Problems ethanol causes in vintage cars?

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DA69RT GT

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Interesting- we've had ethanol in our fuel for at least 20 years around here. I hadn't touched a fuel system component (other than the filter) on my '67 barracuda for 30 years, until I replaced the fuel sender, fuel pump and all the rubber hoses last year. None of the hoses seemed degraded, fuel pump replacement was just-in-case, not due to failure. Clearly, YMMV.
 
IMO the hoopla with the corroding properties of ethanol are way over estimated. Its not a huge deal. Simply evolve with the times and upgrade the failing parts to ethanol resistant parts.
 
IMO the hoopla with the corroding properties of ethanol are way over estimated. Its not a huge deal. Simply evolve with the times and upgrade the failing parts to ethanol resistant parts.


Not in the small engine marketplace. I repair small engines, lawn mowers and such as a hobby. I can tell you first hand that ethanol in gas boogers up the entire fuel system in anything with a small engine. It completely disintergrates fuel lines and gums up carburetors. The only brand I have seen that it does not mess with is Stihl. I did not know why until recently. I learned that Stihl has been using ethanol friendly fuel system parts and gaskets for better than 20 years. I knew there was a reason I bought Stihl stuff.
 
..e-10 is at the edge, e-15 will likely have an effect on some older stuff.
 
I can't keep a weed eater or blower motor running properly the last five years or so. If they run the little fuel pump priming ball starts leaking. Fix that then next thing I know it will only run with the chock on. I know it has to do with todays fuel. I'm doing away with those problems and buying electric. Yes it sucks to drag a cord around but it beats working on the small engines all the time or charging batteries

Also had the stainless braided hose on one of the race cars I worked on recently that only lasted two years before it started leaking. Replaced that and all the other fuel lines for safety at the same time. In the previous twenty five years I don't ever recall a stainless braided line going bad and leaking. Caused by todays fuel? I think it was.
 
Yea it is gettin pretty rediculous I have rebuilt the carb on my weed eater 7 or 8 times and 2 times on my lawn mower not to mention how much hose I have replaced.
Another bad thing about ethanol fuels is if they sit in the tank of your car it can seperate and then you go to start the car and you suck basically water through the system.
I will stick to payin a little more for non ethanol fuel and when that goes away aviation gas.
 
i have to replace fuel lines here in AZ every year... the heat makes it worse but i have never had to replace the trans rubber lines...

i even spring for the teflon lined injection hose, the stuff with blue liner... had it split in a month... only running 6.5psi...
 
I call the stuff jokenol and avoid it as much as I can. The real problem is when water gets in with the gas with jokenol and then the jokenol attaches to the water and becomes corrosive. In motorcycle carbs the mixture will leach the copper from brass jets and then deposit green stuff all over the inside. It is very hard to remove and the carb jst is ruined. That is why you have to use the choke to get the engine to run as the primary jet that controls low speed is shot.

The jokenol is a national disaster brought on by crooked politicians and lobbyists from cargill, ADM, MON and others. The fed guv should end ALL subsidies and remove the biofuel requirements.

The blue 100LL aviation gas is also going away as soon as they can find a replacement such as 92UL. I built the engine for my plane with low comp pistons so I could run 87 unleaded and just load up when I find a good deal on clean non-jokenol fuel.
 
where it really has cost money is in the snow machine, personal watercraft, and outboard motor owners. If your 5hp lawn motor gets buggered up it just is hard to start or runs rough. Your 115 hp Seadoo goes lean and eats it's pistons.

it also is costing millions of extra gallons to be burned as it costs most cars at least 2mpg in economy.

3rd world countries are literally starving to death while we put their food into our gas tanks. Nice.
 
"Deathanol". I have the mobile app put out by www.pure-gas.org and I use it when I'm getting close to needing fuel. Even with all fuel system components upgraded to d'ethanol tolerant materials (except the carburetor castings which can't be upgraded and are subject to corrosion), I have an objection to tax money subsidizing the d'ethanol industry so the price of a gallon (or litre) of diluted fuel, containing 3-4% less energy than pure gasoline, is artificially made to look no higher than the price of uncontaminated gasoline, all while distorting the market prices and availability of um, like, important stuff like, um, FOOD.
 
