New eagle rods or refurbish originals?

Small Block Mopar Engine

  1. Rockerdude

    Rockerdude Rock n' Roll and A-bodies FABO Gold Member

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    I'm putting a mid 70s 360 together and I was wondering if I should have the stock rods resized/new bolts and ground to weigh the same or just go for a set of eagle I beams for $250. Pros/cons of both? Thanks!
     
  2. RustyRatRod

    RustyRatRod Bla de blizhibliz de blatde blizi bla bla FABO Gold Member

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    Go for the Eagles. You only live once.
     
  3. 70aarcuda

    70aarcuda Master Hoader of SBM FABO Gold Member

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  4. krazykuda

    krazykuda Well-Known Member FABO Gold Member How-To Section Editor

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    It's cheaper to buy new rods than to buy new rod bolts and recondition the stock rods.

    However, the stock rods have oil squirt holes that help lube the bores. The new rods don't...

    "they" claim that "they" did testing and you don't need the squirt holes for the new rods.

    I prefer not to prove them wrong with MY engine on MY DIME! If you are one of those who prefer to have the squirt holes, then it's only about $40 more to have new bolts installed in the stock rods and have them reconditioned. (Make sure to get the proper rod bearings with the hole for the squirt holes also - they make them both ways).
     
  5. rumblefish360

    rumblefish360 So close, yet so far away FABO Gold Member

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    I agree with post 1, 2 and in no particular order ether. Karl's comment (oiling) I have not seen an issue with anywhere.
    New and cheaper rods that are stronger just makes sense.
     
  6. 70aarcuda

    70aarcuda Master Hoader of SBM FABO Gold Member

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    got a set of non squirting rods in a 360 since 2006.....that see just over 7000 rpms....in fact i got 4 360s with non squirting rods...another one since 2007....

    so to squirt or non to squirt....glad we are not talking about women...
     
  7. Rockerdude

    Rockerdude Rock n' Roll and A-bodies FABO Gold Member

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    Giggity.
     
  8. forphorty

    forphorty Well-Known Member

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  9. moper

    moper FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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    Personally I don't mind using the factory stuff in a mild build. Stick bolts in them, have them resized. The weight matching is part of the balancing process. If you're running a factory type piston you can save if this is not being internally balanced by leaving factory rods alone. You will have to pay for balancing that way. If it's being balabced it won't matter what rod you use really, but mopar rods are over-designed from the factory. IMO there's no need for stronger in something that's not going to stress them.
     
  10. thesiren74

    thesiren74 Well-Known Member

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    If it's mild just use factory .
     
  11. stroked340

    stroked340 FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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    Go with the Eagles got a set in my 360 pretty much mild build..
     
  12. flyfish

    flyfish C8H18+N2O = :-D

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    I agree, I have Scat I-beams in my motor as well, much stronger than the Eagles mainly due to the steel.

    On the oil holes vs. no oil holes thing....My rods don't have them (obviously, they're Scat I-beams), and I've been beating on this motor since 2009. I just took the bottom end apart last weekend to inspect the bearings (while I was replacing my oil pan) and everything looks great. Just make sure you put the rods in the right way and you're good to go (they are directional).
     
  13. skrews

    skrews Well-Known Member

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    Another vote for the SCAT I beams. Hands down the best rod for the money.
     
  14. perfacar

    perfacar Well-Known Member

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    the stock mopar rod is very capable piece. its strong enough for most builds. if you change rods, then rebalance is required, adds to cost of job. original rods don't require rebalance. most resized rods are about $90 to resize and $60 for bolts. new rods @ $250 plus balance @ $250 = $500. hmmm must be new math??
     
  15. skrews

    skrews Well-Known Member

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    Apples to oranges.
     
  16. RustyRatRod

    RustyRatRod Bla de blizhibliz de blatde blizi bla bla FABO Gold Member

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    I agree 100% and I usually always recommend reusing the stock pieces. They are excellent. I tell you what. You show me where you can get a balance job done for 250. You haven't seen the price of Mallory metal lately, have you? 250 would probably barely cover the cost of the metal itself.

    Get a load of this:

    http://www.summitracing.com/parts/hrs-calchd1125/overview/

    Balancing usually takes between 2 and 4 of those. lol

    Makin reworked stock rods look better and better.

    I just jumped on the bandwagon early because I knew what most would say. "Use aftermarket rods", so far be it for me to argue.

    It doesn't matter which you use, Scat or Eagle. They are both imported chinkesium. I would rather have an older American rod in almost anything up to about 500 HP or so. Under that, I'd never worry about stock rods.

