Small Bolt Pattern Wheels Don't Fit Wilwood Disc Conversion

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CaseyW

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I purchased the Wilwood Front Disc conversion for A-bodies with 9" drums. Talked with PST and they said the kit should fit with my wheels. I have 15" Steel Vintique Wheels with SBP. The problem is when I tried to put the wheel back on after installing the disc brake kit, the hole in the center of the wheel is not large enough to fit over the Wilwood hub. The diameter of the hole on the wheel is about 2 1/4" and the hub tapers to around 3". They include a 2mil spacer, but I can't even get the lugs through the bolt holes. Do SBP wheels even exist with a 3" center hole? I called a machine shop and they said around $250 to make the center hole larger on my current wheels. That seems like a lot of $ and i'm not sure if that would compromise the integrity of the wheel.
 
I went out and checked a 4.5" wide and 5.5" wide 14" SBP factory wheel. Both have a 2-1/4" hole.
 
That is the reason I could not use Wilwood disc conversion on my 9" front as the wheel centre is not large to get Wilwood in.
 
The hubs on these cars was meant to support the wheel. The lug nuts were intended to hold the wheel to the hub. Somewhere along the way, aftermarket companies started selling wheels that had a center hole (Hub register) LARGER than the hub. Why? This was done as a cost cutting move. They made what they considered a "universal" wheel center that only needed wheel lug holes drilled to be model specific.
Wheels that rely entirely on the lug nuts to support the vehicle do work but are not optimal.
Oddly, Wilwood went the OTHER direction with yours, huh? They used the larger hub probably to use a larger wheel bearing. Your options are limited. This sucks.
 
I had issues with my SSBC disc brake conversion also. I "overlooked" the little asterisk on their website at the bottom of the page that said "must use 15 inch wheels". Hey guess what, 69 Darts never came with 15 inch wheels. So my complaint was and still is with these "conversion kits" is why not make a true conversion kit that fits the way the factory disc brakes did with the 14 inch wheels. On my setup, the calipers rubbed the inside radius of the wheel because the 11 in rotor places the caliper out just far enough to rub. So I had to polish off the lead ins and the exit sides of the calipers to take care of the rub. I called SSBC and they said our kits will only work with 15 inch wheels. No sense explaining to the guy about A bodies never having 15 in. wheels from the factory and his kits were supposed to be a bolt in ready to go kit. I told him that the factory disc brake setup used 14 inch wheels with no problems so why couldn't they have used the same size rotors so there wouldn't have been an issue. He basically said that's they way they build theirs and they haven't heard of any issues before me. BS! I made mine work but only after some serious grinding and polishing. For the money, I wasn't happy.
 
Been here ... done that .. and bag of chips...........i TRIED making SBP wheels fit on Wildwood conversion ... = NOT .... tried ralleys.. steelies ... etc..........end of the day... stockton made me 15 inch steelies 15 X 5.5.... and they barely cleared ........
 
CaseyW said:
I purchased the Wilwood Front Disc conversion for A-bodies with 9" drums. Talked with PST and they said the kit should fit with my wheels. I have 15" Steel Vintique Wheels with SBP. The problem is when I tried to put the wheel back on after installing the disc brake kit, the hole in the center of the wheel is not large enough to fit over the Wilwood hub. The diameter of the hole on the wheel is about 2 1/4" and the hub tapers to around 3". They include a 2mil spacer, but I can't even get the lugs through the bolt holes. Do SBP wheels even exist with a 3" center hole? I called a machine shop and they said around $250 to make the center hole larger on my current wheels. That seems like a lot of $ and i'm not sure if that would compromise the integrity of the wheel.
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1) IS the hub configured w/the SBP ?
2) Is the hub fitted with 1/2" or 7/16" studs?
3) There is no "just removing 3/4" from the center" of a steel rim. The rolled hub ring will be completely removed, and one from a wheel that fits welded in, or fabbed from scratch.
I certainly wouldn't do it for any less. Yes, if One were to just chuck up the rim & cut the center out w/o doing this, the integrity of the rim is compromised. The problem is if You
do the math, 4"-3"=1" & /2= .5" from the center of the stud hole to the new ID, w/a 1/2" hole that only leaves 1/4" of meat & no room for a lip & barely a socket over the nuts.
4) Every wheel is different, I'm sure calipers clear certain 15" rims, but not all....of course the spacer sounds like they knew they were tight & needed.
5) What ride is this & what is the intended usage for it? You may have to sw. to LBP, but why they would even sell those this way....................
 
