RHS headed 410 sb UPDATE!

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Now now, everyone be nice...Anyways, POS please post pics of these heads and rocker gear! I'm anxiously waiting...I can't wait to get myself a set of these heads and hughes rockers for my 318!!! I also want a solid flat tappet cam to go with it! I'm working my butt off on a side job with my old man...600 bucks a week, so I'll have to work about 3 more weeks to have enough saved up!
 
Is this 410 main studded, or is it using bolts?

What is the threshhold for using bolts vs studs in the context of this remaining a non nitroused motor?

Anyone? Facts based on experience?
I ask because I see a lot of engines like this using ARP bolts and the boogie man has not gotten anyone yet.
 
This thread has been cleaned up 3 times now. Please dont make me lock or delete a thread that started off with good info. If you cant get a long with other members there is an ignore feature, Use it.
 

POS Dakota said:
Is this 410 main studded, or is it using bolts?

What is the threshhold for using bolts vs studs in the context of this remaining a non nitroused motor?

Anyone? Facts based on experience?
I ask because I see a lot of engines like this using ARP bolts and the boogie man has not gotten anyone yet.
Click to expand...

I really don't think you would have a problem running main bolts.
Maybe above 550hp you could consider them, and even then more build/rpm etc details are necessary in making that choice.jmo

I say this, though not the same animal-rod ration/angularity at 90*& 4'' swing'n around..., I've run stock 1970 main cap bolts to 7200 rpm numerous times with my 340, no problems.
 
I use main studs on all my 4" arm engines. I also line bore/hone every build regardless of displacement. I've never had a failure or had signs of bearing pinching or cap walk this way. My feeling is the caps are not that bad, but the fasteners are plain, and I'm asking the block struecture to do domething it was never designed to do. So "every little bit helps". I also think some of the cheap crank failures can be attributed to cut corners on machining and block prep. If the block is solid, the foundation's solid, and the crank doesnt have to bend in the confines of the block. If not, the crank has to flex in order just to do it's job. As I havent ever not used them on one I can't say if that is fact or not. But I can read the signs of cap walk and deformation. I've seen it on stock 340s and 360s on teardown. So I guess that's more of an opinion.
 
moper said:
I use main studs on all my 4" arm engines. I also line bore/hone every build regardless of displacement. I've never had a failure or had signs of bearing pinching or cap walk this way. My feeling is the caps are not that bad, but the fasteners are plain, and I'm asking the block struecture to do domething it was never designed to do. So "every little bit helps". I also think some of the cheap crank failures can be attributed to cut corners on machining and block prep. If the block is solid, the foundation's solid, and the crank doesnt have to bend in the confines of the block. If not, the crank has to flex in order just to do it's job. As I havent ever not used them on one I can't say if that is fact or not. But I can read the signs of cap walk and deformation. I've seen it on stock 340s and 360s on teardown. So I guess that's more of an opinion.
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Moper is absolutely right..i know the gentleman that assembles my engines won't build without studs or line-honing the block which if fine with me,just gives me more confidence in him,and seeing as he been building motors longer then most of you have been alive i trust his work...i think the guys on the east coast doing things different/better..:-D:-D
 
ou812 said:
Electric water pump, 950Hp carb, hyd. roller cam with around .630 lift at the valve, minor intake manifold porting.
I would expect maybe 50HP or more from those changes. I'll be testing the water pump and 950HP in a week or two.
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Please Do keep us posted, And... THX for the info. IMHO, Excellent work!!
 
My personal feeling is in general and overall, the northeast has had the highest number of good machinists for the longest overall time. With all the defense contractors and stuff... General Electric(subs), Sikorsky, Kaman Corp, Pratt and Whitney, ABB/Combustion Engineering, Colt, the Springfield Armory... All those historically technical machinist business are within 2hrs drive of each other here. I know farmers with turret lathes, horizontal millers, Tig welders, and Bridgeports in their hobby shops. I have four friends who are non automotive machinists, two are second generation. Nevermind the six or eight that are automotive machinists that are around here. It's like southern race car drivers, and west cost surfers....lol.
 
ou812 said:
Electric water pump, 950Hp carb, hyd. roller cam with around .630 lift at the valve, minor intake manifold porting.
I would expect maybe 50HP or more from those changes. I'll be testing the water pump and 950HP in a week or two.
Click to expand...
I,ll be running a AED HO850 dp carb.(flows 930 cfm) witha solid roller cam .631 lift 252,258 with the Eddy RPM,s P&P,1 7/8 headers,4500 stall Coan t. convertor.Definetly shooting for 10.5.I wish I had known about the RHS heads before purchasing the Eddy,s,but I got a deal on them OTB so threw some extra $$$ for P&P.Will be watching for your results Brian!:thumbrig::read2:

