval was needed I waited to see it for a good bit… LMAO
 
The 318 and magnum are balanced differently. You can use your 318 Torque converter if you use the magnum flexplate.
You wont be able to use a mechanical fuel pump with the magnum either.

Personally I would go the magnum route also. I did that in my 72 Charger after the 318 spun a rod bearing. I am very pleased with it.
 
Since the engine is to be torn down, the very first thing I would do, not even think about, is getting rid of those low-compression slugs.
Knowing what I now know, I would just call up somebody .............
like one of the FABO builders, one of whom already spoke up, and be back in action in no time.
Putting the engine together is not that expensive.
Receiving your parts back from the local machine shop, poorly machined, will quickly send your budget spinning and destroys you confidence, and probably stretch your time way outta whack.
Pick up the phone, co-design your engine, set a time limit, open up yur wallet, wait. Use your time for doing things you are better qualified to do, maybe even for cash. I bet your wife has a long honey-do list, which usually ends well for you, even if you at least just try.
Let your builder take care of the details. If the block is not decked right, for example, He will catch it and fix it BEFORE it ever leaves the shop; saving you mucho time and money. The cylinder bores will be straight and round, and the fits of the pistons and rings, just right. You won't be sitting in your cold garage filing rings until midnight.
The daymn oil plugs will be installed, ALL of them and the rear cam plug will be glued in so it can't pop out when you pressure test the CC for pressure loss. All these things add up. details details; the Builder has a list. When you get it back, you drop it in, add your bolt-ons and install the fluids. In a few hours you twist the key, break in the cam, and just drive it! no worries.
That peace of mind has got to be worth something. just cough it up,already, help make America great again.
 
I appreciate all the input that people have thrown up for me. With my searching for parts, and not knowing where a good "we pull" scrapyard is around me, I decided to buy a .020" over 318 shortblock, with kb pistons. It's got all the machine work done on the bottom end, freeze plugs, cam bearings, paint, etc. It hasn't been decked yet, but I dont mind that because I need to supply my own heads and if I can spec the machining to the deck surface then I can get CR dialed in exactly where I want it. I'm getting the block on saturday and I'll keep y'all updated on where things are going.
 
don't forget,
smarter men than me
have said that Quench in the range of .050 to .080 may be detonation-prone.
Actually, that's Squish, but everybody has been calling it Quench for the last few years.....
 
AJ/FormS said:
don't forget,
smarter men than me
have said that Quench in the range of .050 to .080 may be detonation-prone.
Actually, that's Squish, but everybody has been calling it Quench for the last few years.....
Click to expand...
On that note, what do you generally like to see in piston to head clearance range? I think the old MP Books suggested .045 piston to head didn’t they? How tight do you think could you safely go with old school style TRW/Speed Pro pistons?
 
Garrett Ellison said:
what do you generally like to see in piston to head clearance range
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I don't build engines for others, so I cannot answer that.
I have heard Smarter men than me have suggested .040 to no more than 050.

I can only tell you what works for me.
I have been to .028 with KB107s at zero-deck, OOTB eddies, with an .028 gasket; no contact. Do I recommend it? No. I had no problems except the gasket gave up at 11.0 Scr. So I decked the block, popped the pistons up out of the hole and ran the .039 FelPros, now with a Q of ~.032/.034.
That was in about 2004.
So far the FelPros are doing well.
I can also tell you that I have never had an engine be as responsive as that one was. Can it be traced to the tight-Q, or the 11.0 Scr/ 9.0Dcr, the 185psi CCP (with the 223/230/110 Hughes cam), or to the tune; IDK; but what a super combo that was.
If I had to guess, I'd say .032 is better than good enough.

There was a guy here a few months ago that claimed to be running .020 and I think he said something about kissing the heads was a good thing.
 
AJ/FormS said:
There was a guy here a few months ago that claimed to be running .020 and I think he said something about kissing the heads was a good thing.
Click to expand...
:eek:
I could do that in my projected build I've started to piece together, but think I'm going to keep at around .040 to make sure things get along when they play together.
 
.028 is common...uh huh

Aj's quench distance seems to get tighter everytime he tells the story...perhaps even barowed from someone elses post of what they did.. I bet money you can look up that distance in the search and find it wasn't him who originally said it.
 
MOPAROFFICIAL said:
.028 is common...uh huh .
Click to expand...
like I said;
I can only tell you what worked for me.
about this, vv vv, wth are you talking about?
MOPAROFFICIAL said:
Aj's quench distance seems to get tighter everytime he tells the story...perhaps even barowed from someone elses post of what they did.. I bet money you can look up that distance in the search and find it wasn't him who originally said it.
Click to expand...

Everybody wants a piece of old AJ; that's ok, there is plenty of me to go around. You can have a choice piece of my left buttcheek.
 
Update: on Saturday I picked up a .020 over 318 block with a TON of parts for it. None of it assembled, but it has new cam bearings and came with basically everything you need to build an engine. Came with kb167 pistons, as well as stock replacement pistons, both .020 over. Aluminum intake manifold, mystery small block headers, b body oil pan, freeze plugs. Everything except heads, including rocker assemblies.
Now I need to pull cylinder heads off the old motor, cc the combustion chambers and start blueprinting this engine. Once I know where my CR is going to land, I'll call Oregon cam grinders and figure out what I'm doing with the cam. I'm not throwing away the idea of doing a roller conversion, mostly because I want the peace of mind, and also that those kb pistons probably deserve a healthy cam.
 
Alright, after a longer hiatus than expected, I'm back to actually building this engine. I was chatting with my coworker and he was saying that I should get the heads gone through by a machine shop. I've gotten them disassembled except for 2 exhaust valves on each head. These all won't go through the guides without significant force, so I haven't removed them.
The heads are off my 69 318 block, and never had any problem other than stem seals, they cc out to 60, which gets me close to my compression goal.
What steps are necessary for basic refresh of heads, as well as what would be "best to do" but not required? Links to threads I haven't found are great, no need to rehash stuff that I can read somewhere else.
Trying to stay budget conscious so anything I can do on my own I would like to do
 
Well. The basics should be well covered here as well as inexpensive to very expensive modifications.

So why even ask?

I believe that if you just tell the machinist what your after or what you want after your thorough reading here and elsewhere, he can do the work for you just fine.

Sorry for the semi rehashing.
 
Fair enough. On the specific topic of the valves, they seem to be getting caught up near the keeper groove. I don't see any obvious burrs or anything. Should I just hit them with some emery cloth until they slide out ok?
 
68Valiant225 said:
Fair enough. On the specific topic of the valves, they seem to be getting caught up near the keeper groove. I don't see any obvious burrs or anything. Should I just hit them with some emery cloth until they slide out ok?
Click to expand...

Just use a fine file turning the valve on the OD where it is hanging up. Start at the valve tip and don't go below where it is hanging up.
 
Got the valves all out, I wasn't patient enough with the first valve I did and definitely hurt the guide, some bronze came out with the valve and it took too much force to pull (hindsight is 20-20). I got the valves cleaned up pretty good and am planning on reusing them if possible, but am not sure exactly what I'm looking for in terms of what valve wouldn't be worth re-installing.
 
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