small pole barn advice

Shop, Garage and Tools

  1. mopardude318

    mopardude318 Well-Known Member

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    So I'm building a 24x24x10' tall pole barn with a 6&12 pitch roof. I just barely cleared an area and did the layout. I'm undecided if I should leave the ground as is and do a gravel floor, or do a concrete slab. If I do a slab, which I really do want, the elevation rises 2 feet from right to the left. So if I want to level, would it be best to remove a foot from one side and add a foot to the other? Just trying to get ideas. :) I intend to use a total of 8-8x8's for the sides, leaving the front & back open.
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    This is the area I'm working with.

    IMG_1508.jpg

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    IMG_1505.jpg

    Falls 1 foot over the span of 8 feet, but 2 feet total from right to left over 24 feet.

    IMG_1506.jpg
     
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    • jimmer

      jimmer Well-Known Member

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      you can use material you have or bring in more material.
      you want it to be pretty close to flat , with a little slope toward the front.
      Am I reading your post right ?
      You want to use 8x8 posts ?
      If that's the case you only need 6x6 green treated . Here in Washington they need to be buried 4 feet in the ground. Not sure where you are ?
      I would definitely poor concrete for floor.
      Best of luck with the shop !!
       
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      • dukeboy_318

        dukeboy_318 FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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        plus 1 for concrete. Dont get the cheap concrete either, get the high tensile fiber crete, it'll last much longer. We've have it in our big tractor shed now for 22 years and have had over 45,000 pound vehicles on it and not a single crack
         
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        • spl440

          spl440 Everybody's Fool FABO Gold Member

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          Normally concrete is poured on fresh cut earth, nothing back filled, that way very little settling. So concrete doesn't crack, and not sure of the size, but will need an expansion joint once it gets to a certain size.
           
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          • jimmer

            jimmer Well-Known Member

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            it is common practice to add sand and at times rock and fill under concrete.
            All concrete guys have compact plates as well as some have jumping Jack compactor.
            Any skilled concrete guy will lead you in the right direction.
            Expansion joints are not the only factor in cracking , rebar , concrete type, weather and thickness all play a part.
            The comment about the mix is correct, the mix with mesh embedded also helps with strength and cracking.
             
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            • roccodart440

              roccodart440 Well-Known Member

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              slab for sure.

              And I'd go bigger than 24x24 if you plan to do anything in there. 2 cars and tool boxes on the front wall and you can't even breath in a 24x24.
               
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              • adriver

                adriver Blazing Apostle

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                How long are you going to live. (Attempted humor)
                Point being is that there are only two types of concrete.
                Wire will help any that does crack from separating.
                Been almost 20 years on mine.
                I see two hairlines just now starting.
                Poured over fill and gravel.

                Rock now concrete later?
                 
              • RPMagoo

                RPMagoo Just An Old Motorhead

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                -- I agree. My garage is 28 X 40, and that is adequate, but I'd like it bigger. I was constrained by the size of the area.
                 
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                • rustycowll69

                  rustycowll69 Well-Known Member

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                  when I worked as a surveyor, the City of Seattle tried to make their slabs less than 150 Sq ft, usually 12x12. They used smooth tie-bars between slabs to keep slabs from rocking independently from adjacent slabs, yet still allowing for expansion and contraction. They didn't use screen to hold the individual slabs together, but then they were pouring them a foot thick. LOL.
                  If it were me, I'd use the 4'x8' 6"x6" welded wire mats for reinforcement, and like what was suggested don't move the dirt and use it as fill, use new crushed rock, and well-compacted for all of your sub grade.
                   
                • Dartnut

                  Dartnut Don't hate me because i'm beautiful

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                  I used to work at a concrete plant during my late teens/late twenties and saw my fair share of job sites and contractors.
                  That being said, we would always recommend that if the ground was disturbed, it would be prepared with a compacted base of at least 6'' of 3/4'' minus crush gravel as a base and 3/8'' by 12" in a grid rebar for a shop floor minimum. I wouldn't use mesh unless it was for a sidewalk personally.
                  Get the highest strength concrete you can afford with a 4 to 6 inch slump.
                  Don't allow them to soup it up (add extra water) so it flows easier and is easier to move.
                  The fiber in the concrete works well too, we did it a few times, but not often.
                  It was mostly used in government work for bridges of some people that had heavy duty machinery moved on it. (Read D8 Cats and the sort in a shop).
                  I think it's overkill in your case.
                  And most of all, order enough to do the job completely, you don't want to fill in some areas with rocks to make up the shortfall, or have them batch half of a yard and have extra delivery fees added!
                  Yes, i've seen it all!
                   
                  Last edited: Oct 6, 2017
                • YY1

                  YY1 Well-Known Member

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                  Do you have an extra $10,000 for the slab?

                  If you haven't priced concrete work in a while, you may be in for a shock.
                   