P.S this is a stroked 408(410)
 
Brian,

Thank you so much for the info! I was originally going to keep the 360 in my RC I just built and build a big block for the Duster, but I after reading your review and the article in Engine Masters and weighing the costs of such a plan, I have now decided to build a 360 stroker torque monster using these heads purchased from you on another block I have laying around. This will also be roller cammed/fuel injected and swapped in to the truck and I'll pull the 360, put a bigger cam in it and drop it in the Duster and save the big block build for the future.

This way I can save big money and have both on the road much sooner.
 
moper said:
My personal feeling is in general and overall, the northeast has had the highest number of good machinists for the longest overall time. With all the defense contractors and stuff... General Electric(subs), Sikorsky, Kaman Corp, Pratt and Whitney, ABB/Combustion Engineering, Colt, the Springfield Armory... All those historically technical machinist business are within 2hrs drive of each other here. I know farmers with turret lathes, horizontal millers, Tig welders, and Bridgeports in their hobby shops. I have four friends who are non automotive machinists, two are second generation. Nevermind the six or eight that are automotive machinists that are around here. It's like southern race car drivers, and west cost surfers....lol.
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This is the most ***-o-9 opinion I've ever heard.
There is as much if not more tech here on the west coast.
We started this country at one end and moved to the other and if you think things did not get better over that time.....poor you for selling your own country men short.

You widen the gap between us, instead of bringing us together, why?

btw, I have friends with in home machine shops too, woopie doo!

Really though.. this more of you trying to sell yourself and your expensive machinist.

not only are your posts long winded to distract...there's no fact connected.. just fear... and spoke like a politician, that makes sense, are you a lawyer too?

You check/meassure the block and do what needs to be done, not random over building/spending so you sleep at night...thats a rich mans problem.

..you said you seen cap walk on stock 340/360?
WE ARE NOT TALKING STOCK


BTW I've been to the east, indianapolis/walton/logansport/tenn/florida

Thats where my family is from..and if you bad mouth guys mouth here like that..know you are badmouthing your own.

I've never read such crap on this site before.
 
those who know anything about automtive machining/building know moper and his opinion are biased.


this thread was really good too...

but every 'know it all' here wants to take over.....why?


I really believe that they are jealous of brian and his success, weather it be cause he was in carcraft & they are not ?, or simply cause he's a west coast guy.


this depressing and a disservice to this site and it's great members from the east and the west.
 
POS Dakota said:
Is this 410 main studded, or is it using bolts?

What is the threshhold for using bolts vs studs in the context of this remaining a non nitroused motor?

Anyone? Facts based on experience?
I ask because I see a lot of engines like this using ARP bolts and the boogie man has not gotten anyone yet.
Click to expand...

There are good machinist in every corner of the country. To think otherwise is ill-informed and quite frankly elitist.

To get this back on track...

Brian's 410 has bolts in it.
 
crackedback said:
There are good machinist in every corner of the country. To think otherwise is ill-informed and quite frankly elitist.

To get this back on track...

Brian's 410 has bolts in it.
Click to expand...

I'm surrounded by great machinists here in the detroit area.
machine shops are literally all over. Some very well known ones too.


But yeah the 410 having bolts...that's why I asked. I dont think bolts are a problem, or that studs do anything to stop cap walk...if that is a problem at all in whatever case. I think it's not as bad as it's made out to be.

if my 360 lived through millions of 150, and even a 175 shot on occasion with the stock bolts when making 340 whp by itself, I'm just having a hard time with why I would need studs on a 408 I don't plan on using nitrous with...
 
POS Dakota said:
I'm surrounded by great machinists here in the detroit area.
machine shops are literally all over. Some very well known ones too.


But yeah the 410 having bolts...that's why I asked. I dont think bolts are a problem, or that studs do anything to stop cap walk...if that is a problem at all in whatever case. I think it's not as bad as it's made out to be.

if my 360 lived through millions of 150, and even a 175 shot on occasion with the stock bolts when making 340 whp by itself, I'm just having a hard time with why I would need studs on a 408 I don't plan on using nitrous with...
Click to expand...

You don't, but if your motors detonate like someone elses...that would explain the notion.
It sounds like you know what you are doing and can tune, so you'll be fine.:cheers:
 
1wild&crazyguy said:
This is the most ***-o-9 opinion I've ever heard.
There is as much if not more tech here on the west coast.
We started this country at one end and moved to the other and if you think things did not get better over that time.....poor you for selling your own country men short.