Not in the small engine marketplace. I repair small engines, lawn mowers and such as a hobby. I can tell you first hand that ethanol in gas boogers up the entire fuel system in anything with a small engine. It completely disintergrates fuel lines and gums up carburetors. The only brand I have seen that it does not mess with is Stihl. I did not know why until recently. I learned that Stihl has been using ethanol friendly fuel system parts and gaskets for better than 20 years. I knew there was a reason I bought Stihl stuff.

but those are engines that arent started often, The same thing happens with my ATV's if i don't use a stabilizer(which a lot of people seem to neglect)
 
"Deathanol". I have the mobile app put out by www.pure-gas.org and I use it when I'm getting close to needing fuel. Even with all fuel system components upgraded to d'ethanol tolerant materials (except the carburetor castings which can't be upgraded and are subject to corrosion), I have an objection to tax money subsidizing the d'ethanol industry so the price of a gallon (or litre) of diluted fuel, containing 3-4% less energy than pure gasoline, is artificially made to look no higher than the price of uncontaminated gasoline, all while distorting the market prices and availability of um, like, important stuff like, um, FOOD.

Isnt that why we(aside from the flip flopping right apparently) are trying to go to algae based ethanols?

and IMO the second there is a reasonable infrastructure, all my rides are going ethanol powered. So i can give the finger to backwards theocracies. :finga:
 
Wow I had no idea!!
I have the same problems with my lawn equipment and ATV's primer bulbs dnt last, running with chokes on slightly...Always rebuilding carburators. I always buy my gas 87 octane from the ethanol place down the street..Seems like in any engine you dnt use on a daily basis you HAVE to use Stabil or its all gummed up
I go to a different gas station and buy high octane non ethanol gas for hot rods and Motorcycles and never have carb issues, Let em sit for 6 months and no problem. Just thought it was the octane
 
Yep my 115hp seahorse Johnson needs another carb rebuild due to this stuff... I notice a difference in the swinger too when I run the good stuff, seems to run better and get better millage (although only slightly)
 
Sta Bil has a good product recently put on the shelves. It has ETHANOL in big letters on the label. It's also not red in color like the regular Sta Bil. It is supposed to keep the fuel system protected from ethanol. Word is it works well.
 
Sta Bil has a good product recently put on the shelves. It has ETHANOL in big letters on the label. It's also not red in color like the regular Sta Bil. It is supposed to keep the fuel system protected from ethanol. Word is it works well.

Yup. Dark blue-green in color. I use it in my cars not driven much, and in my tiller. It seems to slow down the d'ethanol damage. We'll see how the tiller starts up this autumn!
 
Listen, by my records, I've rebuilt or cleaned over 4000 carburetors in my life as a motorcycle mechanic. This problem was in full effect over a decade ago when I started: You leave it sit for a month, you're asking for trouble, you leave sit 60 days, and jets are plugging. The fuel turns to varnish, and you're cleaning a carb. Use Sta-bil, and you're not. This 60-days business was 1998-1999 when motorcycle EFI was rare and mandatory E10 was a decade away.

But this talk of "separating out" and "eating fuel lines"...bullpucky.
#1. If you have enough water in your gas for it to separate out, you got other MAJOR issues (See Heet comment below)
#2. Go buy some fuel line from your favorite local parts whorehouse and leave it sit on the shelf for a month or two. Unless it says "Gates", it's probably dry-rotting and cracked in 60 days, no fuel required. Happens to me anytime I buy it (I don't buy it anymore) no matter if it comes from O'reilly's, Autozone, almost anyone. I go to Carquest, and I buy name brand only.

Leaching the copper out of Brass? Seriously? If you believe that, I've got a bridge I'll sell you. Better yet, a stature of some broad holding a golden flame and a tablet that's made ENTIRELY out of copper. She's been outdoors in the acid rain for years, still standing tall. All those water lines that they like to steal around my 'hood? Copper. Most of the water fitting in your sink? Brass. And they're rated for methanol and ethanol, too. Just go look at your grand-daddies' still. Copper...and I'll tell you something; I've not seen a carb full of green goo since E10 was mandatory.
I have seen (and own, actually) carburetors that are riddled with holes where the standing water corroded the zinc out of the aluminum. I've never seen a jet that had holes where it wasn't supposed to. Never.

Guys...you know what you put in your fuel tank when you get water in it? Heet. Go crack open a bottle and waft the fumes to your nostril: It's alcohol. It's what suspends water in your fuel so that your engine can suck it down without drowning. Heet's been on the market since our grandpappies were paying a nickel for a gallon of E0. No carburetor-dissolving complaints that I ever heard of.