                • dodgedifferent2

                  dodgedifferent2 Well-Known Member

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                  Build the base UP.
                  add material.
                  If the concrete guys want 1 foot of gravel add 2 more feet. You want water to flow out of the shop ... not in.
                  We poured a foot thick floor in our tractor maintenance shop. With wire mesh to keep things solid.
                  Floor has been there since just before I could remember anything. Probably about 32 years
                   
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                  • 4spdragtop

                    4spdragtop CONGRATS NORTH AMERICA! FABO Gold Member

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                    You could do your post and structure and put a "base/floor" of limestone screenings in there and pour concrete later if you decide to.
                    I wanted to do almost the same thing. Simply for storage.
                    Good luck
                    10 years ago it cost $1500 to have concrete poured. Dad n I did the excavation and forming.
                     
                  • dukeboy_318

                    dukeboy_318 FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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                    yep if you do the work yourself, can save a ton!


                    Not sure what concrete is in your area, I had it quoted last month locally at 125 a yard delivered and that's for the fibercrete, 110 for standard. Just to give one an idea, if you go 24 feet by 24 feet, by 6 inches thick, that's 10.9 yards, call it 11. Looking at roughly 1400 bucks in concrete alone, that's if one does all the prep work and pouring work themselves to where all the truck does is pour.
                     
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                    • mopowers

                      mopowers Well-Known Member

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                      What will the pole barn be used for???
                       
                    • Tooljunkie

                      Tooljunkie King of cobble/master of the broken bolt FABO Gold Member

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                      If you are planning to use it before the slab gets poured, stay away from limestone. Not good for storage buildings.
                       
                    • Yote

                      Yote Well-Known Member

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                      If the added cost is not an issue I would recommend pouring a concrete stem wall. You can always use a gravel floor and change to concrete at a later time. I agree on bigger if you can, I don't think you would regret it years down the road.
                      Yote
                       
                    • 4spdragtop

                      4spdragtop CONGRATS NORTH AMERICA! FABO Gold Member

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                      Why not limestone? Too acidic? I see a few driveways with it. Dusty as shit tho.

                      Up here 600 sq ft max for concrete pad. Anything above that requires an engineered stamp
                       
                    • breakstuff

                      breakstuff Well-Known Member

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                      Go bigger. I went 24x40 for my two daily drivers and my 72 challenger. Well 2 darts, a duster, my dually and my challenger later.... im out of space. My theory is..... have one toy, but plan for 5.
                       
                    • mopardude318

                      mopardude318 Well-Known Member

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                      Sure I can downgrade to 6x6 as well. Even 4x6. I can't go too much bigger than 24x24 in the area I have chosen. I am set on using a 6/12 pitch roof because I had custom made 4"x6" x1/4" thick steel brackets in that pitch given to me for free that I would like to use. If I were to have these brackets made, I'm sure it would be an easy $2000 bucks. A 10 foot tall wall would mean the ridge would be 16 feet high. I am out in the country, permits do not apply, but I will do it right.

                      Gentlemen, I had intended on building this barn to store my new tractor and implements. A concrete floor would be nice so I dont have to roll around in the gravel. lol.

                      IMG_0654.jpg

                      [​IMG]

                      I have another plan for a 28x32 on the other side of the house for a shop, for the cars and what not. But that is next year. I want to get my tractor out of the sun. lol
                       
                      Last edited: Oct 7, 2017
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                      • halifaxhops

                        halifaxhops It's going to get stupid around here! FABO Gold Member

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                        Have them level it and do yourself a favor put lines under for water and a drain, that's my biggest regret on my 40x40. Also make sure you have a deep area of concrete for a lift! Just my 2 cents.
                         
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                        • barbee6043

                          barbee6043 barbee 6043 FABO Gold Member

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                          true! limestone draws moisture to everything in that building. NOT good for a car that sits in there. then put a cover over the car and in few years it will sit there and go from totally restored to piece of crap! had a buddy do that with a 67 hemi GTX!!!!! sad.
                           
                        • mopardude318

                          mopardude318 Well-Known Member

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                          Good thinking on the drain. ill do that.

                          This is kind of what I had in mind...I'd close off 2 or 3 sides, or all of them depending how I feel. lol

                          I realize the slab will be the most expensive. I'd like to do most of the forming/prep for it myself. I've done a few pads on flat ground, never on a slope.

                          IMG_1519.jpg

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                        • 12many

                          12many Well-Known Member

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                          Definitely use a powered compactor, the thickest vapor barrier you can, line the skirt/grade board with insulating foam board and cut plenty of expansion joints afterwards, along with using whatever rebar/mesh you can. If the concrete truck can back up right to the opening or if you can afford a pump your sure to get a higher psi mix, but if they have to use a buggy or similar I think the crews typically want the mix wetter (which yields a lower psi) to give them more time to work it. A good pour crew is key as I'm sure you're aware.
                           
                        • halifaxhops

                          halifaxhops It's going to get stupid around here! FABO Gold Member

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                          Make sure one area has at least six inches in case you ever get a lift. 3x3 area for each post is fine
                           
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