You widen the gap between us, instead of bringing us together, why?

btw, I have friends with in home machine shops too, woopie doo!

Really though.. this more of you trying to sell yourself and your expensive machinist.

not only are your posts long winded to distract...there's no fact connected.. just fear... and spoke like a politician, that makes sense, are you a lawyer too?

You check/meassure the block and do what needs to be done, not random over building/spending so you sleep at night...thats a rich mans problem.

..you said you seen cap walk on stock 340/360?
WE ARE NOT TALKING STOCK


BTW I've been to the east, indianapolis/walton/logansport/tenn/florida

Thats where my family is from..and if you bad mouth guys mouth here like that..know you are badmouthing your own.

I've never read such crap on this site before.
Click to expand...

Geography WASN'T your strong point in school was it?? Indiana and Tenn. are NOT on the east coast:read2::read2::read2:
 
I really believe that they are jealous of brian and his success, weather it be cause he was in carcraft & they are not ?,
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Carcraft or any other magazine out there is in the business to sell their product,they'll print whatever they think people will believe,to get them to buy,including inflating numbers..Jealous of Brian??..don't even know him,but i did offer to try a set of those "super duper" rhs heads on my motor to see how they compare to my Edelbrocks,and i'd split the shipping.. if they work as well "as claimed" i might buy a set for my next build he declined..hmm wonder why??....
 
stroked 340 said:
Geography WASN'T your strong point in school was it?? Indiana and Tenn. are NOT on the east coast:read2::read2::read2:
Click to expand...
The places that he'd mentioned are, in fact, to the east of his location. If he said anything about the east coast, feel free to point it out. I've somehow missed it.
 
1wild&crazyguy said:
You don't, but if your motors detonate like someone elses...that would explain the notion.
It sounds like you know what you are doing and can tune, so you'll be fine.:cheers:
Click to expand...

There's this revolutionary tool I discovered years back. It's called a magnifying glass...with it one can closely look at their plugs for traces of detonation and make necessary adjustments to avert it.

IMO it's the only reason people break cranks and lift caps, with one exception being eagle cast cranks possibly being doo doo.
If you dont have detonation a nice ARP main bolt will be more than up to the task I would imagine. Like I said earlier. I was running the stock bolts using all that nitrous and no indications there was any movement of the caps that I could see. Now you can have an r block, God's handcrafted bryant billet crank etc, and detonation will destroy everything. Seen it time and time again when someone tells me "this thing is bulletproof!". I kind of chuckle because it's only bulletproof until it detonates...just the same as a stock block with bolts and a cast crank.

I just wonder why I hear the stud debate repeated all the time though. I always ask when I see it mentioned, but the only answer I ever get is "more uniform clamping force"...whatever that is. And no one can ever elaborate on how that actually happens, or why in a lot of cases it's even necessary.

One of the things I like studs for though is cylinder heads. Not because I think they help save head gaskets (I dont blow head gaskets either. never have), but because I can drop the gasket over the studs, the head right after it, and torque everything down a lot easier. but bolts do the job there too.

Of course, I am not a machinist, and I don't own a shop. I havent built 1000 engines in my time either so I won't say I am the mopar dalai lama, but these are just my observations.
 
I went with main studs and a line hone because it it strengthens the bottom end and does not cost that much more. I consulted with engine experts that I trusted and went with what they said. Since I don't build engines for a living and am not an expert I felt that following the advice of people I trusted and had a proven track record was a good idea.
 
stroked 340 said:
i did offer to try a set of those "super duper" rhs heads on my motor to see how they compare to my Edelbrocks,and i'd split the shipping.. if they work as well "as claimed" i might buy a set for my next build he declined..hmm wonder why??....
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Really?!? You wonder why he didn't send you a set of his heads for you to try out? Nice of you to offer to split the shipping though.

I don't have a dog in this fight, but some of you have really ruined a perfectly good thread.
 
doktor_x said:
The places that he'd mentioned are, in fact, to the east of his location. If he said anything about the east coast, feel free to point it out. I've somehow missed it.
Click to expand...

Sorry i'm from the east coast where east means on the coast to us..geez,didn't know you were his big brother...
 
1wild, dude, you think my opinion's wrong. I'm sorry... I dont care, but I feel sorry for your lack of historical knowledge of how this country and the Industrial Revolution occured. Now, in respect for the spirit of this thread, I'm done.
 
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