yes they will clear 15 inch wheels ... but i don't know about SBP 15 inch wheels ...
 
g413 said:
I went out and checked a 4.5" wide and 5.5" wide 14" SBP factory wheel. Both have a 2-1/4" hole.
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From my understanding all SBP wheels have the 2 1/4" center hole. When speaking with PST, they assured me the wheels would fit as long as they were 15", not mentioning anything about the center hole needing to be 3". Having contacted them again to ask them about this, they said I should be using OEM SBP 15" wheels and they will have the center hole of 3". I asked, where do I get those...
 
djais1801 said:
would going to LBP fix that?
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The center hole on the LBP wheel that is similar to mine, the ones Wheel Vintiques sells, only has a center hole of 2 7/8, so I'm not sure if that would work seeing as the diagram states it needs to be 3.01". I measured the wilwood hub and it appears to be only 2 3/4", but it was tough to measure accurately as my caliper isn't that deep. The other problem is that my rear wheels would still be SBP and it wouldn't be able to rotate the tires.
 
Killer6 said:
1) IS the hub configured w/the SBP ?
2) Is the hub fitted with 1/2" or 7/16" studs?
3) There is no "just removing 3/4" from the center" of a steel rim. The rolled hub ring will be completely removed, and one from a wheel that fits welded in, or fabbed from scratch.
I certainly wouldn't do it for any less. Yes, if One were to just chuck up the rim & cut the center out w/o doing this, the integrity of the rim is compromised. The problem is if You
do the math, 4"-3"=1" & /2= .5" from the center of the stud hole to the new ID, w/a 1/2" hole that only leaves 1/4" of meat & no room for a lip & barely a socket over the nuts.
4) Every wheel is different, I'm sure calipers clear certain 15" rims, but not all....of course the spacer sounds like they knew they were tight & needed.
5) What ride is this & what is the intended usage for it? You may have to sw. to LBP, but why they would even sell those this way....................
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The hub can be configured for SBP or LBP, both holes are drilled
7/16" studs
The caliper isn't the issue, its the center hole
It's a 3 day a week driver/commuter. Rebuilt slant 6 with a 3 spd so nothing crazy or even mildly crazy. My whole point to them is, why sell it as compatible with SBP if there isn't a SBP wheel that exists that will fit? I mean you could have custom wheel built, but why have SBP custom wheels built? The marketing of this is very deceptive, and drilling the extra holes in their hubs seems like extra work if they aren't going to be used.
 
Are you saying you purchased a SBP wildwood kit ?......do you have the p/n kit ?... did your get the directly from Wildwood ?... I never knew that a SBP wildwood kit was available ???
 
rrvolare said:
Are you saying you purchased a SBP wildwood kit ?......do you have the p/n kit ?... did your get the directly from Wildwood ?... I never knew that a SBP wildwood kit was available ???
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I purchased through PST, because of the discount and the board sponsorship and because they said they would work. It is available, but I've found no SBP wheel that will work. Kit was Kit (DBK-11022-D)
 
IF you talk to any Customer wheel builder .. EX: Stockton... they will tell you that you do not need to make any CENTER WHEEL HUB to rotor contact .. the studs is what centers the wheel when bolted down to rotor face ... How much material needs to be removed to give you the clearance you need ?
 