    To me, there are better things to spend money on with a mild to moderate build.

    But who the heck am I and what do I know? Nuthin, evidently. lol
     
  17. DFX 340 Duster

    DFX 340 Duster FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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    Soooo, out of pure curiosity, what alloy are the stock rods?
     
  18. j par

    j par Well-hung Member

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    Watch "Duster vs duster" on YouTube
    Duster vs duster: [ame]https://youtu.be/FHvu2QHJi10[/ame] think I'll have to agree with triple R on the Mallory. I would have to check my bill but I'm sure it was at least $200 in Mallory on top of the balance job itself.
    but here we go again one thing leads to another either go all stock or go all out. I mean great rods and regular pistons? great pistons and stock crank? What my builder told me only rings so true now when it's running great you'll forget every penny you spend on it! and I'm here to tell you when I was laying down that 11 second quarter mile last weekend I forgot every penny I paid! :burnout::cheer
     
  19. 1qwikScamp

    1qwikScamp Well-Known Member

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    If you run a set of eagle or scat rods they will certainly be lighter than the factory rods so you will have to tale weight off of the crank not add to it i would say a capable shop could do it pretty cheap a good balance job is a must in any new build in my opinion. I personally have scat I beams in my 408 no issues at all and I'm building another 360 with a set of eagles I picked up at a swap meet they look to be outstanding quality
     
  20. stroked340

    stroked340 FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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    I have them in my estimated 400 h.p. 360,i wouldn't use them in anything making real power ie: 500 or more found out the hard way,definately WON'T be using them in the "new" stroker build..
     
  21. 70aarcuda

    70aarcuda Master Hoader of SBM FABO Gold Member

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    I have a set of the scat I beams in our 71 Duster..with the Ross pistons...I should have internally balanced it ...but I did not.....I don't have the balance sheet in front of me as I am at work...but they needed to remove quite a bit of weight from the crank...

    stock piston 581 grams...ross 484 100 x 8....800 grams lighter
    stock rods 745 grams...scat 1 beams 590... 8 x 155 grams....1240 grams..
    yes..some is rotating..and some is reciprocating...almost 4 1/2 lbs..

    that 360 really zings the rpm.....after running 10.7s in vegas now...probably in the 1040s at sea level....still need to change out cam...

    the last crank in my 73 Duster I had internally balanced and the Mallory was 200 bucks for 4 slugs..

    as someone says..pick your parts...and spend your money

    and with H beams..I have found different weights...630 grams..660 grams..680 grams...and 745 grams....the latter probably would not require rebalancing with stock weight pistons like the HP116CP Seal Powers.
     
  22. 340GTSDart

    340GTSDart Well-Known Member

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    This was the case with my engine. Ross pistons and H Beam Eagle rods - my crankshaft counterweights looked like swiss cheese with all of the holes drilled to offset for the lighter piston/rod assemblies.
     
  23. Rockerdude

    Rockerdude Rock n' Roll and A-bodies FABO Gold Member

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    Very interesting info. The pistons I'm going to be using are Speedpro Hypers, I'm curious now with an eagle floating pin rod what the total weight will be compaired to stock. I have a gram scale in the garage somewhere, so I will be able to check. Now Im curious, are new rods (like eagle I beams) at least within a gram of each other out of the box? What about the Speedpros? I guess Im going to find out.
     
  24. RustyRatRod

    RustyRatRod Bla de blizhibliz de blatde blizi bla bla FABO Gold Member

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    I'm guessing that's your machinist's job since you will have to balance it, so out of the box weight is a waste of brain power, really.
     
  25. pishta

    pishta I know I'm right....

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    I found a guy that balances all kinds of stuff: Boat props, stators, industrial stuff, etc. Not just cranks. He quoted me $75 to balance a crank (plus heavy metal if needed) if I gave him a piston/rod/ring pack/bearing (I said I could equalize all that stuff to match so he wouldnt have to) also said to bring him the flexplate and balancer to check out. He balances to 1/2 gram. I was very suprised he was so cheap (usually I get ~175 quote handing him all the parts to balance) but he says he has so much regular work that his volume keeps the price down. Aftermarket rods are usually lighter than overbuilt 100K warranty stockers so you are removing metal, not adding. 360's are adding metal if you are internally balancing them with a neutral balancer. I bought a set of MP stroker cast pistons and they were +- 12g out of the box, thats bad. I had to take material out of the wrist pin on the heavier ones since therre was not enough material in the piston to remove.
     
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