I have carb problems with my lawnmowers and saws, too. So I use Stabil and the problems go away. I don't know how it works, but it does, and the "E10 ruined my car" stuff? It's a load of crap. I run the EFI fuel lines because it's superior and I don't sit back and take cheap boolsheet rubber hose that most parts stores hand out. I've looked at the carb kits on my shelf for the lawmower and they dry-rot just like the fuel lines do. Hmmm....how long has it been since the US started outsourcing almost everything to China? Where was that carb kit made? Hey, wait a minute....
I KNOW the E10 is not hurting my car, and the parts that are not made here go to hell in a handbasket...maybe there's something to that? ;) Also: We've been economic dire straights going on 4 years now. Companies are cutting back and getting the cheaper stuff because the markets are a lot less competitive; people can't afford to be picky. The quality of parts over the last few years has gone down. Sad fact: You don't get the cream of the crop during a recession.

Side note: Try running premium and suddenly a lot of carb issues go away? Why? Because the fuel companies know that premium doesn't move like regular fuel does...and they can't afford for it to go bad. So they do whatever they do to keep it from going bad. Try it. I spend about $1 more a year for my lawnmower fuel (Boohoo I'm going broke) and it's not going bad in a season.

That's not saying I am thoroughly in love with E10. The economy drop blows, and yeah, it's bumping food prices. That happens with any major change in things. Ask the next hot girl from Brazil you meet (about her native countries' fuel preferences, not pubic trimmings) and she'll talk to you about E-fuel and how it's not that expensive (relatively speaking) because their economy grew around it. That's what will happen here. You want jobs? Go to where the change is. You can't have your cornbread and eat it too. (For the record, change sucks and I don't like it either, but it's a way of life)

Frankly, the only corn-based food I eat regularly is corn, and I avoid corn-syrup containing food, so my food budget hasn't gone up much, but I agree with Dan, it's not the best thing we could be doing with our food.

I like E85. It's cheap race gas. Build your motor accordingly and go wicked fast for less, but the sob-stories about E10? Look elsewhere, it's not the fuel.
 
Ethanol replaces the chemical MTBE that was used in gas, and have been finding in our drinking water. It is bad for the human body. So ethanol will make gas alittle safer. DDGS is left over after ethanol is made and is a very high protein feed source for livestock. It is about 30% protein vs 9% corn. About 30%-25% of a bushel of corn comes back in DDGS.
 
Interesting post by jos51700.

As I said earlier, I don't see where E10 has caused me any problems with my '67 Barracuda. I have seen fuel problems with small engines, like mowers, trimmers, etc. Whenever I'd take these to a service shop, I'd hear about how "the bad gas we have these days" was causing problems. I've been hearing about "the bad gas we have these days" for more than 40 years, starting long before there was any E10. I am convinced that, at least sometimes, it is a convenient excuse by a mechanic who has no clue what really caused the problem.

I will say that when I rebuild carburetors on my small engines today, I don't see varnish or other deposits inside them- ever. 20+ years ago, it was common to find varnish deposits in carbs. It's said the ethanol in E10 cleans out fuel system deposits and I can't deny that based on what I see.

I recall one episode with a Stihl leaf blower. Ran great when I was using Stihl 2-stroke oil. Then, the Stihl dealer convinced me to switch to Stihl "synthetic" 2-stroke oil. Blower stopped running after less than a gallon of fuel mixed with that great "synthetic" oil, carb filter screen was totally plugged with some kind of junk. I went back to conventional Stihl oil, no more problems. Maybe the "synthetic" oil didn't like the Stabil I always use in small engine fuel, who knows- or cares? Stihl dealer said it was caused by "the bad gas we have these days". I doubt the gasoline had anything to do with it.

This week, I met a fellow-A-body owner at our local Advance Auto. He had the misfortune to install a fuel filter on his '69 Barracuda and used the fuel hose stubs provided with the filter. Those no-name hose stubs disintegrated within days, pumping rubber crumbs into his carb. I doubt it was an E10 issue- rather, lousy materials in the no-name made-in-china hose stubs. Frankly, selling ANY fuel system component today that cannot tolerate ethanol-blend fuels borders on criminal negligence. Yet, it happens.
 
That might happen in the future. Right now in North America we're gobbling up corn (food) to make ethanol, and it's a problem.

This years drought will tell the tail about using food for fuel. I wouldn't burn ethanol in my hot rod period. Many service stations continue to sell 91/93 octane with no ethanol added. JMO
 
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