Rhoads hyd flat tappet lifters setup confused?

Mopar Performance Issues

  1. LovetheA's

    LovetheA's FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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    I’m replacing my standard hyd mopar flat tappet lifters in my 383 with rhoads hyd flat tappet lifters. The installation directions are confusing to me at one point. It states to set them up by determining when the pushrods just start to compress down ever so slightly on the cup within the lifters ( approx 1/16 in). Then 1/2 turn to be sure to eliminate any remanding lash. Then lock down on adjustment nut. This seems logical and makes sense. What I’m confused about is it states not to soak or fill up the lifters with oil. If you don’t fill up or soak the lifters in oil how can you create resistance against the pushrod that is sufficient to set zero lash and lock down adjusting accordingly? Anyone have experience installing rhoads lifters?
    Carl
     
  2. RustyRatRod

    RustyRatRod I was born on a Monday. Not last Monday. FABO Gold Member

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    The lifters have a preload spring that plants the plunger up against the lifter body. They don't need oil. It used to be common to soak and or pump lifters full of oil before assembly. Over time, people discovered doing so sometimes resulted in the valves being help open on initial startup....sometimes engine damage can result. Install the lifters, assemble everything and start it up.
     
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    • LovetheA's

      LovetheA's FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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      Oh ok thanks Rusty I get it. I feel more comfortable following their instructions.
       
    • RustyRatRod

      RustyRatRod I was born on a Monday. Not last Monday. FABO Gold Member

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      If they tell you to pump the lifters up, that's incorrect and decades old advice. If that's what you're going to do anyway, why did you even ask for advice? Good luck however you do it.
       
    • Oldiron440

      Oldiron440 Well-Known Member

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      The lifters are a waste of money and time, IMO.
       
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      • RustyRatRod

        RustyRatRod I was born on a Monday. Not last Monday. FABO Gold Member

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        I tend to agree, but he asked. lol
         
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        • LovetheA's

          LovetheA's FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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          Rusty what are you talking about? I’m going to follow the instructions by Rhoads which says I don’t have to pump up or preload with oil before installation. That’s basically what you said isn’t it? You don’t have to pre-fill or soak them before installation. Now I understand why. I’m taking your advice am I missing something? Rhoads lifters are they a waste of money because they are junk? If that’s the case oh well I already bought them so I’ll have to give them a shot. I’m replacing my 20yr old Mopar performance hyd flat tappets because several are trashed. They won’t stay pumped up.
           
        • rumblefish360

          rumblefish360 So close, yet so far away FABO Gold Member

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          Just coat the lifters before installing.

          A lot of people bash the lifter because it makes cam timing shorter and creates a very wide lobe separation. Wide lobe separations kill bottom end torque as seen on a otherwise pair of cams ground with the same moves but at different degrees of separation. An example would be a cam ground on a 108 vs one ground on a 118.

          The lifters also have a auditable tick. This drives people crazy. I myself, well, IDGAF. It doesn’t bother me.

          The lifter box says it will increase torque, and it does by the reduction in duration. A lot of people use it as a band aid fix for the wrong cam. Or a wrong stall converter. Others try and use them to spread the cams power band as far as possible with these lifters ability to take out 10-15 degrees of duration. This can be advantageous for some. I’ve seen (heard talk at the meets) there use on the intake only and exhaust only as well.

          Why exhaust only? IDK...

          I’ve used them before and have had zero issues with them. They have always worked as designed & as stated by Rhodes. They are a good quality lifter.
           
        • krazykuda

          krazykuda Well-Known Member FABO Gold Member How-To Section Editor

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          I like Rhoades lifters and have run them for decades...

          You either like them or not.. I like them...
           
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          • RustyRatRod

            RustyRatRod I was born on a Monday. Not last Monday. FABO Gold Member

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            Well, you left that part out and the cats knocked my crystal ball off and broke it a long time ago, so I don't know what Rhoads says and I'm not goin diggin. No, you haven't missed anything. You just left out "what" Rhoads recommended. That's all. Just out of curiosity, what camshaft do you have? Rhoads lifters can work well......even though I've never been crazy about them, but I wouldn't use them in anything under about 230@ .050. They'll really not net you much "there".
             
          • RustyRatRod

            RustyRatRod I was born on a Monday. Not last Monday. FABO Gold Member

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            I actually do......just not on "smallish" cams. I really like the V-Max though. Those can turn one on.
             
          • krazykuda

            krazykuda Well-Known Member FABO Gold Member How-To Section Editor

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            I liked the Vmax also... The way you set them up by bottoming the plunger and then setting the lash seems like it will give more accurate lift than the standard Rhoades...
             
          • krazykuda

            krazykuda Well-Known Member FABO Gold Member How-To Section Editor

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            I liked them in my 340 S with the 484/284 purple shaft cam....

            With standard lifters it idled very choppy at 1100 RPM, after installing a set of Rhoades lifters I had it idling at 800 RPM much smoother...

            The guy taking these pictures of it didn't wait long enough into the burnout, he just caught the beginning.... (It was his first time seeing that car do a burnout and he didn't know what to expect)...

            Barracuda 1.jpg

            Barracuda 2.jpg
             
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            • rumblefish360

              rumblefish360 So close, yet so far away FABO Gold Member

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              I thought those instructions were odd.
              But whatever they say.
               
            • krazykuda

              krazykuda Well-Known Member FABO Gold Member How-To Section Editor

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              If I remember correctly, you bottomed out the plunger, then backed off to the recommended clearance... That will make sure that there is not too much 'slop' in them....
               
            • rumblefish360

              rumblefish360 So close, yet so far away FABO Gold Member

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              To bottom out a lifter.... is weird.
               
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              • trapster

                trapster Well-Known Member

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                I like them in my 284/484 purple in my 340 also.
                 
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                • RammerJammer75

                  RammerJammer75 Well-Known Member

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                  I will add that you should prime the oil system after the installation. I don't have any complaints about the Rhoads I have.
                   
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                  • CFD244

                    CFD244 FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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                    Does this advice apply to ALL hydraulic lifters?
                     
                  • rumblefish360

                    rumblefish360 So close, yet so far away FABO Gold Member

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                    Yes
                     
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                    • LovetheA's

                      LovetheA's FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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                      My cam in my 383 engine right now is the old Mopar purple cam? 284/484. Maybe it will help somewhat. I always thought the cam though not ground breaking was a good solid hp and torque producer.
                       
                    • RustyRatRod

                      RustyRatRod I was born on a Monday. Not last Monday. FABO Gold Member

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                      Yes. It's also acceptable to assemble the engine, adjust the valves, or tighten down and then prime the oiling system as a whole. Just don't pump the lifters up first and install them.
                       
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                      • RustyRatRod

                        RustyRatRod I was born on a Monday. Not last Monday. FABO Gold Member

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                        I really like the old MP grinds a lot. People can trash them all they want but they flat out work. Yes, that cam has enough duration @ .050 that the Rhoads lifters would probably be of benefit to help pump bottom end torque up. You'll lose some idle characteristics, though and don't forget, those lifters do produce a ticking noise under normal circumstances.
                         
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                        • RustyRatRod

                          RustyRatRod I was born on a Monday. Not last Monday. FABO Gold Member

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                          They can work very well in the right circumstances.
                           
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                          • oldkimmer

                            oldkimmer FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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                            I’ve used them a few times. I like them. Kim
                             
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