rrvolare said:
IF you talk to any Customer wheel builder .. EX: Stockton... they will tell you that you do not need to make any CENTER WHEEL HUB to rotor contact .. the studs is what centers the wheel when bolted down to rotor face ... How much material needs to be removed to give you the clearance you need ?
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To go from 2 1/4" diameter to 3" diameter, i believe they would need to take off 3/8" all away around which would remove the lip of the wheel that I've heard gives a good deal of structure and rigidity to the wheel
 
rrvolare said:
IF you talk to any Customer wheel builder .. EX: Stockton... they will tell you that you do not need to make any CENTER WHEEL HUB to rotor contact .. the studs is what centers the wheel when bolted down to rotor face ... How much material needs to be removed to give you the clearance you need ?
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Stockton Wheel can eat my ***. If the center hub size is not important, why does every automaker design them to have a snug fit to the wheels? This is known as "Hub Centric".
Again, it is the center hub register that centers the wheels. The lugs retain the wheel.
Yes, I have used wheels with a large hub hole that only use the lugs and nuts to locate the wheel. These are known as "Lug Centric". Yes, they do work but you are giving up a great feature by using them.
Also, the Mopar big bolt pattern used a hub size of 2.81 inches, slightly less than 2.875" which is 2 7/8."
 
CaseyW said:
From my understanding all SBP wheels have the 2 1/4" center hole. When speaking with PST, they assured me the wheels would fit as long as they were 15", not mentioning anything about the center hole needing to be 3". Having contacted them again to ask them about this, they said I should be using OEM SBP 15" wheels and they will have the center hole of 3". I asked, where do I get those...
Click to expand...
LOL!! In the land of buxom fairies & everlasting lollipops that bring good health & immortality!!
1) SBP is 2 5/16", LBP is 2 13/16", the rims are not a press-fit obviously, and slightly oversize .010-.020". SBP wheels are~2.32-2.33" & LBP are~2.82"(FORD 4.5"BP rim~2.78")
2) There are rims designed to be lug-centric, but not OE steel rims w/the center cut out! Unless they're Magnums,Pontiac & Olds style Ralley wheels etc. designed to be, they're not
3) Sorry, I was addressing 416stroker about the calipers, but how do you know? You haven't gotten Your rims on yet to see, sooo......maybe-maybe not.
4) OK, crazy driving or not I would NOT just cut the center out of a set of SBP steel rims to do this. Anybody saying otherwise is giving poor advice. The only way I could see
doing that safely would be to add a "back-up" plate w/the pattern drilled thru welded to the rim at both inside & outside circumference. It could be done if done right. Not an
inexpensive job for sure, but the only way to keep the SBP & wheels you're using, of course the rears would not be setting tight on the register w/o a hub ring.
 
aren't the studs 1/2 instead of 7/16 on that set up too? i think they really dropped the ball designing that kit.
 
CaseyW said:
d

Damn it... I just went out and checked and they are 1/2" :(
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That's what I figured, & why I asked, however that's the least of the deal-breakers going on here. Bumping up the holes in the rim that bit w/a full taper lug nut should work fine.
Everything else however..........................it seems people are always willing to sell You what You want, whether they have it or not................................
 
Killer6 said:
That's what I figured, & why I asked, however that's the least of the deal-breakers going on here. Bumping up the holes in the rim that bit w/a full taper lug nut should work fine.
Everything else however..........................it seems people are always willing to sell You what You want, whether they have it or not................................
Click to expand...
I was speaking with PST today, they kept insisting this kit had been used for 20 years by Wilwood with no problem..., and the reason it's not working for me is I don't have factory 15" SBP wheels with a 3" center hole. I then told him that those were never produced, SBP wheels have 2 1/4" center holes and even LBP wheels don't have a 3" center hole. I then added what you brought up, the studs being the wrong size for SBP wheels. This seemed to finally make it click with him that Wilwood was full of it saying this would work with SBP wheels. He said he would follow-up again with Wilwood engineering.
 
ok,..take the wildwood hubs off,..take to a machine shop have them chuck them in a lath and turn down the lip the wheels wont fit over,..then ream your lug holes out so your 1/2 studs fit,..then go buy 10 more 1/2 inch studs and ream out your rear hubs n wheels so youll have all 4 the same for rotation...the devil is in the details but this seems to be easyest cheapest and safest way to get you threw this conundrum!
 
i'd send that garbage back, get my money refunded then go buy a set of KH factory disc brakes. then i know it will work and won't have to modify my wheels and it will be safe..
 
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